<p>None of you bothered ever to ask this question: did OP get into SMU, NUS or NTU? Because if she didn’t it’s not an option.</p>
<p>3 hour circle-there’s like 3 viable options within a 3 hour circle of my house.</p>
<p>I definitely think sending your kid to another country for four years of college is a HUGE decision. I can’t tell from the OP if her parents would have been fine with that had she gotten into Columbia or Penn and just are not with NYU or are against the entire US college situation for their D. I can respect if they do not want her to go to college abroad actually. But if they feel strongly about that, it would be been better that she had not applied, in my opinion. </p>
<p>Blossom, I get all your points about sub par programs and how many years it could take to graduate and so on and so forth. There are many considerations. I just did not give my kids any restrictions with college selection and I would have been happy to have paid for any of the schools on their list no matter their ranking. I didn’t think of any of the schools on their lists as sub par, I guess, and maybe that is the difference.</p>
<p>For that matter, I happen to think NYU/Stern is a great school.</p>
<p>Now that I’ve been rejected by Columbia and UPenn, my mother insists that she would have been more than glad to let me go to a more presitigious school with “lots of big names” coming out of it that costs about as much as NYU.</p>
<p>Also, it’s probably not fair to compare that parents in the US are unwilling to send their children more than a certain distance away to study. Singapore has a very high talent leak.</p>
<p>I have definitely showed my mother (note that it’s my mother whom I have a problem with, my dad, while also reluctant to let me go, has adopted a “let-her-do-whatever-she-want” and “don’t-ask-me-ask-your-mother” stance on this issue) statistics about the college’s superiority, but when I tried speaking to her formally about this she simply responded with a “Talking as if it’s scripted, huh.” I actually don’t think coming off as scripted is a bad thing - it implies that I’ve done my prep. So far it’s pretty hard to get through to her.</p>
<p>I have not been admitted to any local schools. I will be going for accountancy interviews to NTU and SMU on Thursday and Friday, and I’m not sure when I’ll find out when I’ll be accepted but most probably after the May 1st deadline. So far, my grades stand me a high chance of getting accepted (Singaporeans are all about grades) but I’m not sure about the interview - I haven’t had the time nor enthusiasm to prepare for it. As for NUS, my hopes of getting into NUS Law are dashed, so my second option is Accountancy as well. NUS Law would have been my top choice, since they have a tie-up with NYU’s J.D. program, but well, circumstances do not permit me that option.</p>
<p>My mother’s rationale for getting me to study accountancy is that being a CPA at least guarantees me some job security. I still have no interest in that discipline, though.</p>
<p>My sister went to Rutgers, but she went to a county college prior to that. The reason why she went abroad was because her grades were not good enough for any local university. Therefore, it might explain why my mother has some residual hang-up that going overseas are for people who cannot make it in their home country. I didn’t apply to Rutgers as a safety school, because I think if I had to study in a so-so school and locally, I’d rather remain here. I suppose I might have been overly confident about where I might end up in - I was actually quite sure I stood a good chance to get into Columbia.</p>
<p>I must say that my mother has proferred rather contradictory arguments against my case. She claims that if I were that intent on studying Law (I wasn’t really), I should have researched my options in Australia or UK and she would have been more than glad to ship me there. Yet she also mentions that I’m not mature enough to live abroad right now, and that NYU is very costly - I don’t see how the UK might be any less cheaper, if we disregard that it is actually harder to read Law abroad than in my own home country and that I have no kin at all in either of those countries.</p>
<p>Her contradictory arguments make me suspect that she’s only throwing out those reasons because she knows that they are out of my reach. Which is why I claim that her reasons might be more emotional than logical. She has so far been stubborn and unreceptive to the research I’ve done as well.</p>
<p>It seems that a bunch of it is emotional on your mom’s end…you are the youngest and you want to go to college very far from home and she can’t picture you living independently in NYC and so on. Lots of parents feel that way and it is hard for parents to let go. Yours will have to let you go very far for this. If you are the youngest, it may make it harder for HER. Can you talk to your dad rationally about why you think you are ready for this? They let your sister go…can you mention that you want that chance as well? And then your mom said she would have let you go to Columbia…that’s also in Manhattan. It’s hard for your mom and maybe you can show understanding of her fears? My kid didn’t go across the world to college (just six hours away) but Manhattan is the most opposite extreme from where she grew up and I even let her go at age 16 and as hard as it was for me to imagine her there, she convinced us and we let her go and it has been great. But yeah, it was hard to imagine! And she was our youngest too. </p>
<p>Also, if you don’t want to study accounting, I would make that very clear to your mom. Acknowledge that it may be a secure path but if you are not interested enough in it, it just won’t work. </p>
<p>See if you can call a “family conference” with both your mom and dad there and tell them you want to explain your reasons and you want them to share their concerns and you want to try to address those concerns.</p>
<p>And just for trivia’s sake, if it might help to clarify any doubts:</p>
<ol>
<li>My family has green card status.</li>
<li>My parents have promised me a car (a very hefty investment in Singapore, would come up to about S$50 000) and I’ve also been promised that I can travel abroad any time I like. Anything to keep me studying here, I guess.</li>
<li>I am not the youngest. I have a younger brother who is 15, but so far he has shown no inclination to study abroad. He is even more pampered/spoilt than me by virtue of his age (my oldest sister is 29, brother is 25, me 19) and I doubt he’ll want to leave my mother ever. Hah, that being said, he is only 15.</li>
<li>Financially, my parent’s liquidity might be a bit tight, because my mum just bought two investment properties in high-end areas and is in the midst of paying off the loans.</li>
</ol>
<p>There are probably a lot of subtle familial details that will make a difference in judging this issue but if you have any doubt, please ask.</p>
<p>soozie: Whenever I assert that I have no interest in accountancy, she blames me for being immature and not being farsighted. I will definitely try the family conference thing. But may I know how you reconciled yourself to letting your D go to such an urban setting? How do parents justify this? Like, “Oh, if my D is happy I’ll be happy too” or what? If I know, I might just know how to persuade her. I got so desperate that I borrowed two books on persuasion from the library, heh.</p>
<p>Bloggergirl, I don’t think I have much that’s useful to suggest, but I just wanted to say that it’s a pleasure to read your posts because you’re such a good writer. Sorry you’re in this quandary.</p>
<p>Our daughter goes to school across the country. It’s in a rural area, but I don’t think that makes much difference; the big thing is that the kid is gone and she can’t come home very often. But she calls us every week! We told her she didn’t have to, but she says she likes talking to us about her week and our week. I think it’s true, but even if it were a pleasant fiction, I’d be happy. You could try thinking of ways to stay truly connected to your family. There’s phone, email, skype, etc. But it’s more than the technology, it’s your commitment or at least willingness to keep your parents in your thoughts and as part of your life even if you’re far away. (How about this - our daughter even wants to chat with her 15-year-old brother.)</p>
<p>If your family has the resources, could you suggest that your parents come to visit regularly if you were in New York?</p>
<p>What it comes down to is this: Your parents have a lot of influence over what you do in the next few years, but perhaps not so much after that. So yes, your mom could twist your arm to do the degree she wants at the college she prefers, because you are young and they are paying the bill. After that, you probably could go to the US, live with or near your relatives for a year or two while you work and earn some money, then study something else at a US college.</p>
<p>To answer your question to Soozie about “if she’s happy, we’re happy” - yes, that’s pretty much how we feel. We do miss our daughter a lot, but every time we see her or talk to her we can see what a great place she has found and how much she is learning about herself as well as academically, so it’s worth it.</p>
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<p>I’ll try to answer but please recognize that all parents are different and also all situations are different. In my D’s case, she did not have to persuade us at all to go to NYU. We let our kids apply to any colleges they wanted to attend and we had NO influence on the creation of their college list and we also exerted No influence in their decision of where to matriculate. We helped them through the process but every decision was theirs to make and we did not give opinions about the colleges. I didn’t really have a choice I wanted for my kids As a parent, I just really hoped my kids would get into colleges they wanted to attend and we are happy as long as they are happy. And I can see that they actually did choose schools to attend (and were lucky enough to get in) that fit them each SO well. We never gave an opinion about any of the schools. Same with whatever they wanted to major in…their choice…fully supported. Again, there may be cultural differences at play here. So, in any case, my D did not have to persuade us to attend NYU at all. Actually, it had been a dream of hers to go there since age 12. </p>
<p>There is ONE thing she DID have to persuade us to let her do, however…though I admit…it took her one sit down meeting with us to plead her case. But she came to us in January of tenth grade when she was 15 and her sister had just finished her own college applications and asked us to let her graduate high school a year early. She is a very articulate young lady and very strong willed. She articulated all the reasons why she wanted to do this. It was not anything we had ever planned on her doing. But it was hard to turn her down as she was very strong about her desires and frankly, her rationale was very sound, even if it was not in my expectation ever that she would graduate HS early. We went along with it. I’m not sure how we would ever live through it if we did not, LOL. But seriously, she was not emotional about it but really outlined her reasons. She is driven and knows what she wants. Her reasons were ones we truly could not argue with. They made sense even if this was not expected. She made it happen and we supported her through the process. So, the big thing for us was that she had entered kindergarten early and then on top of that graduated high school early and left home at 16. But honestly, she knows herself better than anyone and now that she has done this and is about to graduate from college, it all worked out so well and she did what was right for her and she drove the process and we supported her. For us, it wasn’t about going to NYU but more about her leaving home for college so young. But I was commenting to you earlier that it was a bigger deal for ME (not her!!) that she landed in NYC because she grew up in a rural area in the country…a town of 1700 people…where she never walked to anything in her life and had never taken public transportation and so on and so forth. It was hard for me to picture her on her own in a big city like NYC. I had to adjust. She was fine with it. But my job as a parent is to let go. And so, I feel for your mom in letting you go and it is far away. I can understand all of that. But I imagine this had to come up when you even applied to American schools, right? What was her attitude then? </p>
<p>I can’t promise you what will work with your parents but I have to say that while our kid did not have to convince us about a particular college or city or major (all of which we left up to our kids totally), she did have to bring to us a proposal that we did not plan on…to graduate early and she had it all planned out and well reasoned and I admit, it was hard to argue with her reasons. They made sense for her. She knows herself better than we do. She was right. This WAS the right path for her. (I can say that now that she is about to graduate from college). So, as hard as it was to imagine her leaving home so young and in a big city, we would never stop her. It is hard for parents to let their kids fly the coop, but we must and then they shall soar. </p>
<p>Be kind to your parents. Be rational. Understand their concerns. Even ask them their concerns. Have very well articulated reasons. The fact that your Dad seems OK with your plan…get him more involved. And then, you have to accept what is…they are paying for it. By the same token, you are an adult and it is my belief, the decisions about your future should be in YOUR hands.</p>
<p>PS…back to your original question…you could say something like “I know that parents often say they are happiest when their children are happy and nothing would make me happier than to go to this school and I don’t think I would be as happy at X or Y school. You would make me so grateful to support my dreams and happiness and I’d be the luckiest daughter in the world to have you by my side on this.”</p>
<p>When I was in the midst of taking the SATs and making my applications, my mother never resisted, but neither did she show enthusiasm for the idea. She willingly whipped out her credit card when I needed to make payment, but that’s about it. She might have thought that I was merely building castles in the air and posed no threat to her grand master plan for the rest of my life.</p>
<p>So far, my mother’s single line of defence that she never fails to fall back on when she has nothing to say is this “Trust me, I am your mother, you will never go wrong.”</p>
<p>What is a child to say to that?</p>
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<p>You are 19. Stop being a child and take the reins on your life a little more and be very strong about what you plan to do and need to do and ask your parents to support you. Be very clear about it and not emotional about it and outline your plans.</p>
<p>That said, parents have your best interests at heart and I understand what your mom means. But you must make your own decisions now as it is your future. Nobody else should tell you what to major in, for example. </p>
<p>Try to not act child-like in having a meeting with your parents.</p>
<p>(I shared my story about my 15 year old coming to us to ask to graduate early…she was not emotional but made a strong case and given how strong-willed she is and driven, we didn’t feel we could say “no” as it would have been difficult to live with…she knew what she wanted and went after it and frankly, in the end, she was right about herself)</p>
<p>This is tough one I wish you luck. My two pieces of advice is 1) keep your options open as long as possible and 2) difuse your parents concerns with information.</p>
<p>Keep your options open - I would suggest not forcing a confrontation until it absolutely needs to happen … perhaps applying to your parents choices as well as yours … perhaps visiting your parents schools as well as yours. Don’t draw the line in the sand too soon … keep you options open to buy time to …</p>
<p>Difuse your parents concerns with information - Do not fight with your parents about their reasons … ask questions to truly understand their objecttions. “We do not want you to go to shool in the US” … ask question … do you want me to live at home while in college? stay in our county? stay on the continent? is it only the US you fear? is it only NYC? Why do you fear it? That you can not come to visit? That I won’t be close if there is an emergency? That you fear crime in NYC? Then when you understand their underlying concerns chase information to quell these fears. The travel time to NYC would be the same as London … crime in NYC is less than Hong Kong … I want to move bck home after college but want to experience another culture during college. Don’t lie but I’d bet most of your parents concerns can be addressed reasonably if you can get to a open honest conversation about them.</p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
<p>Are you sure your parents can really afford it? If they want you to stretch your dollars, maybe the cost is a little higher for them than you think. Not that they aren’t possibly being overprotective, but there are very few people who wouldn’t have a problem paying $220,000–plus flights back and forth from Singapore!</p>
<p>Endicott, many would have a problem paying that but by the same token, NYU has many full pay students, as well as many international students. Some are willing to pay that. Many more are willing who are not even accepted.</p>
<p>But the point is–are the people who would do the paying willing to pay? Going to NYU is not an entitlement. If her parents don’t want her to go, and she has other decent alternatives, then I think she’s out of luck. If her parents think it’s too far for her to go, then that’s what they think. She can go where she likes if she is old enough. But she’s not entitled to have her parents bankroll it. Her future won’t be blighted without NYU and it won’t be drastically improved with it. If parents are enthusiastic about having their teenager fly off to a faraway country to go to college and they’re happy to spend huge buckets of money to do so, then everything’s beautiful. But if the daughter is pushing them to do something they don’t want to do, they really don’t owe her that, unless she can persuade them otherwise. They seem to be in a deadlock: She wants to go, mother doesn’t want her to go. What is it that she can offer them that is of value that will make them freely want to pay that money? I don’t know. I know that I am freely paying for my son’s college–but then, it’s not in a faraway country, and it’s a fabulous college, and there were certain other colleges that he got accepted to but got no scholarship for that I would NOT pay for. The key is somewhere in this question: How does it benefit them to do this??</p>
<p>Endicott…I agree that the parents do not owe their D the cost of NYU, nor to allow her to go to college overseas. They are not financial aid applicants and so it is not as if they didn’t get the financial aid package they had hoped to receive. They knew the cost of it when she applied, as well as the cost of Columbia and Penn…also very expensive schools. They allowed her to apply to colleges overseas. It is their perogative to not pay and to not allow her to study oveseas. In my view, that decision should have come before she applied. I am not reading new information that came to light as far as cost or distance, in other words. </p>
<p>I do believe that this girl needs to logically outline her reasons for this school and to ask her parents what their concerns are and to then address their concerns. She should also contrast the school with her other local options and have reasons why those do not fit her (ex. she does not want to major in accounting).</p>
<p>Wow, you guys are making a very complicated issue out of something very simple and universal: </p>
<p>Mom doesn’t want to let go.</p>
<p>OP: My advice: Don’t waste time trying to explain why NYU Stern is such a great place. Instead, try to explain all the different ways in which you will still stay connected, promise to fly back home frequently, and to always take good care of yourself while you are in NY. Also, promise to re-evaluate your decision in 1 year, and to come back if things are not going well.</p>
<p>vicariousparent has it right I think. My wife is Singaporean and the strings that relatives can pull in that culture have amazed me for decades - even on the other side of the world.</p>
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<p>You don’t have to be on the other side of the world to be amazed ;)</p>
<p>I am on trying to work things out financially, perhaps obtain a student loan. Sister who lives in NYC is able to put me through two years of tuition fees, excluding board and personal expenses so I’ll try to work it out.</p>
<p>Vicariousparent…I agree, it sounds very much to me that mom doesn’t want to let go. That was my original reaction as well. I’d have the OP work on getting her dad involved as he was not as against it and the D can acknowledge how hard it is for mom but she needs to take on some assertiveness that she is now 19 and needs this time to leave home. Older sister was allowed to do this and I can see how mom fears that like the older D, this one may not return. That is what the OP needs to address with her mom.</p>
<p>What would happen if you had a 2-person meeting with only your Dad, perhaps near his work on his lunchtime? Sometimes dads have a different vision of what it means to travel and visit. By getting out of the house together, you and he might be able to talk over some issues. </p>
<p>Does he control the flow of money in the house? If so, ask if he can reassure all in your family that you or Mom can afford (let’s say) 3 annual trips. Also, is your Mom a confident solo traveller, and will she travel around the globe alone? If not, would Dad commit to leaving work once or twice annually to fly with Mom, to help you realize your vision and gain his wife’s agreement and support of your intention? How often can you be financed to fly yourself home, and have you thought about it enough to reassure all of your committed plan to come home to visit? </p>
<p>You have a bit of a problem here because you’re essentially saying goodbye forever to your Mom and the life you’ve known together so far. It will take new form, and she is not a fool and can see and feel that right before her. You want to go live in New York because it offers work contacts and opportunities in America (where Stern has a positive reputation) which doesn’t quite carry you as effectively back to a future life working in Singapore as might have the more internationally famous Columbia U. </p>
<p>I agree with SoozieVt that NYU Stern in Business is a well respected undergraduate major and university here in our country. Perhaps the two schools are seen as closer together from here than in Singapore where the Ivies carry such important international reputations. As an American and now resident of upstate New York, I’m certainly impressed when I hear someone is going to NYU, especially for Stern (business) or Tisch (arts/theater). So by saying you want NYU, you are almost saying to Mom, “I want to work in the USA forever, because there the NYU degree will be understood and admired almost as much as the Columbia name. Not true in Singapore.” You’re giving Mom that signal and you can’t help that, but she’s reacting to it as “goodbye forever.” </p>
<p>So, in essence you are indicating to your Mom your intention NOT to live your adult life in Singapore, because you both know that in your country, a Stern degree doesn’t impress the way a Columbia degree would have. </p>
<p>Emotionally, Mom knows this is the beginning of the end of having you near her, now and in her old age. Are you showing her you have thought about it, feel it too? If she feels she’s the only one who cares about that big shift, she’s right to fear you’re running away. But if you indicate you care, maybe the emotional tone will be more connected between you two. </p>
<p>Can you wrap your head around that lovingly and reassure her that she is in your plans, no matter where you will live? She might feel as if you are trying to run away from her, when you are not; you just may want to chart a different future than inside your native country. </p>
<p>Is she adept with technology? That will help her realize she could chat with you often, especially by Skype. If not, get yourself or Dad on the task of showing her how Skype works. </p>
<p>You are so very fortunate not to have financial restrictions on travel. That is something to celebrate together. What options your family’s prosperity has given you to consider an overseas education. Thank them for this. </p>
<p>Our situation was the youngest wanted to study a particular skill within a particular industry (screenwriting/ for film and TV). While it’s possible to study skills for this anywhere in the world, he set about demonstrating to us that the largest menu of courses, work/intern opportunities, people-networking during college, and job prospects post-college are in Southern California near Hollywood. That is 3,000 miles from where we live, 8-l0 hours of travel by air. As an example, he showed us how the film courses in schools near us were about “Film” but not with an actual major in “Screenwriting.” To actually major in screenwriting, he needed to be in a California school. Even on the East Coast there is “dramatic writing” but that was for stage more than screen. These are all technical differences within his industry, but perhaps there are comparable differences in focus at the course catalogue level, between Stern Business school and the Singapore options. It can be studied in terms of majors, courses listed, and faculty background in your chosen field.</p>
<p>Like you, our S believed the networking and internships could begin much sooner if he located himself earlier in the location he expects to work for his lifetime. This is not to say he couldn’t learn many skills in the Northeast near us, and then move to California after college. But it was the total package; the wrap-around environment; and chances much BETTER if he positioned himself in his location at a younger age. He convinced us of this. He didn’t refuse to go to schools near us, and applied nearby, too. But in the end, when accepted at schools on both coasts, he convinced us the whole package made more sense 3,000 miles away for THAT profession. </p>
<p>I think part of your problem is, so far, your Mom seems to think she can decide your career for you (accountancy) and the thought of that profession makes you quite unhappy. PLEASE DON’T LET HER CHOOSE YOUR CAREER FOR YOU. On that, I think your Dad might have to weigh in; what does it feel like to wake up daily and hate your line of work? How does a person push themself to work for 40 years at what they dislike doing? Working should inspire a person, if only because they like to earn money, but there is more than one reliable way to earn a living. </p>
<p>Perhaps if you identify an approach to the business major at Stern that is more global or wider in scope than what is offered within your country’s finer universities, that might convince. Had our son wanted to “be” in California, that wouldn’t have been enough for us; we’d have said go do it when you’re older, on your own money! What convinced us was his chosen career and professional goal, supported by an education in that geographic region, so people in his field would recognize it, employers know his professors, all finding common ground to converse at interviews. His is a networking, not certification-based kind of work culture; perhaps business is the same. </p>
<p>We could see logically that, for this line of work and the future, a location and education in California gave him a much better chance to begin and achieve his own chosen career. He showed us lists of courses, names of professors, locations of workplaces and more. He certainly spoke calmly and logically, but also lovingly as our family is very close. </p>
<p>He convinced us. For any other profession or major, such as History or English, sending him to undergraduate college in California would have seemed to us just a jaunt to the beach, and we’d have said absolutely not; can’t afford it; and why do it? We have plenty of schools around us with wonderful offerings, but not in his particular intended career. </p>
<p>The least convincing part of your presentation so far (to me) is how much you’d enjoy living in NYC. I happen to love the city of New York, and have another kid who lives and works there now fulltime, post-college. It’s a great city and I understand its excitement for a young person.</p>
<p>But as a parent about to fund an undergraduate education, I’d be telling you fine-- go live and work in NYC on your own money when you’re older and more mature, or go visit your sister in the summertime. So I think you might convince by focussing mostly on how a Stern Business education (courses, majors, faculty, internships) right in NYC, the financial capital of the U.S., gives you a better adult professional future in Business than any of your Singapore options. I’d make it an economic/professional goal, an investment in you – coupled with keeping them in your lives emotionally, of course, as you are their daughter. </p>
<p>If you determine why your Mom is so opposed, and some of it is losing a daughter to the world, here are some more loving things to offer up to your Mom. Tell her that wherever you live (if it is off-campus) you will make sure the others support having visiting parents for a week or more. Unbelievably, there are some American students who express distaste at having any parents stay overnight for visits. You can say you so much want her to come visit that you’ll buy a second twin bed in the room and it is for her to use; and you won’t get roommates unless they agree to accept parent visitors, even for a week or two at a time. Maybe she’d rather stay at a hotel, but just by saying “my home will be your home” tells her she is loved and you want her in your life.</p>
<p>I think you might need to ask your Dad for more help here, best done in a two-way talk with him in his own space (near work) rather than home. Sometimes Dads can see a vision for their daughters that is very wide, and when they tap into it they will override the mother or insist she not hold her daughter in place. He has to face her down to do this, and so far, you haven’t appealed to him what it means to you. For now, he might be feeling it’s not worth facing down his wife to give his daughter this opportunity. You might need to have lunch with just him and see what kind of alliance you can forge; then go together to the Mom and say lovingly this is your education, your career, and you always want her part of your life but that life might be lived out overseas.</p>