How Did you like Harvard?

<p>This fall I will be a freshman. I have no former experience in physics outside of my own reading. I e-mailed 10-12 professors this summer explaining my situation and my interest in becoming involved in Physics research. Several, including Howard Georgei and Arthur Jaffe, said that they would like to meet with me when I arrive on campus to help me find projects that interest me. John Doyle and Amir Yacoby expressed interest in having me work for them this year and in a paid position during next summer. They both run experimental condensed matter labs.</p>

<p>p.s I believe the change in final’s period is permanent.</p>

<p>piccolojunior: <Unhappy undergrads come from expecting the world from a school. Personally, as long as I have my daily dose of basketball and chem it doesn’t matter where I am(although Harvard’s chem dept is golden, so actually it does make a difference for me rofl). Happiness is what you make of it…that’s not the fault of the institution. Unless, if I understand your pattern correctly, you’re saying science-oriented schools = unhappy student bodies. If you really think that then get off the internet.</p>

<p>But as for the whole “XX doesn’t care about its undergrads” argument…I’ve always felt: well, so what? You have to earn your way to the top, and the red carpet treatment at “undergrad-focused” schools deludes one from the realities imho. And obviously there are some undergrads who everyone cares about, particularly those who are essentially grad students anyway (quite a few names come to mind) in terms of their courseload/research work.</p>

<p>My advice: worry about getting in first.></p>

<p>By no means am I suggesting that science-oriented schools = unhappy student bodies. As for “Happiness is what you make of it…that’s not the fault of the institution,” that is the type of dodging answer that irritates me a lot. It is a panacea to any problem, blame it on someone else (which I am aware could be said of my original concern). While an institution cannot be 100% to blame, they carry their share like everyone else. The institution is a constant, but students flow in and out. </p>

<p>No one has to roll out the red carpet or rub my feet with perfume. Regardless of “reality,” it is always nice to be respected and feel people are looking out after your best interests.</p>

<p>Bay: <is it=“” possible=“” that=“” the=“” #1=“” ranked=“” undergraduate=“” institution=“” in=“” country=“” does=“” not=“” care=“” about=“” its=“” undergrads???=“” funny.=“”></is></p>

<p>Everyone should know how insane those rankings are. I put absolutely no weight on them.</p>

<p>I do however give weight to responses from certain alumni and students who say the administration ignores undergrads.</p>

<p>molliebatmit: <First, that happened in 2001, so it’s hardly a current example of MIT student life. Second, the girl in question had first attempted suicide as a senior in high school when she had gotten salutatorian instead of valedictorian – it was hardly the MIT workload or her professors who caused her to have suicidal thoughts.</p>

<p>During the 90s, yes, MIT had a string of suicides (though whether its suicide rate was truly higher than average, given its demographics, is debatable). There have been a lot of changes to the student mental health system, and there hasn’t been an undergraduate suicide since 2002 (or perhaps 2001? it was before I arrived in fall 2002).</p>

<p>It’s fine if you don’t want to apply to MIT, but I want to correct rumor and hearsay – the whole “MIT suicide” meme is so widespread on the internet, and it’s really not accurate.></p>

<p>The only thing I have to say is that it takes a long time to rebuild a reputation (at least to me), and I feel that 6 years has not proven anything to me.
I am in no way questioning MIT’s amazing programs and dedication to the sciences.</p>

<p>Yes, the calendar change is permanent. This year, 08-09, is the last working under the traditional calendar.</p>

<p>harvard1636: <That Crimson article about unhappiness is really starting to irk me. If anyone knows the Crimson magazine board (who authored the article)…those guys seriously love to complain. About anything and everything. They’re sarcastic and snippy. You can’t base your judgment on Harvard from one stupid article from 2003 that truly does not reflect the student body. A lot of the hype surrounding this theory of Harvard unhappiness seems to me like people are trying to make Harvard what they THINK it must be–a pressure-cooker of intense proportions where everyone thinks only of academic work and their own miserableness. The truth is so far from that. Of course there are unhappy people at Harvard–duh, there are unhappy people everywhere. Of course there are people with impossible expectations–when you go to the #1 university in pretty much the world, you’re going to have lots of unrealistic expectations. That doesn’t mean you can’t be happy at Harvard. I (and everyone I know, for that matter) am most definitely happy and right now counting down the days until we get to go back. Of course Harvard cares about its undergraduates–everyone loves to say they don’t, but I have absolutely no complaints. The new advising system gives you multiple options of people to talk to, not to mention you can take the initiative to talk to pretty much anyone who isn’t assigned to you as your specific advisor. A lot of happiness at Harvard is about ambition–whether you’re the type of person who will seek out what you want to do and what you need. Harvard doesn’t spoon-feed you. The problem is when people who need that extra push or spoon-feeding attend Harvard, they tend to be unhappy since they are unable to get what they want out of it. I think Harvard isn’t right for everybody, but if you can be the person who will take initiative, you’ll be happy and satisfied with your experience. How can you say Harvard doesn’t care!? That is just an unfounded generalization. My impression is that Harvard cares a great deal. One of my roommates was struggling in a class–our dean sent her a letter and just talked with her and discussed tutoring options and how she was adjusting to school, without my roommate even requesting a meeting. I like this article from the Crimson regarding happiness: The Harvard Crimson :: Magazine :: Dropping the H-Bomb</p>

<p>The other annoying thing is when people claim Harvard classes aren’t taught by professors. Of course they are! Some of the most prominent, knowledgable professors in the world, in fact. Yes, our larger lecture classes break down into sections led by TFs (teaching fellows, which are grad students)…but that happens at pretty much every other university across the country. At Penn, they call them recitations and they’re taught by TAs (teaching assistants, same deal). At Columbia, some TAs are even current undergrad students. I actually loved my sections and my TFs so far–one of my TFs even became a professor and got his doctorate while he was teaching me. So just because you have a “grad student” doesn’t mean you’re at an educational disadvantage. I just spent a semester in very close proximity with a guy who will now be a professor this year, which is pretty cool. This only applies to big lectures of course…there are tons and tons of classes out there with extremely small sizes.</p>

<p>As for the academic schedule, I actually like our current one-it has its advantages. No one studies during Xmas break, you don’t need to since you get an extended reading period once you’re back. But I’m fine with the change, which is permanent and will go into effect your first year. You’ll still get a nice reading period, same as Yale.</p>

<p>Housing at Harvard is regarded as the finest in the country, hands down. My freshman year room was incredible, especially compared to my friends’ rooms from other schools across the country, and the same goes for rooming in my house. I can’t account for Stanford housing, but I’ve seen Yale’s freshman rooms–they’re tiny and cramped based on the ones I’ve been in, certainly not any superior to Harvard’s. As for the concrete walls you mention, have you ever seen Morse and Ezra Stiles at Yale? Pretty ugly. I can’t say that Yalies feel more house pride–based on the barrage of information and mail and excitement I’ve received since joining my house, Harvardians love theirs just as much. It’s your true community and home and one of the things you identify with most. I met a Harvard alum from like 30 years ago and one of the first things he said about himself was his house and how much he loved it. If you want the community feel, Harvard’s houses will give that to you, no question. I actually like our housing system better because you’re not placed with your house as a freshman (whereas at Yale your freshman dorm corresponds to your house) so that you meet tons of people in your freshman dorm and then the next year, you meet lots of new people in your new house community (while of course being able to live with your friends from your blocking group).</p>

<p>One last thing and then I’m done this exceptionally long post…I know almost nothing about Stanford, but as far as New Haven vs. Cambridge, there’s not even a competition. Cambridge is the most perfect college town–enough right around Harvard’s borders to keep you occupied but then you could also go into Boston if you needed (which most people don’t need to when Cambridge offers so much).</p>

<p>Of course, you don’t need to decide between the three until you actually get accepted, but knowing these differences between the schools and thinking about what you really want helps inform your application process. Hope this helps!></p>

<p>Terrific post. I really appreciate it.
The reason that article hit me is as I stated, my school loves to complain too, mostly because it is so terrible. The thing that really bothers me about my school is that the administration does not care about the student body as a whole, only catering to extremely high donors ($1million+/year, we are a private school) and “disadvantaged” students. They treat the smart students like absolute crap, which is amazing because we are the people who solidify my school’s reputation as a top 15 private high school in the country.
I something I think is very true is that people are jealous of Harvard because it is so prestigious (and ranked #1 :slight_smile: ) and this allows problems to be blown out of proportion to outsiders.</p>

<p>For professors teaching, I know how easy it is to manipulate statistics and it is something that I worry about at all colleges. I know that Harvard is not alone in using TFs or TAs.
At what point (size of class) are TFs introduced to a class, and what are their function i the class? I am sure it depends on the subject, but could you possibly run down your classes? How small do the sections tend to break down into? I am currently under the impression in the large classes, you sit through somewhat of a lecture from the professor and then you break down into your groups.</p>

<p>I really like Yale current schedule, and am happy that it will be harvard’s going forward.</p>

<p>I actually have been in Ezra Stiles and didnt think it was so bad. I didnt like the fact that it wasnt in the gothic style though. It was nice to hear your experience on residential community.</p>

<p>I understand that bars shut down at 2am due to puritan law. Does this go for boston as well? What do people do after 2 am, sleep?</p>

<p>Again, thank you for your great post.</p>

<p>kyzan: <I’m going to second Stupidkid’s advice and say you should worry about getting in first. Spending days of your summer contemplating these choices is probably not very constructive.</p>

<p>Nonetheless, here are my own two cents. I think when it comes to math, Harvard beats Stanford and Yale hands down. Their math department boasts the brightest undergrads and young professors in the world. Physics, it is probably a tie between Stanford and Harvard with Yale lagging behind. I wouldn’t worry about finding a research position at SLAC just yet. I am sure you can do it (I asked around when I was admitted), but there are thousands of other equally satisfying and engrossing projects. </p>

<p>If you plan to do physics and computer science and are dead sure, Stanford might give you a leg up since it is located in silicon valley. However, if you are interested in starting a quant fund (which statistically speaking will probably never happen; you’ll probably end up working for one if you are talented enough), Harvard I think would be the better place. It’s placement of peeps into elite Wall Street firms is unmatched, especially in consulting. </p>

<p>Also, I think you might be spending too much time on the nitty gritty things no one cares about, like class sizes. I am sure all three colleges have excellent professor to student ratio and will sure be better than whatever alternatives you have. Your housing objections and conclusion that Harvard has low quality of life for students I would say is partly unfounded. When I visited Harvard in a regular week, the students seemed busy but mostly happy about where they are. </p>

<p>In the end, if you get in to all three, I recommend visiting. Posting on online forums and scourging what data you can find online is only going to be of minimum help when compared to talking to students on campus and exploring for yourself. </p>

<p>As for why everyone at Yale seems perpetually sappy, I have no idea. It seemed a little artificial when I went to visit.></p>

<p>As I said after your post, I need to make a decision regarding how much I like Harvard so I can whether to go EA to either stanford or yale because my high school commits you if you are accepted.</p>

<p>I am curious, what is your relation to Harvard?</p>

<p>I have visited all three already, yale and harvard several times each. While on visits specifically for college scouting, my guides each time at Harvard were very different. One was very shy, the other was very arrogant. I liked the shy one a lot, but alas, he was shy and did not go in depth about his experience. The other one was incredibly arrogant. She was the worst stereotype that Harvard could offer.
I can see why you think that my concern of qualify of life might be unjustified, but I have been to dorms of each, though I have not been in a concrete dorm at Harvard. I also liked Yale’s gothic structures more than Harvard’s architecture, but I felt a little hemmed in at the same time while at yale.</p>

<p>JHS: <OK, I’m a parent, and my personal experience is old and out of date. I never attended Harvard, although I have about 30 relatives and many more friends who did, I was accepted there twice, and I once had a job interview there (not hired). My wife and I did go to Yale, and I went to graduate school at Stanford, while my sister was an undergrad there. Anyway, I have a long association with all three colleges.</p>

<p>It is a colossal waste of time to parse the differences among these three colleges before you have applied to any of them. They – and especially Harvard and Yale – are far more similar to each other than they are different, and what differences there are will matter much more to some people than to others, and in different directions. All three offer more magnificent opportunities, academically and socially, than any one person could take advantage of in 50 undergraduate careers. If you are lucky enough to get to choose among them, it will be a hard decision, but in an important way the easiest hard decision you will ever face, since there’s no real downside to any of them. </p>

<p>It’s like having to choose which flavor of the best ice cream in the world. You could flip a coin and be confident that you would be happy with your choice.</p>

<p>If Harvard seems to have a higher proportion of disgruntled undergraduates – and I think it may, although I want to emphasize “higher”, not “high” – it may be because one of the types of student who would systematically tend to pick Harvard over other choices is a type who wants “the best” of whatever, regardless whether he or she actually likes it. Also, there are some people who have gotten used to being treated like little gods back home. That’s going to lead to some disappointments. Too bad. Finally, I think some people feel oppressed by the sense that if they are at Harvard and they’re not beating the world, there’s something wrong with them.</p>

<p>The vast majority of Harvard students aren’t like that, and have wonderful experiences there. As they should.</p>

<p>Meanwhile, instead of engaging in this pretty useless exercise, why don’t you put some energy into deciding where else to apply. It’s the easiest thing in the world to decide that Harvard, Yale, and Stanford are great places to go to college. Anyone can figure that out. What’s tougher is deciding what’s a great place to go to collge for you where you can actually be confident you will have a chance to enroll.></p>

<p>I agree with your point about people being treated like gods earlier in their lives.
I have several other schools I will be applying to. If you ignore the whole prestige issue, it is actually not that easy to separate harvard, yale, and stanford from the other great schools in the country. It is only when you get into the nitty gritty things that you see why these school stand out and have become so prestigious.
As I have stated above, I need to decide relatively soon how these three schools rank personally.
According to my college counselor, I have roughly a 50% chance Harvard and a 75% chance at Stanford/Yale through EA. I understand these are estimates, but we send tons of kids to these school every year, so he has some basis for these estimates.</p>

<p>I’d LOL if you got rejected from all three.</p>

<p>75% chance at Yale and Stanford = match - safe match.</p>

<p>Do tell me how that goes. ;)</p>

<p>woah, who does your college guidance counsellor think he/she is??</p>

<p>unless he/she is the mistress/master of all the deans of all three schools, i highly doubt those are accurate estimates… even if you are going to a top 15 private high school, remember that the main feeder high schools to these prestigious universities- Mainly Harvard/Yale- are andover, exter, etc… these high schools have been established long time back, and have been in constant relation with the prestigious universities.</p>

<p>I am aware that those percentages are very high.
My schools feeds as many people to the ivys as any other school in the country percentage wise.</p>

<p>Although I am a great student, a large part of these very high percentages is derived from my connections with each schools (which are very strong). I know there are very few people (if anyone) who could expect those chances without connections.</p>

<p>Not to be pushy, but let me worry about getting accepted. I have not posted a “chance me” profile, so let us not have this thread turn into that.</p>

<p>I don’t think it matters how many “connections” you have–putting either of those as a ‘safe match’ is overshooting (not to mention arrogant). I hope you don’t really believe that’s the reality.</p>

<p>And it doesn’t matter how many people your high school sends to Ivies. What matters is you, not the school.</p>

<p>kyledavid80, are you aware with the situations of the kennedy, bush, or vanderbilt families? While my connections are not in that stratosphere, they are impressive, and I will leave it at that.</p>

<p>I again ask that this thread keep to the original purpose. I really appreciate responses that certain members have left.</p>

<p>I don’t think those family names have the same power they used to. It is worth noting that Maria Shiver’s daughter did not get into Boston College, let alone HYS. So much for the Kennedy clan.</p>

<p>Though there is a Kennedy at Harvard.</p>

<p>So good luck. I would, however, recommend on avoiding leaning on connections if you want to go into the sciences. I have a feeling that M.I.T or Harvard graduate school could care less if someone is a Bush or Kennedy.</p>

<p>But good luck in your applications. I hope my info earlier in this topic helped.</p>

<p>^well, for med school the connections would help…like, maybe 0.2 points lower GPA and 5 less on the MCAT than the typical HMS student had. But I hope this guy doesn’t come here next year.</p>

<p>Ya, I was thinking more pure sciences (Chem, Physics, Bio) or mathematics. Such departments, even at undergraduate, would seemed to be very level in terms of class and social position.</p>

<p>Does he sound like a future Yalie to you? haha</p>

<p>^^ LOL White rabbit just pwned KingJames123(6- what an evil number)</p>

<p>Even with amazing connections, calling Yale or Stanford a “match” is hard, much less a safe match.</p>

<p>piccolojunior: I was about to say the same, except for Stanford. ;)</p>

<p>

For sure. </p>

<p>Now, if your undergraduate research supervisor was a Nobel laureate (or some other scientific equivalent of a Bush or Kennedy), that connection will get you into MIT or Harvard science PhD programs, as long as that person writes you a positive recommendation. Those kinds of connections matter. Other kinds don’t.</p>