How do colleges react to applicants who have great stats but are mentally ill?

Parents Forum
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<p>“I have a good friend who struggled with mental illness while he was at MIT. They definitely try to provide support – to the point of controlling his medical care and forcing him to meet with mental health and support services staff frequently (though he had outside treatment). He felt that the actual ability of these people to treat him was terrible and forced him to jump through a lot of unnecessary hoops and ultimately hurt his education and experience. He said that given the choice now he would not have sought treatment at all vs everything that he’s had to go through with the school. He also would have chosen a different school.”</p>

<p>I wonder about how well your friend was able to analyze his situation. Many – if not most – people with mental health problems are not able to determine what kind of treatment they need and how severe their problems are.</p>

<p>I wonder about his analysis of the situation because if he had outside treatment, it seems that provider could have stepped in to help him with MIT. However, if his outside treatment was in his hometown, which was not in the Boston area, that could have been a reason why MIT insisted that he get help on their campus. </p>

<p>This also stands out:</p>

<p>"He said that given the choice now he would not have sought treatment at all vs everything that he’s had to go through with the school. "</p>

<p>Something must have been wrong or else he wouldn’t have sought treatment, and MIT wouldn’t have been so aggressive about making sure that he got help. It’s highly unlikely that ignoring the problem would have made things better.</p>

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<p>As luck/fate/?? (maybe the drinking water?) would have it, my oldest was diagnosed with ADD half-way through hs. We did not disclose on the college apps (although it certainly had something to do with his grades) but did inform the administration the summer before first year.</p>

<p>However, this child had a definite, dramatic fall-off in grades for sophomore and junior years of hs. I think it would be odd not to provide an explanation, and I’m hoping society has come far enough that revealing depression wouldn’t negatively impact admissions prospects, at least not everywhere. All of this assumes that treatment will work and we’ll see marked improvement over the next two years. If that’s the case, how else to explain the gap? Better to disclose “I had a bout of depression but have undergone successful treatment and am performing much better” or leave it be and let the adcoms assume he was a screw-up for a couple of years?</p>

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<p>It is my opinion that ADD and ADHD is so very common these days and disclosing it would cause less ripples in the reading of an app than would a disclosure of some sort of mental illness that could potentially impact other students, RAs, etc. Physical disabilities of course should be disclosed if it will impact housing arrangements and needs. And yes, if a student suffered “a bout of depression” or an eating disorder was treated and rebounded to great success their senior year I’m guessing that would not cause as many issues with an application. Now, if the student had a gap, was treated, came back to high school had another gap, etc. that is where the fine line exists not only for the parents trying to decide if the child is capable of handling college socially but for the school trying to figure out if the applicant is capable of handling college or is “at risk.”</p>

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<p>For a real life perspective about disclosure, seeking help when depressed in college, etc., read this story. It illustrates the importance of finding out the prospective colleges’ policies and mental health resources ahead of time; that colleges differ is an understatement, and that your kid could be treated very harshly at their worst time is the sad truth. </p>

<p>[When</a> There’s Nowhere to Turn - Personal Tragedy, Suicide and Attempts, Depression, Coping and Overcoming Illness, Real People Stories : People.com](<a href=“http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20059562,00.html]When”>http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20059562,00.html)</p>

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<p>The below is from the article MomPhD linked to. i went to grad school in clinical psychology at GWU, and I had an internship at GW’s counseling center. This is not the way that we treated suicidal students back then! </p>

<p>"t was a typical Saturday night at the Alpha Epsilon Pi fraternity on the campus of George Washington University. After catching a movie, freshman Ethan Helfand and a few of his friends headed back to the frat house to drink some beers. But around 1 a.m. on Feb. 20, 2005, one of the guys made a cutting comment to Helfand, a young man whose history of depression and suicidal thoughts stretched back to middle school. Crushed by the comment—words so hurtful that even today his friends will not repeat them—Helfand headed to his dorm and began gulping handfuls of antidepressants. After dashing off farewell e-mails to family and friends, he lapsed into unconsciousness. “I wanted to sleep and not wake up,” he says.</p>

<p>At 5 p.m. the next day, Helfand finally did wake up—at the university hospital. Under observation there for several days, he received a stream of visitors, among them a hospital employee who questioned Helfand as to how he would respond if he felt suicidal again. Eventually, a school therapist showed up to deliver stunning news: Effective immediately Helfand was forbidden from entering his dorm. In a state of shock, he recalls asking, “Where should I go?” only to be told bluntly, “Go to a hotel.”</p>

<p>Is that any way to treat a student with serious psychological problems? Increasingly, colleges around the country—faced with the threat of liability suits from parents when students kill themselves on campus—are taking a get-tough approach with students they believe are a risk to themselves and the morale and mental health of those around them. </p>

<p>Helfand, now 21, decided to take a leave of absence from the Washington, D.C., university and returned to campus last January, despite his parents’ opposition. But he has learned a big lesson from his experience, he says. Even though he takes antidepressants and sees a private psychiatrist, he insists that, no matter how dark his mood, he will never set foot again in the university health center. “I absolutely try to stay away from there,” he says…</p>

<p>George Washington is by no means alone in adopting a get-tough approach. In August a former undergrad at Hunter College won a $65,000 settlement against the New York City school after she was locked out of her dorm room when she swallowed handfuls of Tylenol and called 911. Some colleges now ask students about their mental-health history during registration, and several hundred mentally distressed students are suspended each year, according to Gary Pavela, former director of judicial services at the University of Maryland. “Sometimes students need to be out of school,” says Eric Fulcomer, a dean at Ohio’s Bluffton University, where a student was forced to leave after a suicide attempt.</p>

<p>At the same time, such institutions as the University of Puget Sound in Tacoma, Wash., now let students who have threatened or attempted suicide stay on campus as long as they participate in four counseling sessions.</p>

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<p>What a terrible story. That’s what happened to me too. I used to go to a good college and then they made me take a leave of absence because I was suicidal. Now they’re forcing me to transfer, and I have no idea what to write in that “why transfer” essay. Maybe I’ll have to make something up.</p>

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<p>As a parent, I also find it very distubing that because of HIPAA laws, parents may never be contacted or fully informed in these situations (a reason to get a HIPAA waiver).</p>

<p>What we think should be best medical practice or most compassionate handling on the part of colleges, is in reality dictated by lawyers whose job it is to protect colleges from liability.</p>

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<p>I’m going to try to refocus. OP:</p>

<p>How do colleges react to applicants who have great stats but are mentally ill? I have gaps in my education that would be hard to explain without telling them about my depression, and I’m wondering if that would be an automatic rejection.</p>

<hr>

<p>OP wants to “explain gaps”. Once you offer an “explanation” your expectation of privacy is more limited, at least morally, if not legally. Once you put an explanation into issue, someone who wants more information relative to that issue has a right to expect it, or, in the absence of further information, act cautiously. So to all of the privacy advocates who have posted here, ruminate on this for a minute.</p>

<p>Now if you’re truthful and complete, that will definitely have an impact on an application in some places, especially those places that have had issues with this sort of illness. It would hardly be a surprise for MIT, in light of the very public problems they dealt with in this area, to avoid a potential future issue. If you’re not truthful and complete, well there’s a moral question there coupled with the reality that you may end up in an environment that is a bad fit for you. That would be bad for both you and the school.</p>

<p>Respectfully, I would also consider that in addition to the obvious issues that OP has with a mental illness having an impact on a transcript, at college many students will experience a bevy of stressful situations for the first time. Not to say that many of these firsts do not occur in high school but in high school, you’re rarely far from home. So consider:</p>

<ul>
<li>drinking</li>
<li>drug use</li>
<li>roommate issues</li>
<li>relationship issues</li>
<li>sex</li>
<li>competition</li>
</ul>

<p>and a slew of other stressful situations that college students deal with daily and ask yourself, what school would be a good fit for me in dealing with or avoiding some of these potential issues?</p>

<p>Maybe MIT is a good fit for OP but maybe not. Maybe a more nurturing environment coupled with good achievement would lead to MIT grad school. Don’t feel obligated to sprint and connect with MIT early in life if it’s a better fit later.</p>

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<p>NSM, I’m being a bit deliberately vague because this is not about me and it is a public message board. I can PM you with more specific information if you like. I realize this may not answer very much. This is a very close friend and I’ve seen a lot of this firsthand.</p>

<p>That said, he had (and has) very intensive treatment in the Boston area. He was still required to see a psychiatrist at MIT. I think the big thing is that they do know his medical information and he feels manipulated into things that his therapist agrees are a bad idea by people in support services with no medical or psychiatric background. </p>

<p>He does need treatment and realizes that. He said that if the choice were either or, his first choice would be to matriculate at a different school. If he could have gone to MIT without ever disclosing anything to the school, he would have, although he’s gotten pretty helpful accommodations at times. If the choice was be in this situation or not be in treatment at all, he says he would pick the no treatment at all (clearly that is a very hypothetical choice). He knows he needs the treatment badly, but he feels like the backlash from the school has made everything much worse.</p>

<p>Back to topic – OP, my advice would be to not disclose, but it sounds like people have without disastrous consequences. I would advise to look very closely at the schools that you are considering and their policies and support. Clearly your current school is not very supportive if they are forcing you to transfer? You don’t want to go somewhere else that will react like that. That does sound like a frustrating situation, though. I’m sorry.</p>

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<p>Good thinking by seattle_mom, but since the OP seems to be considering MIT, I’d like to suggest looking into some LAC-like technical schools. Rose-Hulman comes to mind. Serious technology schools that are not total pressure-cookers, and where it should be easier to make a one-on-one with professors and administrators who can provide the proper support. A few others that I’m less familiar with, but which would be worth considering, are Colorado School of Mines, Missouri S&T, RIT, and Worcester Polytechnic. (I would not suggest Harvey Mudd.)</p>

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<p>This is really appalling.</p>

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<p>This is beyond appalling. Assuming you have received treatment and are doing better, which I truly hope has happened for you, it’s hard to fathom how the college can justify this. Have you thought about talking to a lawyer to see if it is legally acceptable to force a student who has recovered from an episode of depression to leave the college? Doesn’t the Americans With Disabilities Act have some sort of provisions for issues related to mental illness? I am wondering if this is a private or public university and if they have any provision for you to appeal their decision.</p>

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<p>Well, the thing is I need a letter from the Dean if I want to transfer. So that would be taking a ridiculous risk, especially in my current state of mind. Besides, I really liked my school (except when they were kicking me out) and I don’t want to hurt my friends who go there.</p>

<p>It is pretty appalling though. I was a pretty damn good student when I was well. Better than most of the healthy people.</p>

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<p>How can you simultaneously be a high school student considering colleges, and a student forced to transfer from your current college? Only one of those two scenarios is the truth.</p>

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<p>The original poster, Ilikephysicsalot, never said he/she was a high school student, at least in the first few posts I just reviewed. If you read them while knowing that this student is applying as a transfer student, all the posts still fit that scenario.</p>

<p>These “appalling” things also happen to students with medical illnesses and disabilities, for illnesses that are not at all life-threatening or disruptive to anyone else.</p>

<p>Colleges, rather than working harder to accommodate the student, make threats that if the student does not leave voluntarily, it will become involuntary and will go on the student’s records. Some schools require students to leave if they suffer an illness that exceeds two weeks, a tricky proposition for those with chronic conditions.</p>

<p>There can be stringent conditions for return, such as working full-time 6 months, and some of the small, apparently nurturing colleges force students to reapply, entirely.</p>

<p>Language in communications from the schools tends to be punitive and lacks any hint of kindness.</p>

<p>While liability is an important factor, I believe money is the root of a lot of this (financial loss when a student leaves, and a slot wasted), as well as rankings issues such as graduation rate. Forcing students to leave may also avert future lawsuits based on inadequate accommodations. And, let’s face it, accommodating students with any “special” needs is inconvenient and cumbersome, to say the least.</p>

<p>The ADA is not all that helpful on the college level, currently, but case law is being established that may change things.</p>

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<p>Yeah, I didn’t want to tell you guys that for a while because knowing I’m a transfer student is a pretty good clue to my identity. (Harvey Mudd gets, what, 100 transfer apps a year?)</p>

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<p>Now that’s really awful.</p>

<p>And thanks again for the helpful advice, guys. :)</p>

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<p>^^Have you ever seen those Brain health programs on PBS? There’s a doctor that has an hour or two program, and one of the things he talks about is how to combat depression. I think he is a neurologist. A lot of the things he says, both in terms of psychiatric and physiological insights, is quite novel. The main psychiatric strategy is to “kill the A.N.T.S.” meaning Automatic Negative Thoughts. </p>

<p>You should check it out. </p>

<p>I can’t put youtube links on here, but if you youtube “change your brain, change your life” the entire programe will come up.</p>

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<p>Well, the “good” thing about Mudd for a student hoping to transfer in is that maybe 15% of any given class transfers out over the 4 years.</p>

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<p>Another insight on reasons why colleges are hesitant to accept students with illness histories–they are potential future drop-outs, or may take more than 6 years to graduate. US News uses freshman retention and 6-year graduation rates in their rankings. Small schools can see their ranking affected when even a handful of students transfer out or don’t graduate.</p>