How important is “fit”?

College Search & Selection
21

I am an educator and the mentor at my school for elite college admissions. And, in my experience, fit is absolutely critical to elite admissions. And it is pretty darn important for happiness and optimal development during your four years.

And most of what I have read of what the parents on this thread here have said they were looking for in terms of “fit”" is not what I consider when I look at “fit.”. There is a difference between your wishlist/checklist, and your “fit.”

The reason you are having trouble understanding “fit” is because fit is a set of intangibles. It may be related to some statistics and to your wishlist, but those are only surface indicators.

Fit is really about identity. Yours and the school’s. Fit is the intersectionality between the two.
What are priorities of the school? How do they resonate with you? Is the school THE IDEAL place for you to grow and develop as a human being as well as to pursue your academic growth?

This is how I help kids find a good fit:
I start by asking a kid for their wishlist and their resume. I ask them their academic goals. And I ask them some other personal questions.
Based on that, I suggest a few schools and they pick out a few schools of different kinds from their list we start through their websites. I show them how to really look for a schools identity through what they have to say about themselves. We pick through a couple of different schools and I send them home with a list to go through. They come back and give me feedback. I ask lots of questions. Then we tweak the list. And they go through it again. And we may tweak it again. Once they have a shortlist, we go through the websites and look for their wishes. (Lots of times as they go along in the process, and they see what is possible, their “wishlists” change. They are able to refine them based on a better understanding of what colleges may offer and what that really means to them.)
That process can take a couple of months.

The colleges they will end up applying to are those that seem to be their best fit. The application process - can take another month. Your application is the only opportunity you have to convey your identity to the school. It is basically a picture of you. A hasty application is a blurry picture. You want to take the time and the long exposure and try to send them a panorama view. So… It is critical that you refine the essays -write about something they can’t see from your transcript. Selecting which awards and activities best represent your interests and passions …
And they should complement the rest of your application but not be redundant. This is also important in your recommendations. Get a recommendation from someone who knows something more about you than good grades and punctuality. Can they speak to your specific passions and to you being a well-rounded person. Can they speak to your character? Does the school accept recommendations from an employer or a coach? Can that person add something noteworthy or special about you to help round out the picture?

You should have a couple of “stretch” schools, a couple of “target” schools, and a “safety” school that are all a decent fit for you.

Once you see where you get in … Then you can go visit.

If you have done a good job identifying your fit first

Then you do a good job conveying your identity…
That is how to get in to an elite school and also to a school where you will be happy and be able to learn in an environment that also helps you to grow and develop and become your best self.

I explained all of that not to frustrate you, but just to help you understand: 1) fit is a complicated thing, 2) finding a good fit takes time and some work on your part, 3) think about yourself and the school and look for the intersectionality 4) really spend time on their websites. Go through them carefully. I gave some more specific ideas for a few things to look for on another recent post about a student who wanted to be a teacher looking at LACs. 5) you can get a good start on looking for fit without visiting (although I think you really should visit eventually, before committing to attend.)

22

“I want to go to a good school and have a good college experience, but so far searching for colleges has been pretty difficult and stressful and it seems like I’m searching for some “fit” when I don’t necessarily have to.”

If something like fit is stressing you out and confusing you, as opposed to making it easier for you, then I wouldn’t worry about it all that much. Figure out your definition of good school and good college experience and that will more or less align with fit. I don’t recall too much of fit when I applied but since then I think guidance counselors started using it to convey that fit is more important than prestige and to choose a college on fit.

23

Remember, fit starts with affordability and academic offerings*. You cannot attend a college that is too expensive, and attending a college without the academics you want to study is not very useful. Both must be satisfied before anything else matters.

*Note that an undecided student’s academic fit means that all of his/her possible areas of interest are offered, and the various possible majors of interest are not limited-access or competitive admission after enrolling at the school. This may be a more difficult fit than for a student who is firmly decided on his/her major and other academic interests.

24

I think “fit” is very important and you can find a school that fits in all sizes and price ranges. If you know what your price range is then you can start looking for schools that fall into that range and you will see some small, mid sized and very large colleges. You also can go out of state for a very reasonable rate depending on where you want to go and what you are looking for. My youngest D is looking at two OOS schools that would be within $1k a year of our in state schools for the major she is looking into.

Kid’s today at least have the power of the internet to assist on looking at schools. My D has spent quite a bit of time doing virtual tours, checking out YouTube video’s of campus tours, etc. Back in my day, the only way to see a school was to actually go to the campus.

We started our searches first by looking at who offered my D’s intended Major’s and who had the best ranked programs . After that we started to look at location, size of school, cost, and all the extra’s like sports, activities, greek life, etc.

I would stay start with your state, do a search to see what colleges are in your state you live in. Start looking at what they have to offer and see if any appeal to you. Rural vs Urban, Small vs Large, Close vs Far, etc. If you start looking at OOS schools look to see if they have reciprocity or participate in an exchange program like the Midwest Student Exchange. Programs like those can make an OOS school much more affordable if they are available to you.

25

While I completely understand why people focus on fit to try to ensure their happiness, it might be time to mention some possible drawbacks.

Take for example what seems to be a very common set of criteria on collegeconfidential:

East or West coast
Elite student body & reputation
Leans a certain way politically
Non-religious
No big-time sports culture
Few or no required classes

The student might find multiple schools that fit all criteria. Might apply to ten of them. Might get accepted at 5 of them. Might attend one of them , fit in perfectly, and go on to have a wonderful career and life.

So where’s the rub?

Well, here’s what that student might, MIGHT be missing:

How interesting some parts of non-coastal America can be. How the Iowa countryside is not flat at all, & really does look like a Grant Wood landscape painting. That people in Arkansas can be really smart. That Montana has some amazing restaurants.

That being at the high end of the grade spectrum has its benefits. The even people with less than a 1500 SAT can be interesting.

That people with opposing political views are not necessarily crazy.

That there are all sorts of religions & all sorts of believers. That an enormous amount of history & current events are based on religion, & having first-hand experience with religious people can be enlightening.

That it can actually be fun to attend a college hockey game.

That philosophy or chemistry isn’t as useless as everybody said it was.

All I’m saying is that college is supposed to involve some exploring of new things and uncomfortable ideas. But fit to some, (SOME!) people seems to be the opposite of that…that at age 17 (17!) they already know that flyover country is a wasteland, that you have to be surrounded by high acievers to learn best, that religion is balderdash, that there is nothing to be gained from hearing opposing political viewoints, that their breadth of knowledge is already plenty wide, that sports are boring.

Yes, I know some 17 year olds are geniuses…they have already seen the world, learned all they can from common people, made a careful assessment of religion and politics, mastered philosophy, ancient history and geology, been bored to death by sports…& therefore, darn it, will be dreadfully unhappy if the don’t get their coasal, elite, x-leaning, non-religious, unsporty bubble where they can spend 4 years studying the one subject that they don’t already know about. I’m not talking about THOSE kids.

26

Love your post @moooop! College is a huge opportunity for (all kinds of) education, and shouldn’t be just an echo chamber.

27

Also, the idea of affordability needs explaining further. I firmly disagree that only the wealthy elite can find schools that “fit” them, because schools are just not affordable for most people.

That’s incorrect. One other person already pointed out that in-state schools can vary according to size and mission. That’s one important point. The other important point is that schools’ “sticker prices” are high but what they tend to charge students really varies greatly.

While the on-website cost calculators are important tools (and you should definitely use them), it’s hard to look at 2000+ schools and contemplate using the net price calculators for each school to figure out if that school is in the “affordable” range.

One handy tool that you may want to use to narrow school is called College Navigator. It’s a government website https://nces.ed.gov/collegenavigator/ . On the left you can find a pretty handy search engine to find schools by various criteria like geography, size, etc.

But what I find most useful is to 1) locate your desired college then 2) clidk on the NET PRICE tab. That breaks down the average cost of that school crucially by income level.

There are some nice surprises and not all of the bargains are “elite” schools that accept 4.0+ averages. For examples of really nice, solid schools that dip lower in averages AND which can provide pretty darn good FA, see for example Drew U.; University of the Pacific; Beloit; and many others.

In addition I’d like to simply mention that U of Maine at Orono still is offering an in-state tuition matching program. Go to that site and look up scholarships. I’ve been impressed especially with its environmental programs; ABET accredited engineering programs; and theater, among other. Also it’s ranked as having one of the more attractive campuses and it has an airport close by.

28

One MAJOR piece of the puzzle that will limit your selection of colleges is MONEY. You need to sit down with your parents and have a serious discussion of how much $$ each year they are willing to provide for your education. Do not let them brush you off with a “we will see once acceptances come it” or a “if you get into X prestigious college, we will find a way to send you there”. Sit down with them and show them actual expense figures for the colleges you might be interested in.

It matters if you have older siblings already in college, or younger siblings coming along that will also need college funding. Ask if your parents have put aside $$ into a college savings account specifically for you. Or will they sell an asset, or fund college with current income as you attend? Do they expect you to take out student loans, live at home and commute, or pay for your housing/meals with your own money from working part time?

Finances should be your Main “Fit” question. With your parents limiting the number of applications, you need to check ahead of time to determine if a college is affordable for you and your family. I strongly urge you to find what is referred to here in this forum as a “SAFETY” school. One (or two) schools that will be affordable to your family, and where your GPA and test scores are above the median range for that school, with a higher acceptance rate. You want to have Safety schools that you would be willing to attend if you get accepted.

Knowing who you are, how you feel about moving far from home, how adaptable your personality is to meeting new people, making friends easily, sharing personal space with roommates, willingness to join clubs, volunteer, get out into the city beyond the college campus to have adventures, etc. If you have grown up in a big city, a rural campus may seem boring. If you need the security of family close by, don’t move across the country. All of this can factor into choosing a college, but only after you have filtered out colleges that you and your family can not afford.

29

Finances may preclude finding a safety school for some students. If the student lives where in-state public schools are too expensive with poor financial aid, and the automatic large-enough scholarship schools s/he qualifies for do not have his/her (relatively common) intended major(s), then the student may be stuck with an all-reach list for reasons other than the reason commonly stated on these forums.

30

We looked at it as a 3-legged stool, with 1 leg academics, 1 leg financial, and 1 leg ‘fit’. You need all 3 legs to be about the same in order not to wobble but be a comfortable seat. For one daughter, the ‘fit’ included her sport but it was not more important than finances or academics.

31

I’m with ucbalumnus. The first and most important part of “fit” is having the major field(s) a student is thinking of majoring in. Without that part, a college won’t work except for jobs that need “a” degree and only if the student can be happy studying something other than what they like.

Second comes finances because many folks in the US simply aren’t at a “cost is no factor” point in life and just getting loans isn’t wise (or even always possible). However, this is where fit can be trickier because both merit and need based aid come into play. List price is not always list price with those variables. This is where some work needs to be done to find places that are likely to be affordable.

Beyond those two, how much fit matters depends upon the student. Some people can be happy anywhere. They morph to fit in or don’t care that they don’t. That’s just a human trait that some have and others (most) do not. Others want to be in/near a city or out in the country. They thrive in heat or cold. They love or hate sports. They love or hate partying and/or Greek life. Some want to explore new areas, others like or need to be closer to home. Dorm set ups vary. Class schedules vary (semester/trimester/co-op/etc). One can be anonymous in a large class and love it or prefer being in a class of 20+ with a bit of discussion rather than a lecture. There really are lots of factors that can be considered (or don’t need to be pending the human involved).

Fit can literally make or break some students. Some who aren’t sure about college and future life go away, find their “tribe” and thrive beyond expectations. It’s a neat thing to see. At the other end of the spectrum, some really great students go away, don’t find their tribe, and at best wonder what college was all about - why the hype? At worst… well… to be blunt, suicide and/or suicidal thoughts. I’ve seen it. It’s super sad. In the middle and lower end of the bell curve are those who thought college was so-so and/or those who can’t get a job with their degree or have too much debt to pay off. At the middle toward the higher end are folks who enjoyed themselves along the way.

Since life is a journey and the path along the way counts for something, 'tis wise to make it enjoyable if at all possible. For those who are naturally happy anywhere, this is easy. They only have the first two aspects of fit to consider. For the rest of us, putting more effort into it is worthwhile. It’s nice to be able to feel one had a wonderful college journey vs merely feeling, “well, I got my degree.”

Not everyone knows to even think about fit. Later on in life, many (I know) wish they had (for financial or “tribe” reasons). It’s why many of us who do know about it suggest it to those looking.

32

ps I remember reading an article this past year talking about how a student not feeling like they had friends or fit in is the #1 cause of student suicide in college. I don’t have time to try to look up that article now, but I’ve often wondered what could have been if that student had only selected elsewhere. We’ll never know. But, as parents and educators our take away in the discussion afterward is that we NEED to encourage students to get involved in things they like - to find that friend (or two or twenty - number depends upon the student). If that is not happening, then red flags need to be raised. This is not just happening to the introvert - often it’s the extrovert who was popular in school, but has trouble finding friends at college for whatever reason. No student is immune.

33

What’s your idea of “fit”? Is it a verb or a noun? I graduated from three different universities, and I’ve never considered whether each university is a good “fit” for me other than the major. I went to each of these schools because of the major, and then I found ways to “fit” in. Worked great for me. For this reason, I never went on a college tour for either of my sons to find their “fit,” except when they happened to be nearby while on a family vacation trip. I suppose if your family has the time and the money to spend on multiple college visits, they won’t hurt. But methinks folks make just a bit too much of college visits to find that “fit” like you actually would after spending a couple of hours on the campus on one particular day under one particular weather on one particular season and one particular weekday (or weekend), etc.

34

There’s really no “perfect fit” school. Affordability is the foundation of your college search. Rainbows and fireworks mean nothing if you can’t pay for it. Such is life. You make trade-offs and adapt and be thankful that you get the opportunity to go to college. Colleges are very diverse places and you can always find clubs and organizations with like-minded people.

35

It would not be surprising if one of the most common fit factors on these forums (other than cost and academic offerings) is prestige/exclusivity/selectivity, whether or not that is explicitly stated. Seems like a lot of students feel like they would be unhappy attending a non-reach school that they feel is “beneath them”. Or their parents feel that way.

36

@ucbalumnus From my experience, I totally agree that “prestige” as part of fit is just on this forum. I’ve often wondered if that’s due to our living in a rural location, though now that I think about it, we have our own form of prestige I suppose. I’ve seen students upset if they didn’t get into or couldn’t afford Penn St. Locally that’s the best school out there according to many.

37

A friend knew where she was going to school from birth. Her parents went there, her brother went there, she’d been to the campus numerous times. She was a smart kid, in the top 5% of the class, but there was no changing her mind. This was her school.

Did this make it a perfect fit or a bad fit? No. She made it the right fit for her because she determined that that’s where she was going. Was there a better choice out there? Probably one that would have cost less, but that wasn’t important to her.

Have another friend who tried to make a high ranked school work. She found she really needed to live at home and commute, so fit of the school became unimportant. She goes to the campus, takes her classes, and that’s it. Doesn’t really matter if the school has 1000 students or 30,000, if it has cool places to eat near it or modern dorms or lots of clubs to join. She doesn’t need or use any of those things.

38

I am a big fit proponent. I have seen too many students struggle and end up unhappy at schools and then transfer somewhere that they do much better from a personal/academic perspective. I believe that I would have fit in where ever I went to school, but I know that some are not as easily adaptable. We all want our kids to flourish and at the same time get the job done with getting their education. Some can not worry about fit (we all have to play the cards we are dealt when it comes to going to college), but if we have options should want to find the right balance of location, school size, academics, costs and any other criteria that make up “fit”. I don’t worry about prestige as much as seeing if a college/university can get my kids where they are trying to go long term based on their own strengths and weaknesses.

39

@elseanmc I work in a private high-school and specialize in elite college applications. So, with all due respect to the many people offering you support, I want to reiterate:

In elite college applications, or where aid is needed, “fit” is not related to if they have your major or your sport… if you know those things. (But honestly, most schools offer a path for most students interests. And the schools that care most about fit will let your self-design a major, anyway. So, I almost never make “do they have your major” one of my first issues.
Most schools do most majors. And I am not sure a 17year old should have a career picked out or need to know what their major is anyway. How many careers do you even know exist? Do you even know what all of the majors are? No. And that is absolutely fine!). Nor does fit have anything to do with being located in a certain city or state, or urban vs. rural…

All of those things are “pre-fit” considerations. Those are your “check-list issues.”. You do need to know those things, but check them off before you look for “fit.”

And cost isn’t as much of a factor, in many cases, as people believe it is. Because most “good schools” will help pay for elite kids who are a good fit, especially the good LACs. In fact, the more a school priorotizes “fit,” the more they are likely to help make attendance affordable for students who they feel are a good fit.
And attending a school like that is transformative.

Not all schools care about “fit,” though. So, there is no need to break your neck looking for fit, if you don’t care and the school doesn’t care. Some people just satisfy their checklist and enroll. And that is fine. For them. ( I wouldn’t choose that, but, then, am one I do this job because I believe education should be a transformative experience. And I think finding your fit is critical to that. However, if it isn’t an attractive idea to you, then there is no need to worry about it. Just don’t apply to the schools that care about it.

The schools that will care about fit are not taking students based on the numbers in their transcript. They are looking to craft a community and they are accepting people into the cohort who will bring something to the community that the college sees as meaningful. They pick people who they believe understand the school’s goals, values, personality… Identity… And have chosen to apply, for personal reasons, in the hopes of belonging to the community as they pursue both academic and personal growth, in community and as individuals.

Also, contrary to the advice I see offered here, I personally would tell a student who was unsure of her major NOT to attend a big University, but rather a more flexible LAC that doesn’t require you to declare a major til the end of your Sophomore year. Contrary to common belief, being undeclared at a big University causes more problems. Scheduling preference is given to students within the major. Some schools don’t offer certain classes to anyone who is not a declared major. In state universities, upon declaring a major, students frequently find that courses they took will not count for the major. And, changing a major is pushing University graduation rates out to 5 and 6 years with alarming frequency. Also, a large University may have more limited opportunities to apply for an extension of Financial Aid if that happens, and many students are finding themselves unable to complete their degrees for that reason.

Now… If you always wanted to go to Purdue or U.Mass, and you can afford it, and you know you want to be a Vet or an Engineer, or an accountant, and you don’t care about your fit, and you will make the swim team, and you like the weather… Then good… Check your boxes and go.

But if you want something else, invest the time to find it and pursue it. Mostly, I have found, that kids who are talking about “fit” and realize that it is more than your checklist, as you seem to, probably want that kind of school.

Do you have any thoughts on where you might be thinking about applying?

40

That seems to be the college’s notion of fit, meaning how desirable the student is to the college, which is different from the apparent question about the student’s notion of fit, meaning how desirable the college is to the student.

Obviously, the college’s notion of fit matters for those colleges that use it, in terms of the student making a realistic assessment of how likely s/he will be admitted. But that is not necessarily the same as how desirable the college is to the student.

For the vast majority of college-bound students who will go to colleges that are not highly selective and therefore base most or all of admissions decisions on academic credentials, the fit question is mostly in terms of how desirable the college is to the student, starting with affordability and academic offerings (yes, those can be check boxes, but they are important ones that seem to be frequently ignored in college fit threads), and possibly going on to other factors of interest to the student once these are met.