<p>Assuming 66% acceptance rate (including the 26 accepted from waitlist) of 1700 = 1122
So, out of the 1122 students, there are only about 20% Asian. That makes the total of 224 students. Half of the students have to be female. That will reduce to 112 students. That's is a sad number. Most of the Asian will probably from California, Texas or East coast. So, how many is left for the midwest? May be 2. OK, 2 out of 1122, it is about 0.17%. This is really sad!!!!!! Why are they using quota system instead of finding the best candidates regardless of gender or race? Think about it.</p>
<p>First of all, Asians as a whole are probably closer to 30% of the admitted students.</p>
<p>Second, there isn’t a quota system. They evaluate each student individually and holistically. Yes, there is affirmative action, and yes, Asians do not really benefit in affirmative action, but it isn’t by strict quotas.</p>
<p>Third, you are assuming that Asians male are the best candidates. That is faulty logic. There are strong applicants from all races, ethnicities, and both genders. Yes, I know a few Asian males who did not get in and are very qualified; however, it is also possible that some of them focused so much on being great at academics, that they failed to explore their options outside the classroom. Also, how are you judging them to be the best applicants? GPA, SAT scores? Such standardized metrics may be useful to determine minimum qualifications for admissions, but they fail to reveal much of the depth of an applicant. Hence the holistic process, it would be boring and flawed to just admit students based on GPA and test scores.</p>
<p>Fourth, if you compare the aforementioned 30% with the general population, Asians are overrepresented at MIT, and at most colleges. African Americans and Caucasians are actually the victims, as they are underrepresented at top schools relative to the racial make-up of the US population at large.</p>
<p>If it weren’t for affirmative action, I think colleges would be more homogeneous and boring. If MIT didn’t admit females at such a high rate, it’s gender ratio might be more like 66M/33F, which would be terrible (I would not go to a school like this, and plenty of techy schools are like this). I would also not want to go to a school dominated by one race/ethnicity, regardless of whether or not that is my ethnicity. </p>
<p>So, I think affirmative action is a necessary part of college admissions. Maybe it is done too excessively, and, sometimes, it may not be the fairest system. However, it is ultimately good.</p>
<p>Hey OP, Asian Male right here too.</p>
<p>Best advice I can give you, learn to live with it. You want to whine? It’s there in college and beyond (med schools cough), so get over it. You can always use your race+gender as an excuse, or you can get busy trying to be your absolute best. Your call.</p>
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I’m most impressed that you were able to get a six-exclamation-point conclusion from totally speculative numbers.</p>
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<p>Imagination, the padawan has… LOL 
+1</p>
<p>To Jalmoreno,</p>
<p>I think your email is a little harsh? Whether you like it or not, there is an “unofficial” quota system. Please go and read some of the MIT information. Besides, I did not say Asian Male are the best candidates. In fact, I say all candidates apply to MIT are mostly elite regardless of race. There are some Asian that are ■■■■■■■■ too! Affirmative action is another issue and I am not going to debate or discuss about it. I am just purely pointing the fact. I bet you never in the situation where you were treated different because of your race or color. Think about those people’s feelings not just yours. </p>
<p>Oasis. I did not whine but simply stating the fact or statistic. Glad you are in MIT but I don’t think you were ever in situation like those who lost their opportunity because of the race. . Taiwan is pretty much close to 100% Chinese and therefore you should wait and tell me about it when you American Citizen’s child going to college in another 20+ years (May be). Your feeling for those parents and the children will be different. You are still young and you will learn the meaning and the word “sympathy” for those kids who worked hard.</p>
<p>Phoestre: :). Glad you have the humor and imagination too! </p>
<p>Thanks to the parent who wrote to me privately about what he/she felt. This is not about anyone particular but just feel sympathy for everyone that who worked hard over the years and got caught in the system. There is no perfect system out there.</p>
<p>I meant no offense, if taken so :)</p>
<p>I do not understand the part about 66% acceptance rate. What do you mean here? Those who accept their admission offers? If so, I think its higher and this wouldn’t be related in any way to the point you are defending.</p>
<p>Whatever there are 20% or 30% Asians in the incoming batch, it is still an EXTREMELY high number for a country, whose Asian population(Asian and mixed-raced Asians) is estimated to be 6% only. I might be wrong on the actual number but you can always check U.S. Census Bureau. I don’t know the specific admit rate for Asians(how many Asians admitted vs. applied) but those numbers alone tell that the “chances” are in their favor. Not saying this is an inequality but the reason is most likely that they are education-wise superior to majority of their peers, which is something to respect.
If you ask me, there are no negative affirmative action against Asians at MIT at all.</p>
<p>Here is a recent thread at cc
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1146472-tiger-childs-view-paper-tigers-what-happens-all-asian-american-overachievers.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1146472-tiger-childs-view-paper-tigers-what-happens-all-asian-american-overachievers.html</a>
and the article
[What</a> Happens to All the Asian-American Overachievers When the Test-Taking Ends? – New York Magazine](<a href=“http://nymag.com/news/features/asian-americans-2011-5/]What”>What Happens to All the Asian-American Overachievers When the Test-Taking Ends? -- New York Magazine - Nymag)</p>
<p>This is the real world, not an ideal world. There are going to be multiple standards. There will be disappointment. </p>
<p>Freshmen admission for elite schools is certainly eye-opening for some.
Fortunately, classes and professors grading will be totally merit based.
In the workplace (apart from advancing in the corporate ladder), only the strong and those who delivers will survive. There is really no room for mediocrity.</p>
<p>Be grateful that you are given the opportunities to compete, and you are already at a different league…</p>
<p>Phoestre,</p>
<p>66% is the percent of students admitted to actually going to MIT. Whether 20 or 30% is the percentage, the number of students they can take per year is only so many. So, regardless of race, the number of applicants actually going there are low. </p>
<p>DadWith2Sons,</p>
<p>I did not look into tiger mother because not all Asian have the same mentality. That’s a extreme case and I think the mom was just trying to sell her book. I hope you do not equate all Asian women you know to be tiger mothers. It is a real world out there and reality can be harsh or cold. Yes, an opportunity to compete and in a different league are what it counts. You obviously did not personally knew someone that was graded different by a professor in the university because of the race. The professor even told a bunch of foreigners that they were there to take advantage of the system… We always hope that all the professors will grade based on the merit but it is not in every case. In other cases, we knew professors that did the reverse.</p>
<p>I agree there should be no room for mediocrity but the American public school system does promote it from young. Everyone needs to feel good. However, we should always remind ourself not to be carky too. When you say “Get over it and move on,” my answer is who is not? People that cannot move on will probably gone by now. May be your level is sympathy for those kids including yours is so much higher than everyone else. I hope you feel for your kids sometimes. No offense.</p>
<p>Sorry if I came across as harsh, I meant to be discursive and it ended up coming across as angry. That’s what happens when I type fast (hence why I typed this response much slower ;)</p>
<p>Affirmative Action is unfair. So is athletic privileged, so is legacy, and so are numerous other faults in the admissions process. I think we are on the same side here cheme12; however, US colleges don’t really use quota systems for affirmative action, Since California v. Bakke ruled this type of affirmative action unconstitutional in UC schools, colleges have moved towards non-quota affirmative action. Instead, many use points systems, where they give points to minorities to boost their applications. MIT may not use this specific system, as “holistic” is a rather broad term, but I do not think they use quotas for domestic applicants.</p>
<p>It’s sad that affirmative action hurts some people. I still think a diverse campus is a necessity; however, I think other socioeconomic factors are an important part of this too. My opinion is that affirmative actions is necessary, but it may be done excessively. Maybe this will change for the distant future (like when our kids, if we have some, are applying) but for the present, we just have to deal with the cards we are dealt.</p>
<p>BTW, on not being discriminated by color, I have been. But, luckily, not too much. Hopefully in the future, this discrimination will decrease even further. However, even though I have not been discriminated against much on a personal level, I have seen discrimination against others, especially since I moved from NYC to a small town down in FL (self-discrimination is the rule where I live, whether in neighborhoods or in school. I think this aspect of my town sucks, and I’m glad to be leaving soon).</p>
<p>Here’s the great thing, however. MIT rejects so many qualified applicants (because they get too many to admit) but many of these applicants can be successful anywhere. If you are one of these cheme12, I wish you the best of luck, wherever you are going, and I’m sure you will have a great college experience (and, you will get more sleep and not be as stressed nor overworked.)</p>
<p>we do accept the best candidates, regardless of gender + race. </p>
<p>your speculative numbers - or assumptions that asian males from the midwest are necessarily the best candidates - are the issue, i think.</p>
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<p>I AM a US citizen - I jumped through the same hoops that everyone else did here.</p>
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<p>Do you want to sympathize with me about why I didn’t get into Harvard Med or Yale Med? Do you think I don’t know what it feels sometimes to be an overrepresented minority in higher education?</p>
<p>The issue is that you are trying to place the blame of not getting into good schools on race+gender. Like I said before, and I will say again, you can wallow in those explanations if that makes you feel better at the day, but the reality is that you can’t keep assigning to the blame to that. </p>
<p>Don’t get me wrong, I’m not trying to have no sympathy for you or purposely attempting to be antagonistic, but it seems like you are just fishing for sympathetic posts here.</p>
<p>Best of luck to you.</p>
<p>To Oasis,</p>
<p>Sorry about your med schools but I am not placing any blame on race+gender. I sympathy those who worked hard and didn’t make it because it is just too competitive this year and the system doesn’t work well either. That will include you, Oasis. Over representative for minority in higher education for Asian is a problem. The result of all these are Asian compete with Asian and Carcasian compete with Carcasian. Somehow, it will not be right to a campus full of Asian unless you are in Asia. So, to be politically correct, they will call it “diversified background” or however they want to call them, it is still like a “unofficial quota” system.</p>
<p>We knew too many Taiwanese that are dual citizenship. So, when you say you are American, are you a Taiwanese too? They called themself American but when leave the country, they hold 2 passports and claimed themself as Taiwanese when they visit Taiwan. Anyway, that’s another subject. I hope you are a real American who only have 1 citizenship. Whether you hold 1 or 2 passports, I salute you for working hard for your own future. I hope you continue to work hard and will one day be someone that fix the system. :)</p>
<p>MTChris,</p>
<p>If I were in your position, I will say the same thing “We do accept the best candidates, regardless of gender + race.” </p>
<p>"your speculative numbers - or assumptions that asian males from the midwest are necessarily the best candidates - are the issue, i think. " - No, I just think MIT accept too few people and put too many people on waitlist. MIT should think about expanding the campus and accepting more capable students. According to this year’s waitlist letter or email, MIT had more qualify candidates than other years. May be because there were more applicants but the number of spots were too limited. Also, many coastal students have Professional Consultants to help them in applying for those Ivy leagues or MIT… Students in the midwest or international don’t have that type of services or cannot afford those type of services. So, that will decrease the acceptance rate for the midwest or international students. As I said before, there is no perfect system and we just have to work with what we have. I am just hoping MIT will fix this problem in the future. By then, 2012 will be here and there may not be such thing as earth. 
Just kidding! Have a great day!</p>
<p>To Jalmerono,</p>
<p>Thanks and I agree with you.</p>
<p>Cheme, what makes you think that the students admitted weren’t the best candidates, or that “coastal students have professional consultants” while students in the midwest do not and cannot afford the service? Have you even considered how many Asian males there are total in the midwest?</p>
<p>Cheme12, may I ask why it is sad that 25% of MIT’s student body is Asian when only 5% of the American population is Asian? May I also ask why it is sad that 50% of the Asian students at MIT are female?
I don’t see the problem with that either. Any student body deviating significantly from a 50/50 balance would be considered sexist. </p>
<p>In addition, you claim that maybe 2/112 Asian males at MIT come from the midwest. That is 1.8%; According to U.S. Census data, approximately 12% of Americans identifying themselves as Asian live in the midwest. Therefore, let us assume that 13 of the 112 Asian male students at MIT are from the midwest. 13/1122 Is slightly over 1% of MIT students. Considering that 0.7% of America are Asians living in the midwest, that is still better than the national average.</p>
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<p>Yes, I understand what you’re trying to get at, but personally I just don’t see any need to to have sympathy for things like this. (by the way, my Harvard med comment was a satirical rhetorical question) If I don’t get into the schools I want to, then I’m just not a good match or I’m not competitive enough. That’s it - end of story. Race+gender don’t matter.</p>
<p>If you consider the fact that only 4% of the US is Asian and that MIT is 25+% Asian, I think schools like MIT are already doing Asians a favor by taking so many of us. </p>
<p>Basically the arguments here all turn out to be affirmative action arguments so I’m not going to repeat them because I don’t want to sound like a broken record, but even if affirmative action may be flawed, I am quite happy that the US isn’t a complete meritocracy where people get in purely as a function of their standardized test scores. I’ve been in both schooling systems, and I can honestly say that I enjoyed my classmates and peers under the American system much more, rather than the soulless test-taking machines that thrive under an exam-based system. If this means that I get “shafted” in favor of other people for the sake of diversity or whatever, then so be it. I don’t see anything wrong with that.</p>
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<p>I do not hold Taiwanese citizenship, nor have I ever held it.</p>
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<p>This is a terrible idea. One of the parts I love the most about MIT is how we are not 1600+ per class like Harvard.</p>
<p>This thread is rife with bad arguments on both sides. Somewhere a statistics professor is crying.</p>
<p>I’d like to point out that there were a lot more than two Asian males who got into MIT from my Midwest high school alone in the year I graduated. Granted, I went to a weird high school, but obviously there were more than 2 Asian males per year getting into MIT out of the entire midwest.</p>
<p>Why do some of you guys keep referring to the U.S. Census data???
Do you suggest NBA take players based on the Census data?</p>
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<p>I argue that what MIT does is a meritocracy - it’s just not an SAT-score based meritocracy. Ideally, we’d have a nice standardized test score system that actually worked, and we could make the meritocracy clear-cut. As it stands, however, MIT takes a bazillion other things into account because that is how they will find the people who have actually done the most valuable things/are most likely to do awesome things. It’s the best system we can currently come up with.</p>
<p>what piper said. SAT scores aren’t merit. they are one component of judging academic preparedness, which itself is one component of merit.</p>