How many valedictorians don't graduate?

Parents Forum
1

<p>Our son's school determines valedictorian at the end of 1st semester of the senior year and our son was named valedictorian. He had been well ahead of the #2 student but, due to an extraordinarily heavy schedule senior year (at his choosing), he tied with another student for valedictorian. He is taking 10 classes this year while the normal schedule is 7 - only 24 credits are required to graduate with the advanced diploma; he will have 40. However, he burned out this year. He only needed 2 classes to graduate - government and English. He is taking the AP version of both with the AP English Lit class being on line. In English, he currently has a 22 average for the 2nd semester after earning a 75 average for the first semester and it is looking like there is almost no chance of him graduating. We have worked with him all year to pass this course, short of doing the work for him. We are at a complete loss and don't have any idea of how to proceed. He has accepted the offer of admission he received from UAB, including the very generous scholarship he earned from being a National Merit Finalist. </p>

<p>We can't afford full freight to send him to college. If he loses his acceptance and scholarship, I don't believe he will ever go to college, other than maybe community college. He has so much potential and it makes me sick to think of what he has thrown away.</p>

<p>He can take English over the summer and graduate in early August but I don't know if that will even be considered by UAB. We have told him to set up a call with his educational counselor this week to see if there is any chance they will accept an August graduation but I am not optimistic. </p>

<p>Has anyone ever faced this and been successful in getting a student into college? I really don't want to see him lose his admission and scholarship. He has learned a valuable lesson about over-scheduling this year (taking 10 college or college level classes, among many extracurriculars) and I'd hate for that to cost him his entire future.</p>

2

<p>Definitely talk to UAB in order to understand their policies. Communication is far better than continuing to stick your head in the sand.</p>

<p>Also, talk to your high school GC. Perhaps he can withdraw completely from school prior to the end of the semester and have his last semester deleted. He could then take English and government over the summer. The GC might be able to propose some other action to minimize the impact of this semsester.</p>

3

<p>Yep, I’ve seen it before. It doesn’t have to be the end of the world.</p>

<p>“If he loses his acceptance and scholarship, I don’t believe he will ever go to college, other than maybe community college.”</p>

<p>What leads you to this belief? He got a glass of cold water in the face, but college isn’t going anywhere. There’s always next year. Even if he loses his place at UAB, this isn’t the only scholarship in America. Think about what the adults in the household are modeling for him. Are you signaling to him that this is a catastrophe, or that it’s a problem he needs to work to solve, with your support?</p>

4

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<p>Most likely not going to happen. If student withdraws from school, he probably won’t be will not be able to attend summer session because he wont be an enrolled student (will most likely have to re-enroll in September to be a Jan grad). Even if he should graduate, if he is burnt out, he could probably benefit from a gap year, just to decompress, so that his head could be in a better place when he starts college.</p>

<p>I agree with Hanna, if he fails and his admission is rescinded, reapply and go to school fall 2014.</p>

5

<p>Some schools/school systems allow grade/credit replacement. Others don’t. We know students, though not valedictorians, who have to finish in summer school. Most went onto their accepted school in the Fall. However, sometimes the failure was a warning sign. I think your child sounds exhausted, but could there be some underlying mental health issues, ie depression, anxiety, etc?</p>

<p>It also sounds like a deferment is in order to let your son recharge his batteries…</p>

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<p>It sounds like a gap year would be a good idea for your son. Find out if he can defer admission at UAB and also if they’ll rescind admission if the grades are too low. I’d also get your kid some counseling - it sounds like more than burnout. I think flunking a course he needs to graduate is a cry for help. Just hearing from you that he doesn’t have to go to UAB in the fall may be a huge relief to him.</p>

7

<p>I’m so sorry. I’m guessing he has learned a valuable lesson about overextending himself and of being too competitive either with himself or others to negative consequence. I would definitely talk to the GC and see what can be salvaged so not to lose the UAB situation. But I would definitely have a heart to heart to see if perhaps your son needs a break before starting college to get some reasonable priorities in place. Maybe he won’t need this because right now he’s learning a huge lesson. On the other hand you have to wonder WHY a student would take 10 classes when 7 were needed. That might need exploration. As for the OP, I would suggest not over dramatizing this, but also don’t feel guilty about letting your S bite off more than he could chew. It IS a valuable lesson he’s learning that will only help him in the future.</p>

8

<p>Thanks for the responses. Looks like, in an effort to keep my original post from becoming a novel, I left out some details that could be useful.</p>

<p>We have been in constant contact (almost weekly) with his counselor this year. She is a great counselor and adores our son but the only option she sees at this point is for him to take English over the summer and graduate in August (he has an A in government so no need to take that one again, especially for $550). We don’t see the value in him withdrawing now; he has completed one course (earned an A in differential equations through CTY) and has 8 other courses that he is doing well (won the highest academic award for his college physics class) or acceptably in so we’re not sure why it would be a good idea to throw all of that away. He has plenty of credits to graduate – 24 are required, he has 31 and will have 39 in a couple of weeks, not including English. The problem is that he doesn’t have the right credits to graduate – he has 3 English credits but he needs 4. We could have switched him to the regular English class early in the school year but we had no idea things were going to get this bad and it was too late once we all realized this was going to be a significant problem. Our son tends to work better under pressure and says he works better leaving things until the last minute. He just left it too long and had too many other things going on to be able to pull it out at the last minute. There is still the very slimmest of chances that he will pull the grade to passing but it gets less likely every day. Even assuming he can earn a 100 on his final, he needs a 44 average for 2nd semester to pull off a D. He currently has a 21.97 and there aren’t too many more assignments to be factored in.</p>

<p>As for counseling, my husband and I have been to a counselor to discuss this several times. At the counselor’s recommendation, we did not push our son to go but offered for him to see the same counselor or a different counselor, his choice. He absolutely refused. We could force him to go but we can’t force him to talk so it didn’t make any sense to force him.</p>

<p>We have tried to work with him on this but he wants nothing to do with us. We know nothing and he knows everything. We and his counselor urged him to lighten his load this year. We were all concerned but he needs to start making decisions for himself. He took on too much and, hopefully, has learned from it. I think he might have - he showed me his plan for his 4 years at UAB and it is reasonable, no semester over 16 credits and he balanced known tough classes (organic chem) with some less tough classes. We have talked to him about the possibility of waiting out a year. He is graduating young (just turned 17) so it wouldn’t even really cost him any time. He is not interested. It really doesn’t seem like he’s not ready for college, in fact, quite the opposite. It seems like he’s sick of high school and really wants to move on to college.</p>

<p>The reason we believe he won’t ever go to college if he doesn’t go now is that there is no money. We can’t imagine a school giving him a scholarship after this debacle. If they would, then why do schools withdraw acceptances, much less a scholarship, for a sudden drop in grades senior year? If they would, then our last hope of talking to UAB to see if they will still take him may work.</p>

<p>Thanks lastminutemom196, it is helpful to know this can happen. I spoke to our son’s guidance counselor a few minutes ago and asked her if she thought there was any chance UAB would still taken him. She thinks there is a possibility. She still thinks of our son as a very special kid and thinks UAB may be willing to take a chance on him because he’s so accomplished.</p>

<p>Our next decision is whether to have our son make the call to UAB himself, if his dad and I should call or if we should all call together. It is his life and his responsibility but I’m not sure he can make the best case.</p>

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<p>I am curious as to how his grade got to be so low (this is the internet–I am not being snarky or trying to rub salt in his wound).?</p>

<p>If it is a matter of his having missed some of his assignments, could a call to the class provider help? Maybe you and the GC could persuade the class provider to permit some assignments to be made up, or redone, with the new grade and old grade on an assignment averaged together.</p>

<p>Just a few better grades could get him where he needs to be.</p>

10

<p>From the OP:
"and I’d hate for that to cost him his entire future. "
Seriously? You mean if he doesn’t get into UAB this Fall, then he goes to the penetentiary for life imprisonment?
It may shock the Op but there are plenty of happy successful people that didn’t graduate from UAB, or didn’t go to UAB right away, and even some that didn’t go to college at all! This is sure a wrench he has thrown in the works, but it isn’t- UAB or no future.</p>

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<p>To be clear, we are not pushing him to go to UAB or even to college this year. He had a better scholarship at VCU and, in some ways, the program at VCU was better for his future plans. He only got excited about 2 schools that we visited - MIT and UAB. It’s good he didn’t plan on going to MIT, that acceptance would certainly have been rescinded. At least there is still a chance at UAB.</p>

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<p>Re: #10</p>

<p>It seems like the OP is painting a dire picture with respect to college affordability without a big merit scholarship:</p>

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<p>Whether that is actually the case, or if the OP is overreacting or overstressing, depends on whether the OP has investigated all angles of his/her college financing situation.</p>

<p>But “ever” is probably too strong a word. Even if the OP has high income but is nowhere close to affording the need-based EFC for college, the student could attend college after age 24, marriage, or military service without financial aid being limited by the OP’s income.</p>

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<p>We and the counselor have already been in touch with the English teacher and she has already allowed him to make up some old assignments. His grade is that low because he has so many 0s. He has been given many chances to make up old work but wouldn’t meet the deadlines.</p>

14

<p>The money situation is the truth. Merit scholarships were his only option. We have been screwed royally by this economy and he isn’t our only kid. I’m not going to get into the details of our finances but we do not have money to cover even our in state school (UAB is out of state for us). We will not cosign loans for him either, particularly with his irresponsible behavior this year. We’ve heard of too many bad things happening to parents that cosign loans. UAB is the only school we are discussing at this point because it is the offer he accepted. He turned down the other 6 acceptances so those are not an option. Yes, he can go to school as an independent in many years (he’s only 17 and just turned 17) but that’s a long time away for a kid that had planned to go to undergrad and then an MD/PhD program. He is capable of achieving quite a bit and it is incredibly sad and frustrating to see him do this. He is an incredibly bright kid with a lot of potential. These are his goals he is throwing away, not ours. We didn’t even know about MD/PhD programs until he expressed interest. Again, these are his goals that we are trying to help him reach.</p>

<p>And, I just found out that he lied to my face again about English. He told me that he turned in 2 major assignments on Friday that might have pulled him through but the English teacher emailed his counselor this morning and said she didn’t receive either assignment. I just don’t get it.</p>

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<p>$550 for a summer school class??? And here I was grousing about our district’s $100 AP test charge. I suppose I should be happy our school district charges $20 per class. If money is an issue and your son ends up needing to do the summer class, you might ask the counselor if he can get approval to take a similar course at another accredited high school and transfer the credit back at end of summer. For example, UMissouri online high school charges about $180 for one course(plus book, but can usually get those at Amazon cheap.). Since it is online, can do at your own pace, finish up quickly if you like, or take a breather to refresh first after the hectic year, and anyway no need to spend summer sitting in the high school when peers are done and gone.</p>

<p>I don’t know much about this, but I’ve read elsewhere that some universities may not care that much about the actual diploma if the overall record is good. I think it may have been that a student wanted to leave school after 11th grade but like your son, had piles of credits and missing just one crucial one for the diploma. That would be something to ask UAB.</p>

<p>Maybe there is a personality conflict with English teacher? Sounds like something going on since it is not happening in his other classes and is SO extreme in English. My D has something similar, though not so dire. Only classes she needed to graduate this year are the gym(dance) class she is in now and 2nd half of APUSH. At first she loved dance. Then recently she started not participating or turning in written assignments. I’ve joked with her that she might not graduate on account of it. She got upset because the teacher figured out D and her partner are the best dancers in class and forced them to separate, put them with other partners who can’t dance at all, which took all the fun out of class. Luckily she opted for P/F so it won’t hurt her GPA.</p>

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<p>Pat- walk away from the cliff.</p>

<p>I know you are upset and sad and angry and overwrought, but the language you are using to describe a situation which college admissions folks have probably seen a hundred times in the last few years is really over the top.</p>

<p>So calm down.</p>

<p>Here’s what I can tease out from your comments- your son is both chronologically young and a little immature. You guys are strapped financially. Your son has tanked in his final year of HS. At the young age of 14 or 15 or 16 you all got excited about a long range plan (MD/PHD in your case).</p>

<p>This describes at least a dozen families I know right now. Some of the details are different- one young man wanted to be an air force test pilot, another the CIA, still another a prestigious Federal clerkship. But to craft such a plan at such a young age is nice- but really, so many unknowns. It’s fun to have dreams and fantasies, but to try and course correct for a 17 year old who has faced a speed bump but latching on to MD/PHD sounds to me a little mean.</p>

<p>So step back and take a deep breath.</p>

<p>First you need to determine if any of the colleges that accepted your son even care if he graduates from HS (the college I attended did not and I had several friends who never graduated HS.) Starting of course with UAB.</p>

<p>If the answer is yes- he needs to graduate, then you need a sit down with the college counselor and your son to map out the easiest and fastest way to graduate. Our town has an accelerated summer program for “super seniors” (for both kids like your son as well as for kids who got sick, moved to town late in their junior year, or whatnot) for kids who need to make up a credit or two. You can take an online class-- even one of the free courses available from many universities-- in lieu of the town’s own summer school. Your son does not need to blow the cover off the ball, he just needs to pass. He won’t have the distraction of everything else he’s taking- so he’ll read “Great Expectations” or whatnot, write the paper, get a B- and get the heck out of dodge.</p>

<p>Your son is lying to you because you have created a world where there are two options- Option A where everything is great, he becomes an MD/PHD at low or no cost, and option B where everything is terrible because he either has to take out loans (like many students) or live at home for a year and attend community college before transferring (like many students), or he becomes a bum and throws away his entire future all because he flunked a class in HS.</p>

<p>Your son is feeling guilty enough over having disappointed you; piling it on now that he’s thrown his life away isn’t going to make it better.</p>

<p>There are many merit scholarships in the world. You could all benefit from a gap year.</p>

17

<p>patesq-
I’ve read the posts and sympathize with your family’s situation.
Your thread will be helpful to future parents dealing with their high achieving students and senioritis.
I have a few comments…
Perhaps community college, living at home, going to classes with high school acquaintances can teach him life lessons about letting opportunities slip through his fingers.
Or taking a gap year, working a job will give him time to reflect on his poor judgement and stubbornness.
He had been given chances to change the direction of his senior year but chose to not make up zeros and let over confidence of pulling good grades by doing last minute work cloud his judgement.
Time for you and the counselor to let the rest of the semester play out, it’s all up to him now.
He has painted himself into this corner.</p>

<p>Plan for the worse and hope for the best.</p>

18

<p>I am wondering if the son should maybe just take a gap year anyway, even if he does complete the English credit and keep his UAB acceptance. I am sure UAB would hold his admission and his scholarship; students frequently defer matriculation for all kinds of reasons.</p>

<p>He sounds really burnt out, and really immature…a very combustible combination for going away to a college environment. Especially for a kid who has convinced himself that he does his best work by procrastinating and working under pressure.</p>

19

<p>About 10 years ago my friend’s son flunked a needed for graduation class (irrc it was Gov’t) after being accepted at Cal Tech ED. Cal Tech said they couldn’t care less. But he was a math genius and Cal accepted him because of that - not his other grades, which were really just so-so. </p>

<p>Taking ten courses is just nuts regardless, and I am wondering why OP’s son’s GC even signed off on a schedule like that.</p>

20

<p>No advice- just hugs and sympathy. Hopefully, you will look back in a few years and view this as a huge learning lesson.</p>

<p>My d was Val and her good friend Sal. Few people knew that the sal didn’t graduate " with honors". She couldn’t get the required 4th year of language in and didn’t want to complete it on line.</p>