How to Convince My Parents That Some Schools Are Actually Generous With Aid?

Paying for College
21

<p>HelloImChelsea -</p>

<p>Do talk with your mother about the amount of money she can pay. $2,500 may well be her limit. Many, many families do not have any college savings at all, aren’t in a position to take on any debt, and so can only pay out of current income - yours might be one of them. </p>

<p>Considering that you would receive a huge cost break at the institution where your mom works, that may have been her whole college plan for you. Is there any chance that she took that job because she knew it would mean an affordable college education for you? Make an appointment with the benefits office there, and find out the details of the tuition reduction and whether or not that institution participates in any tuition exchanges with colleges or universities that offer your planned major.</p>

<p>dodgersmom raises an important point about money. If you are admitted to a place that meets full need, how will you come up with a full family contribution of $11,000 or so - especially if the Federal/Stafford Loan of $5,500 is included in the aid package? Mom can scrape together $2,500, and you will have a summer income and savings of $X. How close can that get to $11,000? If you happen to have substantial savings that you could use for the first year, where are you going to get the money for years two, three, and four? </p>

<p>There are some really nice calculators at [FinAid</a>! Financial Aid, College Scholarships and Student Loans](<a href=“http://www.finaid.org%5DFinAid”>http://www.finaid.org) that you can use to look at the numbers. Spend some time there with your mom, and see what might work for your family.</p>

22

<p>I ran some numbers on the NPC’s of twenty colleges – including by chance, Middlebury – for a local family with a household income of $70,000 approx. The student is a top performer (top 2% in his high school) but has pretty average SATs for a CC. </p>

<p>The results are below. I am not naive so there is no need to caution me about the shortcomings of net price calaculators. I will refer folks to the disclaimers posted on every college website. However, the results of a NPC comparison should be one factor considered in comparing colleges and I think those results often surprise people:</p>

<p>College of Wooster Net Price: $ 11,452
Dartmouth College Net Price: $ 11,666
Middlebury College Net Price: $ 12,312
Williams College Net Price: $ 13,168
Dickinson College Net Price: $ 14,110
Hamilton College Net Price: $ 15,800
SUNY Oneonta Net Price: $ 16,633
SUNY Geneseo Net Price: $ 16,944
SUNY ESF Net Price: $ 18,560
Union College Net Price: $ 19,150
Ohio Wesleyan Net Price: $ 21,630
Denison University Net Price: $ 22,522
Castleton State Net Price: $ 23,654
Boston University Net Price: $ 25,122
Allegheny College Net Price: $ 25,523
St. Lawrence Net Price: $ 26,660
UVM (Vermont) Net Price: $ 29,072
UCONN Net Price: $ 32,276
NYU Net Price: $ 39,441
Penn State Net Price: $ 43,084</p>

<p>Yes, your son or daughter might get a great deal at NYU or UCONN, but these are the results for a specific young man based on data for his specific family. Your numbers will differ. With all the obvious and not so obvious drawbacks these net price calculators present a huge step forward from where things were when D1 was college shopping 6 years ago.</p>

23

<p>To a certain extent, with the list of colleges you have on your wish list, you are living abit of a fantasy to think that you will be able to attend those colleges for $8000 ($2500 plus federal direct). And you may very well be able to bump that to $11000 as many kids can earn a couple thousand a year and save that. The very best thing you can do is to sit down with you mother and work through the FAFSA calculator and the institutional calculators and the net price calculators. You absolutely need to understand what will be the minimum amount your family will be expected to pay. At that point you can begin to put together a list. You’ll need to look at colleges that might be likely to give you some merit aid and all those sorts of things…but even those colleges will most likely expect your family to pay some amount greater than $2500. Since you have a financial safety, there is nothing inherently wrong with applying to a slew of colleges and seeing where the finaid offers fall in the spring but you need to be open to the fact that when all is said and done your decision will be made most likely based on cost and not desire for a particular college.</p>

24

<p>hudsonvalley - As noted, only Middlebury is on the OP’s list . . . and her family income is not the same as that of the family for whom you ran the NPC. Neither NYU nor UConn is even on her list!</p>

<p>Yes, it has repeatedly been suggested that she run the NPC’s for the schools she’s interested in and she has already started doing that.</p>

<p>As for 3togo’s suggestion to avoid “confrontation” for as long as possible . . . this isn’t about confrontation, it’s about discussion. And that needs to happen a lot sooner than next May. And, as 3togo also points out, a good discussion with Mom might point the OP in the direction of “compromise” schools she hasn’t even thought of!</p>

25

<p>You won’t be able to afford UMich. The OOS tuition is very high and your stats aren’t high enough for the limited number of merit scholarships.</p>

<p>Before you come up with a final list, wait to see how your scores come in. Right now, they’re not high enough for many/most of the schools that give great aid. </p>

<p>What is your major again? I think it’s something international and maybe Arabic studies minor? If so, you could get much/all of your education at Mizzou couldn’t you? What is Mizzou missing?</p>

<p>Even if Scripps gave you enough aid that your family had to pay $11k, you’d still be very short since your parents will only pay $2500 and there will already be full loans in your FA pkg. Getting the additional $8500 will be nearly impossible for you. You won’t be able to borrow that much without your parents co-signing (which is unlikely that they would do.)</p>

<p>Besides, borrowing $30k for your FA pkg and another $45k for private loans is WAAAAAAY TOOOOO much for you to borrow.</p>

26

<p>Having known kids with great stats and a family income of that range, I warn that these numbers are averages only. You can get zero in aid from NYU, or a full ride. I’ve seen both. </p>

<p>As for the OP, parents do feel a huge hurt coming when their kids are getting overattached, involved and invested in certain schools that they know they cannot afford without chance intervening. I know as a mom, that if my kids had acted that way about any such schools, I would have felt that squeeze on my heart. It might be nice to truly act like those are lottery tickets, not talk about them as much and show some enthusiasm for some safeties. It would make your mom feel better.</p>

27

<p>*dodgersmom raises an important point about money. If you are admitted to a place that meets full need, how will you come up with a full family contribution of $11,000 or so - especially if the Federal/Stafford Loan of $5,500 is included in the aid package? Mom can scrape together $2,500, and you will have a summer income and savings of $X. How close can that get to $11,000? If you happen to have substantial savings that you could use for the first year, where are you going to get the money for years two, three, and four? *</p>

<p>Since YOU are the one who’ll be paying for application fees, fees to send SAT scores, fees for CSS Profiles, you need to carefully come up with your app list AFTER you get your new test scores. </p>

<p>Right now, the middle quartiles SATs for Scripps is 1940 - 2190. Since your SATs are well below the middle quartiles, your chances at that school are low. </p>

<p>for schools that give aid based on scores, you need to select schools where your scores are above the middle quartiles. </p>

<p>While it’s fine to apply to a couple of high reach schools, since you’re paying for the apps yourself, and you have limited funds, make your list wisely. You don’t want a bunch of rejections or a bunch of acceptances from unafforadable schools.</p>

28

<p>Sent from my GT-S5570 using CC</p>

29

<p>Jym626: I don’t know if I’m an extremely competitive candidate, but I’m not way below the average admitted person.</p>

<p>I don’t know if the college offers any tuition exchanges. I’ll have to look on its website.</p>

<p>Thanks!</p>

30

<p>Mom2collegekids: Mizzou doesn’t have Middle Eastern studies or International Relations. I don’t think it has Arabic either. My mom and I visited Missouri State and she liked it. It also has everything I want. It’s a bit smaller than Mizzou and it is closer to home, so my mom could be there sooner than if I went to Mizzou. </p>

<p>My mom absolutely doesn’t want me to be in debt when I graduate.</p>

31

<p>Mom2collegekids: I haven’t taken the SAT. I’m almost certain I got a 27 or a 28 on the ACT. I’ll find out next week.</p>

32

<p>Cptofthehouse: I’ve told my mom that if we can’t afford any of the schools, I’ll go to Missouri State. I’m eligible for a $3,500 scholarship. Hopefully I’ll get some more.</p>

33

<p>Lookingforward: The projection did include a $3,000 Stafford loan. It was subtracted from the $11,000.</p>

<p>My mom helped me enter all the data, it’s correct.</p>

<p>I think my student contribution was actually $1800 as well. I’m going to have a job during the summer and the year.</p>

<p>Thanks!</p>

34

<p>Apply to a broad array of schools. At this time with an ACT score that isn’t in the 30s, you need to view Scripps as a reach school. Your chances of acceptance are not terrific with that ACT score. </p>

<p>Does you school guidance department use Naviance? If so, see how your stats stack up in comparison to other accepted students. </p>

<p>Rule of thumb… Consider that the weakest link on you admissions info will be important. There are few ways to explain away a low GPA, low SAT/ACT, or a less than rigorous course load.</p>

<p>The advice you are getting here is very good with regard to eligibility for need based aid. Remember, however that the more generous the school, the higher their admission standards are likely to be.</p>

35

<p>

</p>

<p>Considering the fact that the middle 50 ACT scores for scripts are 29-34, if you got a 27/28, Scripps is going to be a reach. If you schor a 27/28, most of the other schools on your list are also going to be reaches.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.scrippscollege.edu/about/pdf/CDS_2011-2012.pdf[/url]”>http://www.scrippscollege.edu/about/pdf/CDS_2011-2012.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Please do not put all of your eggs in the Scripps, Middlebury, Colby, Macalester basket. You need a more balanced list. Make sure that you have a wide arrange of schools including 1 to 2 financial safeties in the mix.</p>

36

<p>HelloImChelsea - The information about tuition exchanges may be buried deep down inside the staff-only section of the website. It also is the kind of thing that can change quite a bit from one year to the next. Double and triple check whatever you do find out, and make certain that you have the details in writing. That way if the policy changes partway through your education you can be grandfathered.</p>

37

<p>Your mom is absolutely within her rights to limit what she will contribute to your education. But when you say she doesn’t want you to take on any debt, that is intruding on a decision that should be yours. She can (and should) advise you - but you should be the one who makes the call.</p>

38

<p>Not all schools are in a tuition exchange program. Some offer a “tuition benefit”- money paid to the other college. But this depends on what sort of employment a parent has at the college- faculty, staff, full or part-time. And, many state schools are reducing or eliminating them or only offering tuition reductions to kids who go to that specific school. It should be on the web HR page. And, my exp with Tbenefits is that they are treated as resources, it affects the finaid package.</p>

<p>So, Chels, 11k - 3000 = 8k. Add back in any and all loans and work study. See what the costs really are. Remember that you can work your tail off this summer and next school year, maybe earn that 1800, maybe not- and somehow have to do it all again for 2nd year.</p>

<p>When a school says it’s accepted/enrolled freshman mid-range stats are X-Y, that usually doesn’t tell you exactly WHAT about those lower scorers attracted adcom attention. These kids could be athletes, high achievers in their major area, have oodles of outside experience relevant to their majors, be legacies, faculty kids, an underrepresented minority- a host of unknowns, including full-pay. Lightning does strike, but you cannot say, oh, I’m not so far below the absolute mid-point. Most adults on CC advise kids to find schools where they are roughly in the top quartile or so. Not only does that make you competitive with other applicants, likely to keep up with them in college classes, it makes you competitive for any merit scholarships that may be the icing on the cake. </p>

<p>Over the past year or so, you’ve asked about- and focused on- a range of competitive colleges, many on the coasts. Many kids are not happy eeking into some college, only to find out it’s tougher than what they’ve experienced so far, where they scramble to keep up. This isn’t a matter of your drive or confidence. It’ a matter of assessing realities. Is it possible Mom thinks you are not being realistic?</p>

<p>Annasdad- surprised you feel it’s the kid’s call to take on loans, that mom may be intruding- I usually see you as a voice of reason about finding schools that match financial needs- even thought you might have suggestions in addn to Truman-? Or am I reading your comment wrong?</p>

39

<p>Mizzou has international studies, by the way.</p>

40

<p>lookingforward, I think every student should choose a school that is affordable. But I believe it is the student who should make the choice - including the decision about taking on debt - with the parent as an advisor. The parent has a legitimate right to limit their own financial contribution, but beyond that, it should be the student’s decision - it is, after all, the student’s life who will be affected by the decision. </p>

<p>In our case, my D chose the lowest-cost alternative, one where she will not need to borrow, over her first choice - which she could have swung with Staffords and an additional contribution from us, which we were willing to provide. I agree with the decision - but it was 100% her call, not mine.</p>