<p>"I see that kind of sweeping intolerance of an entire group"</p>
<p>But I haven't seen that. I've seen an occasional nasty remark. But so what? We're (theoretically) all adults here, surely we can ignore the occasional intolerant remark, whether it's about lesbians at all-girls schools, Southerners, Northerners, rich kids, or whatever.</p>
<p>Of course, I'm completely guiltless in all of this, have no prejudices at all, and never say anything stupid.</p>
<p>I didn't see sweeping intolerance either (although reading post #14 in its entirity clarifies other posts a little bit).</p>
<p>On another thread a poster dissed all northesterners. I thought it slightly funny too. I didn't take it personally, or feel that the poster was being sweepingly intolerant of an entire geographic area.</p>
<p>And I enjoy sarcasm, although Driver doesn't seem to think I have any.</p>
<p>I don't see the concerns about campuses dominated by wealthy kids as a matter of bigotry.</p>
<p>It's a comfort issue. It can be very difficult for a less affluent kid to feel at home on a campus where all of his friends can participate in costly recreational activities (skiing, sailing, spring break trips, etc.) that are out of the question for him. How will the poorer kid feel if he can't be part of the crowd because he can't join in the things that the crowd is doing? </p>
<p>This is an issue that really doesn't apply to other distinctions among students, such as Northerners vs. Southerners.</p>
<p>It is a real issue, and you've articulated it very well.</p>
<p>Marian and driver, certainly comfort in a particular environment matters. </p>
<p>But diversity is about creating some level of discomfort. What about the non-religious student on a religious campus? Or the religious student on a non-religious campus? The black student on a mostly-white campus? White student at a mostly-black campus? Rural student on a city campus? Southern in the Pacific NW? Westerner in New England? So what's the big deal if a student is rich? Or poor? There are always going to be choices to be made. </p>
<p>"How will the poorer kid feel if he can't be part of the crowd because he can't join in the things that the crowd is doing?"</p>
<p>Come on, does anyone really think that EVERYONE on any campus is going sailing or skiing? Or on spring break trips?</p>
<p>I suspect that the rural kid who chooses a city campus or the white kid who chooses a historically black college understands what he or she is getting into.</p>
<p>But the wealth thing could catch a kid by surprise.</p>
<p>dmd-
Of course not! I never skied or sailed until after college. Never went on a spring break trip, either. But for a truly underprivileged kid, it could be an issue, that's all.</p>
<p>Wow, I never realized how rich I was growing up. I was sailing at age 12 (built the boat and sewed the sails myself), and skied as well (on a pair of old wooden skis with non-breakaway mounts). And in college my brothers and I traveled to Florida together between semesters -- budgeted $5 per person per day and generally brought home money. (We did get rousted a lot for sleeping on beaches and in state parks, but hey ADVENTURE trips cost a lot right?)</p>
<p>PS, quite a few of my friends are rich but they don't make a big deal of it. Good people all.</p>
<p>NH33,
Yes, that's exactly the point. The methodology used here to determine wealth--the ability to pay full tuition--jumps to the conclusion that in most such families, Biff and Muffie have their own gold MasterCards, luxury cars, limitless spending, etc. It just isn't so.</p>
<p>It's wonderful that you had those experiences, NewHope33, but it doesn't imply that you could have necessarily joined your wealthier classmates in their versions of the same activities (which would probably have involved flying to Cancun, for example, rather than driving to Florida).</p>
<p>Driver--about those gold cards.... my D just got her first credit card, a student card that Bank of America will give any student with an income of $200/month or more. It's a PLATINUM card. She looked at it and said "do they think calling it a platinum card will make me spend more or something? I still only have a $900 credit limit!"</p>
<p>
[quote]
but it doesn't imply that you could have necessarily joined your wealthier classmates in their versions of the same activities (which would probably have involved flying to Cancun
[/quote]
Now you've lost me, Marian. I don't feel sorry for kids who don't get to fly to Cancun. I almost feel sorry for the kids that do.</p>
<p>dmd--that's a good one! I guess $900 worth of platinum=$900 worth of gold!</p>
<p>dmd - Sounds like my kids! Doesn't it make you proud when they cut right to the heart of a matter?</p>
<p>Forget Cancun. Bad example.</p>
<p>Let's just say that it can be difficult to </p>
<p>1) be the only kid who can't afford to join in on the purchase of an occasional midnight pizza</p>
<p>2) be the only kid who can't go to the movies (even the half-price on-campus movie) on Saturday night because it's too expensive</p>
<p>3) have to do your laundry every five days because that's all the clothing you own (one of my friends at college was in exactly this situation)</p>
<p>If there is true diversity -- including socioeconomic diversity -- on a particular campus, kids who have to be extremely careful about money may not feel like oddballs. But I'm afraid that at some colleges, the few kids who have to count their pennies carefully may feel very left out of campus activities.</p>
<p>ericatbucknell stated:</p>
<p>"ive seen more exotic
parking lots at mcdonalds."</p>
<p>With all due respect, a young
adult driving an exotic car is
not caught dead at McDonald's.
Maybe Mom or Dad & alas,
they are showing that they are
car rich and cash poor. Therefore,
they are financially strapped &
are not capable of putting out
$45,000 per year for college.
In addition add on the car insurance
which will run another $3500+.</p>
<p>If the young adult is driving
their exotic car to McDonald's,
they are "all dressed up with no place to go."</p>
<p>Lots of Hollywood types and Microsoft millionaires still enjoy the taste of their favorite fast food while sitting in their Porsche or Ferrari. Be it Pinks and In and Out Burger in LA or BurgerMaster in Seattle where you still might catch Bill Gates.</p>
<p>The favorite room service item for the high-roller suites in Las Vegas--a hamburger.</p>
<p>Marian, I think you've posed an interesting issue, but my guess is that parents today are much more concerned about their kids feelings on this subject than our parents were.</p>
<p>I was a "scholarship kid" back when they had them.... my parents would have been shocked at the notion that I would have given up an opportunity at an elite university just because I had less money than the other kids in my dorm. Who did that back then? We sucked it up and dealt with it, and frankly, were grateful, not resentful, of the opportunities we had.</p>
<p>Freshman year a girl on my hall invited me to join a bunch of kids at her parents second home in the Caribbean over winter break. I declined politely. She was surprised... pressed the point.... I explained that I couldn't afford the trip. She graciously explained that her parents would be footing the bill for everything... except airfare... and I tried to explain that there was no way anyone in my family was paying for a plane ticket to the Caribbean for a week, especially since my fast food job was waiting for me back home so I could pick up some extra bucks.</p>
<p>We're still friends and somehow my ego survived being the kid who couldn't afford the trip.</p>
<p>I just can't fathom a kid avoiding a top school (assuming the kid is interested in the school in the first place) just so he or she will never have to say, "sorry, I can't afford it." Doesn't life as a grown-up mean having to make these kinds of choices? H and I don't ski; eat at Lutece; buy designer clothes; go the theater as much as we'd like....all because we can't afford it, and we have no compunctions saying that when friends or colleagues want to arrange an outing to do something that's over our budget. Are you going to orchestrate your kids lives so that they never have to be ashamed of not having money???</p>
<p>Driver</p>
<p>Perhaps I am being a bit slow this evening after a long day in Court so I am sorry in advance if I misinterpreted your "rich Jew" comment. If you were trying to make an editorial point about bigotry it flew over my head. However if you were being anti-semetic shame on you. We don't have to get into the fact that Jewish kids are at the highest levels of achievement not because of their parent's wealth but rather a cultural love of education. Both rich and yes poor Jews encourage their kids from an early age to maximize their educations. Again I am sorry if I didn't properly understand your comment.</p>
<p>I also reject the comment made by one poster that lac grads finish their four years with no job direction. If you look at each lac's data their grads, especially the top 25 lacs, land fantastic jobs and get into the best grad schools and do so within 6 months of graduation.</p>
<p>My wife and I will not qualify for financial aid of any sort. We will live off of one salary and use the other to pay for college. Are we blessed to be able to do that? Yes! But we have worked damned hard to get to this point. Quite frankly it will still be a sacrifice.</p>
<p>Dana's Dad</p>
<p>Um, I can see how a low-middle class kid might feel a little left out socially at NYU, and I can see where "I need to earn money" might limit off-semester internship options. But I'm having trouble imagining family wealth (or rather, lack thereof) being an issue at Whitman or Wesleyan or Wellesley or Washinton University or William & Mary (just to name a few "W"s), etc.</p>