<p>I have to agree with alwaysamom here. The frowning upon the idea of going to school where some kids are rich, I don't get. My kids are not rich but they both know numerous rich kids at their colleges and are very close to many of them. It doesn't matter to me. They are exposed to all types of kids at college. They also went to a rural public school and knew many kids at the opposite end of the spectrum. Each connection/friendship and experience has been worthy and nourishing to their lives as people. I do not think "rich" should be equated with a negative connotation. I'd say the same of "poor", "black", "Jewish", etc. I want my kids to mix with many types. I'm glad they have friends from such a wide spectrum economically, socially, and geographically. </p>
<p>I also agree with some others as to what is considered "rich" varies from place to place. My children are better off than many of their local friends but have far less than many rich friends they know at school (though their school friends are not ALL rich). </p>
<p>I also don't quite get the generalizations about students at Bryn Mawr and the fact that there are some expensive cars parked there. They may or may not be students' cars. Even if they are students' cars, they can hardly represent a majority of the population. There are many colleges where there are some students that are very wealthy. That doesn't necesssarily imply a majority. I'd hate to have this image of any particular school put out there from this one observation. Students need to visit and get a feel for the general student population.</p>
<p>garland.... The reason for the automotive
clues is because.... sadly, I "use to" drive
a Mercedes & a Porsche. Now, I tell myself
that I matured and don't need those status
symbols. Ha! My psychiatrist says I am
making progress.... that's a joke.
BTW.... If you have health insurance
you can afford Botox. Tell your doctor
you have a nervous twitch in your face.
They should write you a prescription
for Botox.</p>
<p>I couldn't agree with you more. Our kids are not wealthy however I would say we are very comfortable and thus they are too. On the otherhand, I doubt that any of the offspring of parents on this board could really consider themselves poor. Poor, to me, denotes someone going without the basic necessities of life such food, clothing, shelter, and necessary medical care. I have known families with far more than us, and those with far less but I can't say that any of them were poor in the truest sense of the word. </p>
<p>College campuses, from what I've seen, seem to be well represented by students of all nationalities and economic groups. My children have great compassion for those with less than them, and an appreciation for how hard we have worked to give them the lifestyle they now have. They also have seen those with much more than them and show no envy whatsoever. I am all for financial aid according to need, but lets face it someone has got to pay or colleges would cease to be able to offer full-need based grants. We, my husband and I, did not inherit wealth, we have worked long and hard and made wise choices to get to this point. We are giving to our children the education and tools to do the same. </p>
<p>Let's be fair in this and acknowledge that all poor people are not inherently good, not all wealthy people inherently selfish.</p>
<p>Dmd, I have to respectfully disagree with the notion of avoiding "richer campuses" if one doesn't fit in economically. I think at very selective schools, there may be many wealthy kids but there is a range (after all, many are on need based aid). My kids are not rich but they are not poor (they are on aid, as well). Both my kids have spent their summers attending programs where they knew many very wealthy kids. They fit in fine and are close to these kids and have visited their homes, etc. Now at college, I see no problems either. Right now, one of my kids is at a sport training camp she is funding herself 3000 miles away, that she went to with four girls from her college team who I know are not funding it themselves. She'll tell you that she is one of the only girls on the team who only owns one home (most of the others have two or three homes). She LOVES her teammates and is very close to them. Granted, my D is not poor by any means but I'm just saying, she has never felt uncomfortable at all. As well, she went to a no name public school and has many friends from private and elite High schools....including her roomie who was randomly assigned to her freshman year and with whom she is going on three years at roomies. Again, a non issue. She understands the differences but it matters not in her friendships. My other kid knows kids that are extremely wealthy. She has visited their mansions. Some have private jets. Total nonissue again. She is about to go over a local friend's apartment....subsidized apt. Likes her just the same as her very wealthy friends from out of state. Has many things in common with her that are not economical.</p>
<p>soozievt..... if you look closely
at the elite prestige schools you
will see the statistic of 40 to 60
per cent of the student body not
receiving any financial aide. Naturally
40% is not a majority, but when the
COA is $45,000 per year, that adds
up to a lot of money on campus.</p>
<p>dmd, have a look at driver's post #18 and the post to which she is commenting. I think it's pretty obvious the bigotry expressed in that post. It isn't the first time I've seen such comments here on CC. In fact, it happens often and thus, the reason for my post. </p>
<p>I agree with Susan that if a child has difficulty relating to other kids from ANY other demographic, then that could be a commentary on what experience they've had in the first 18 years of their lives. My kids have friends, both at home and at school, who come from every conceivable background. It's never been a problem at their schools, either h/s or college, for kids from diverse groups to mix and find common ground and develop friendships.</p>
<p>Proud2b:
Yes, I fully understand that. My kids attend very expensive colleges (Brown and NYU) and many are paying full freight and thus are pretty well off. So what? It doesn't matter to me or to them. I never said there were not wealthy kids at their schools. To the contrary, my kids know some VERY wealthy kids at their schools. However, at highly selective schools, there is some diversity due to the availability of need based aid and there is geographic and other diversity. My kids know all types. Yes, there are more rich kids at their colleges than in their local community. The students at their colleges are not all wealthy. Further, the mix with a variety of backgrounds is a positive thing, in my view. I feel the same about my kids having gone to a rural public school (where there is a significant population on free or reduced lunch). They knew kids from a wide variety of backgrounds. The contrast of their high school / local community to the backgrounds of those who go to their colleges or summer programs is significant but in either situation, they have many friends from all these backgrounds and I view these various exposures as a positive thing.</p>
<p>Proud2b--thanks for the tip; I think I actually like my wrinkles-- they tell who I am.</p>
<p>Also, we paid that kind of COA this past year--on a less than 100,000 income (about 70,000 this year.) Sometimes those paying full freight have to be particularly frugal--not much less after those bills.</p>
<p>In our local high school, there are students across the entire economic spectrum, but there is a preponderance of upper middle class families with education emphasized. </p>
<p>At Oxford, 50% or more are from private school. Affordability is not nearly as much of an issue since the UK/EU tuition is so inexpensive, but there are lots of students who get grants and government sponsored loans. However, among the private school/boarding school students, there are a reasonable number from quite wealthy families. </p>
<p>As a tiny core sample - in my son's a cappella group, at least 10 went to boarding school, some to quite prestigious places. When I asked, he said that he thinks that only two or three are from families at about our income level, the rest are all wealthy to very wealthy. In this group, he's the one from the least prestigious school, at the bottom of the economic background, and a minority (US) as well. Hasn't been bothered by it - from his perspective, the culture is fairly egalitarian.</p>
<p>So refering to "wealthy white elite" and "elite preppy private schools" makes me a bigot? This is a sensitive crowd. I should have said we are seeking more socioeconomic diversity than seems to be prevalent at many of the campuses we have visited. These are schools that are NOT need blind in admissions and do NOT meet 100% of demonstrated need (ie, not ivy league schools, so no need to demonstrate their diversity). I guess I am just a self loathing rich white guy.</p>
<p>Look at the comparison regarding diversity between Carleton, Oberlin and Harvard again before plunking down the same amount of money to get less diversity.</p>
<p>NJ- no harm no foul. We don't think you're a bigot, you just should have made it clear that it's dumb preppies you don't like, but have nothing against the smart ones.</p>
<p>Quite frankly, I find it bizarre that people here would call someone a bigot for asking about collegial socio-economic diversity. To equate that with bigotry against blacks or Jews is even more bizarre.</p>
<p>So, there's bigotry against rich white people now? ROTFLMAO!</p>
<p>Fact is, there are a lot of rich kids paying full freight at many Ivies and top 25 LACs. I have heard some lovely stories, and there clearly is a sense of entitlement among <em>some</em> (SOME, not all) of these students. Let's not pretend that there isn't.</p>
<p>Sure, there are poor people at Ivies too. But I am still laughing at the idea that people are feeling sorry for the misbegotten beleaguered rich white kid, victim of bigotry! ROTFL!</p>
<p>i went to high school in a rather depressed town, the kind where you can still buy a home for $20000 (yes, only four zeros), before enrolling at bucknell, so im very familiar with both sides of the financial spectrum. on one hand i can say that there were very few truly low income students at bucknell, which was unfortunate. but on other the other hand i can say with all honesty that bucknell was far less economically stratified than my high school, or even penn state (where ive spent a lot of time). 'coolness' was no longer defined by the label on ones clothing; nearly everyone wore decent clothes and many shunned logos. nobody really knew what your parents had and nobody really cared. </p>
<p>consequently, there are only two scenarios in which i can see the amount of money on a campus being an issue. the first involves a student who feels a need to 'fit in' with a perceived image of the campus-at-large and because of financial limitations is unable to do so. the second, and there is some overlap, involves a student who attends a school in a major city; theres simply not much on which to spend money with your friends in lewisburg, pennsylvania. (not being able to do things with your friends transcends not having the 'right' clothes.)</p>
<p>and the comments on the two cars at bryn mawr is hilarious. TWO cars! ive seen more exotic parking lots at mcdonalds.</p>
<p>Allmusic, I don't think that what was meant. I think the comments came out of the sense of not wanting to mix with rich kids as if that were a negative. I think it is a given that there is a significant presence of wealthy kids at certain schools, even if not the majority of the school. I think it is also to be expected to inquire about a college's student body in terms of fit or the amount of diversity. I think the issue was more of why was it a "negative" to go to school where there were some well to do white students? Also, particularly at elite schools where there is more diversity than at some other schools? </p>
<p>I also find it odd that sometimes those who are "poo pooing" the rich white kids are people who have CHOSEN to live in communities and send their kids to K-12 schools where there is a significant number of kids like this in attendance. If this segment of society is so "off putting" to mix with, why haven't they chosen to live in places like I live where there are few rich kids and the schools are not as well regarded, etc. ? It's funny to me that those who don't want a college where there are some kids like this actually have sent their kids to high schools where this is a significant part of the population. In any case, I don't quite get the idea of denouncing the mixing with rich kids at college. Doesn't bother me at all. And I also have heard a kind of put down of the wealthy on CC before. Even the Duke lacrosse thread has connotations about the boys being from well to do backgrounds with stereotypes about them, etc. </p>
<p>As far as a sense of entitlement and those kinds of attitudes, there are all types of rich kids. My kids know well to do kids whom they really like and who don't flaunt their wealth and my kids mix just great with them and have for years, even if their own backgrounds back home vary widely from these kids they know. It just has not made a difference. I used to wonder how my kids might mix with kids from other areas or backgrounds like those, but I was wrong.....I learned this the first time I sent them to overnight camps (when young) where they met many rich kids and they mixed fine with them because kids will be kids and they made no distinction amongst themselves. I will qualify that my kids are not poor, but definitely are not rich either.</p>
<p>Allmusic, you're missing the point. If the posters here wanted genuine information about schools with economic diversity, they'd have written something like, "my son is interested in Engineering (or linguistics or history); has SAT's of whatever, gpa of whatever, goes to a top ranked magnet hs and is in the top 20%; loves watching basketball. Are there schools w/a broad range of income diversity, warm weather, (or whatever....) that meet that description?"</p>
<p>Then the helpful posters on CC go to work making up a list. That's how it works for people eliciting information. When people start posting random thoughts on how they visited Denison or Lake Forest or Villanova and how the parking lot was filled with expensive cars and that their kid could never go to a school filled with preppy rich kids.... well that's when the sarcasm and the knives come out.</p>
<p>People who post here looking for information can usually get it. People who want to rant and rave about how somebody else is getting a free ride while you and spouse are working 90 hours a week to pay for your kid's education... well, we get tired of that. We are equally tired of "I'm just a humble middle class guy-- where can my kid go to college that's not a public U, doesn't have frats, has great merit aid for C students who don't like to read but doesn't give athletic scholarships since we don't like dumb athletes".</p>
<p>OK, fair enough. But bigotry? Perhaps the way it was used fits a dictionary definition, but doesn't fit in common usage.</p>
<p>I don't have a problem with the "humble middle class guy"'s POV, or someone describing the parking lot full of expensive cars. In all scenarios, there are elements of truth,as there are in these. </p>
<p>I just like fairness and a bit of (intellectual/social etc.) honesty all around, which probably is an impossible goal, but I still try.</p>
<p>allmusic, please read post #14 which is the post I was referencing. </p>
<p>"But so many of the colleges that our local kids go to seem to be bastions of the wealthy white elite. The public hs has a nice cross section, but then the kids get very stratified as they go off to college. And to make things worse, the local elite preppy private schools send their kids to these colleges too! We stayed away from "them" during secondary school, why must we now join them in college and leave the others behind? Anyway, please prepare for my future thread, "looking for a high quality LAC that is not dominated by rich white preppy kids."</p>
<p>Was this post made tongue in cheek? That doesn't appear to be the case. Would your reaction be the same if someone had posted that he was "looking for a high quality LAC that isn't dominated by poor kids on financial aid"? It's the disdain and huge generalizations voiced here that concern me. There is good and there is bad in every possible demographic of society. Bigotry and intolerance can happen, and is wrong, regardless of who the target may be. You may be ROFLYAO but I assure you that I am not, when I see that kind of sweeping intolerance of an entire group.</p>
<p>Bigotry, without bothering to check the dictionary, is intolerance of others who are not of one's preferred group. Common usage or otherwise.</p>
<p>I'm sure that NJ meant that s/he wanted more socio-economic diversity than is widely perceived to exist at the "elite" schools. There are a lot of very good public universities and colleges out there where that can be had. My objection was, as AaMom points out, was to the particular manner of expressing this desire. When you use words and phrases such as "wealthy white elite," "elite preppy private schools," "we stayed away from 'them'" and "rich preppy white kids" in a way that is clearly pejorative and identifying them as an undesirable "other," you have a bigoted statement. QED</p>