How would you rate the Ivys from a liberal/conservative standpoint?

College Search & Selection
21

<p>Xanatos,
When did I ever refer to the 2004 presidential election in this entire thread you stupid clown? </p>

<p>The fact is, Bush won NH in 2000, and both senators from NH are from the GOP (don't take my word for it, look it up). Out of the states all the ivies are located in, NH is the only one that can reasonably be referred to as a "red" state because in general its conservative (at least for New England)Correct me if I'm wrong, but we are speaking in relative terms here. I have a grad degree from one of these schools...what are you..some punk freshman who knows of nothing before 2004? I also went to high school in NH for a while...so I have some idea about the politics of the state.</p>

22

<p>Hey Jwbiatch,</p>

<p>Let me shut you down. Here's the Dartmouth election poll from 2000 if you want to bring up the past election... "Gore wins landslide victory in campus poll." Please stop talking about something you know nothing about.</p>

<p><a href="http://www.thedartmouth.com/article.php?aid=2000110101060%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.thedartmouth.com/article.php?aid=2000110101060&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>This year the poll was 86% Kerry. Start talking when you know what you are talking about. About 80% of my friends at Dartmouth were liberal. About on par with the rest of the ivy league.</p>

<p>Xanatos, these guys are idiots with nothing to back themselves up except extremely outdated opinions.</p>

23

<p>I know that Conn. College isn't an Ivy, but I have a friend whose daughter is there, and she said that its very difficult to be a conservative at a Northeast college in the current political climate......the conservative speakers that her group brings to campus are harassed regularly, with almost tacit approval from the administration...too bad that both voices can't be heard these days.</p>

24

<p>Slipper and Xanatos--</p>

<p>I think it's you who need to do more reading and less talking. He didn't claim that Dartmouth is like VMI or The Citadel or Brigham Young. What he did claim is that at Dartmouth, it's more acceptable to be conservative and there's a greater percentage of conservatives than at other Ivies, which, given my experience, I would say is probably true.</p>

25

<p>Wiscyguy, At Columbia the newspaper (spectator) endorsed Bush in the last election. There's no way the mainstream paper at Dartmouth would ever endorse Bush. But you are right, people at Dartmouth are much more likely to tolerate other peoples viewpoints regardless of what they are.</p>

26

<p>You're a dummy too Slipper1234 (sheesh, what is Dartmouth lowering admission standards these days?).</p>

<p>Did you even read your own link?</p>

<p>"However, in 1988, Dartmouth lead the Ivy League with the most votes for former President George Bush."</p>

<p>1988 is not ancient history here. </p>

<p>This is a quote from a 1995 National Review Article which examines the ideological atmosphere at several colleges:
"The colleges are listed in roughly ideological order, from most conservative to most liberal, except that Brown is almost everywhere ahead of, that is to say behind, Dartmouth in ideological rectitude."</p>

<p>Link: <a href="http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1282/is_n18_v47/ai_17498673%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1282/is_n18_v47/ai_17498673&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Well lets move on to your link and more recent times:</p>

<p>At Dartmouth it was Gore 62, Bush 23, and Nader 9.5%. Obviously Gore wins easily, but we are are speaking in relative terms here, and I stand by my point that Dartmouth is more conservative RELATIVE to other ivys. </p>

<p>Compare this to Yale, where even Nader beat Bush:
"Yale voters overwhelmingly lived up to their liberal reputation at the polls yesterday, as both Vice President Al Gore and Green Party candidate Ralph Nader received more votes in Ward 1 than Texas Gov. George W. Bush '68.</p>

<p>In Ward 1, which is almost entirely comprised of Yale voters, Gore captured 64.7 percent of the vote, Ralph Nader won 17.8 percent and Bush won 15.7 percent."</p>

<p>Source:
<a href="http://www.yaledailynews.com/article.asp?AID=13522%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.yaledailynews.com/article.asp?AID=13522&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Compare Dartmouth to Columbia where Bush only got 1/3 of the support he did at Dartmouth:
"71% favored Al Gore for President,16% for Ralph Nader and 7% for George W. Bush, with 2% other and 4% undecided."</p>

<p>Source:
<a href="http://www.college.columbia.edu/cct/feb01/feb01_letterseditor.html%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.college.columbia.edu/cct/feb01/feb01_letterseditor.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Read this slowly: I am speaking in relative terms to other ivy league schools here, and the statement that Dartmouth is more conservative than the others in the group is not an insane one to make even though by national standards Dartmouth is not a conservative place at all (this has never been an issue). I have never said Dartmouth was Bob Jones U as you try to imply.</p>

27

<p>Wow...congratulations on that well formed argument, there, jwblue (and kudos on the witty remark...'stupid clown' is funny and original...is that how you got your graduate degree?). Hey guess what man?</p>

<p>
[quote]
Massachusetts turned to the new Republican party, voting for John C. Fr</p>

28

<p>Haha, I am a dummy. Wow are you like 70? </p>

<p>So you bring up 1988. 1) In 1988 almost the entire country went for Bush so the fact that Dartmouth did is no surprise 2) Do you know how much Dartmouth has changed over the years. In 1988 it was an absolutely different world. Maybe to you 1988 wasnt a long time ago, but in collegeworld its a lifetime. Even in 1995 it was an absolutely different school. 3) I absolutely agree with you that Dartmouth is not conservative at all. I have a problem with this thread because on quick glance it makes Dartmouth seem conservative when it is absolutely not. A great majority of people are liberal.</p>

29

<p>wisconsinguy is correct in saying that the few conservatives that ARE on campus find it much easier to be openly conservative. Well, maybe that's because liberals aren't firebreathing nuts. Exemplum gratia:</p>

<p>Liberal: Well, I disagree...I don't think it's necessary to establish Christianity as a state religion or to ban evolution from schools. I'm sure if we discussed this some more, we could come up with a reasonable compromise.</p>

<p>Conservative: INFIDEL! You abortion-loving, pot-smoking FREAK! May God have mercy on your soul, you Satan-worshipping child sacrificer! Quick, someone call Ann Coulter, she'll know how to convert the heretic! We need to invade their countries, kill their leaders, and convert them all to Christianity - the one true faith.</p>

<p>So you see, most liberals are much more accepting of conservatives than the other way around.</p>

30

<p>Xanatos--</p>

<p>After a vitriolic, inane post like that, I'm beginning to think Dartmouth is failing you. </p>

<p>Everyone else in the forum: please do not take Xanatos' comments as remotely representative of Dartmouth students--very few of us are so crude and condescending. </p>

<p>As for Xanatos: if you can't take an argument with some semblance of civility and decorum, even in the face of impolite opposition, you probably should not be in college. Take a deep breath, slowly back away.</p>

<p>EDIT: Xanatos beat me to the post. The post I was referring to is not the post directly before mine, but his prior post.</p>

31

<p>This is all very peculiar to me.</p>

<p>Colleges like diversity. no?
Liberals like diversity. no?</p>

<p>Colleges and liberals don't like political diversity? no?</p>

<p>Why would anyone brag that their college is "totally liberal"? or, totally conservative?</p>

<p>Can that be considered a "liberal" (small l) education by any stretch of the imagination?</p>

<p>It seems almost pathetic that anyone should have to find themselves in a position to argue that their college is not in any way conservative so as not to seem unappealing to people who claim that they like diversity as long as it's quaint and fashionable and toothless.</p>

<p>What about diversity of opinion?</p>

<p>I do believe that Dartmouth is one of the last schools in the east that dose not require you to apologize for sharing conservative views.</p>

<p>Am I wrong?</p>

32

<p>You're apologizing for ME after that festival of name calling that jw embarked upon? This thread lost all semblance of civility way before my post.</p>

<p>To respond to your question, Woodwork, consider how many people in CC have talked about how they have been turned off or could potentially be turned off because of Dartmouth's reputation as being conservative.</p>

<p>Notice how I never said that I don't want conservatives at Dartmouth, or that conservatives shouldn't be at Dartmouth, or anything like that. I have plenty of conservative friends, and I know some of the people who write for the Dartmouth Review and whatever and it's fine. But I'm getting a little sick of people like jw who talked about things of which they have no first hand knowledge and then further resort to calling me a "punk freshman."</p>

33

<p>Ann Coulter Huh?</p>

<p>I hardly think she represents a sane conservative view.</p>

<p>check out this thread:
<a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=34238&page=1&pp=20%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=34238&page=1&pp=20&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

34

<p>Yeah I know she doesn't...lol...that was the point.</p>

35

<p>Xanatos,</p>

<p>You are a very good apoligist for your school (I mean that in the traditional way), however, if somebody is turned off by being around divergent political/cultural views, they are neither mature enough nor liberal enough to attend a school as eclectic/selective as Dartmouth and I would not think you would want to have to share your life/education with them.....given the choice.</p>

36

<p>Xan-</p>

<p>If you look back through the thread, you were the one (at least in my reading) who started the fray with absolutist and sarcastic remarks. I'm not condoning what jwblue did in response, but you should rise above such pettiness, and should not start such fights. Respond by calmly stating your argument in a rational manner, not going off into nonsensical diatribes as you have of late.</p>

<p>And, just curious, who do you know who writes for the Review?</p>

37

<p>I'm not about to post names online...he's in one of my classes, we've talked a few times, had lunch together...it's cool.</p>

38

<p>I should have read the entire thread rather than just the last page, this is definetly an argument started by Xanatos. That said, the reason liberals come to the defense of Dartmouth's "conservative" reputation is that, like it or not, conservatism is a turn-off for many top students. It tends to be exclusionary (i.e. no affirmative action, anti gay rights, anti-diversity houses, etc.) I am not saying this is true, but its the perception.</p>

39

<p>Just think what the perception of people of color and women were in the first half of the last century.
They are not directly comparable, but I doubt we would have said that we wanted to reinforce the (false) perception.</p>

<p>False perceptions are stubborn and false no matter what their subject is.</p>

<p>Though, as I said to Xanatos, being an apoligist for that which you respect (D) is a noble enterprize.</p>

40

<p>HAHA, look at where this thread as gone. </p>

<p>Slipper said:
"I absolutely agree with you that Dartmouth is not conservative at all. I have a problem with this thread because on quick glance it makes Dartmouth seem conservative when it is absolutely not. A great majority of people are liberal."</p>

<p>Yes I fully understand that, and I have never stated that Dartmouth was conservative in general (only in relation to the other ivys). Look, I know Dartmouth has changed over the years and the Dartmouth of Dinesh D'Souza and the Review in its heydays is no more, but I still stand by my point of comparing Dartmouth to the rest of ivys. If the ivy league were the democratic party, Dartmouth and Princeton would be Bill Clinton, the others would be Howard Dean, and Brown would be Ralph Nader. </p>

<p>Frame the issue like this: Which ivy would an average consevative feel most comfortable at? </p>

<p>Xanutz asks:
"Wow, so New Hampshire voted for Bush in 2000, this means that Dartmouth is clearly conservative in 2005?"</p>

<p>You seriously have to read before responding to these threads son...be my guest, please do show me where I ever stated Dartmouth was "clearly conservative". </p>

<p>Xanster: "So you see, most liberals are much more accepting of conservatives than the other way around." </p>

<p>I would beg to differ with that. Have you ever heard of the documentary called "Columbia Unbecoming"...it has to with academic freedom, profs using the classroom for a political platform, students being intimidated for their views (views which happen to fall on the conservative side of the political spectrum).</p>

<p>Have you ever tried to attend an event with a conservative speaker at Morningside Heights and been heckled at the door by protestors (this should give you a small clue about my grad school)? I'm not even one who normally takes politics all that seriously, but it seems that liberal tolerance is almost an oxymoron at some schools in the north east these days.</p>