I’d love to hear from anyone who took the IB Diploma and who was admitted to a selective college. My D is in an IB school; they offer only IB, no AP courses. For those who were admitted, did you take the standard 3 SL and 3 HL classes? And did you supplement the IB curriculum with any AP classes? Any feedback or advice is much appreciated.
IB is well regarded by colleges. Most count them on the same level.
Source: many people I know who did IB in high school at a T50 university + every post I’ve ever seen on college confidential.
Universities consider the IB a notch tougher than its AP equivalents. HL Mathematics is considered more advanced than AP Calculus BC, HL Economics is considered more advanced than AP Micro and Macro etc…
D did not do the IB diploma but took two HL IB classes plus many AP classes. She was accepted to several very selective liberal arts colleges and I believe her IB classes helped prepare her well for her first year of college. My S is doing the IB diploma program and he will be applying to colleges this fall (he does have a somewhat more rigorous curriculum than D). He is doing three HL courses and four SL courses plus many APs.
How selective do you mean? Top 10, top 20, top 50? My D graduated #1/#2 from her IB program in 2015 with a score of 40 I believe. 3H/3L as that was the school requirement. Did her EE in a foreign language. SAT 2100, ACT 31. She was rejected ED from Vandy, WL at several top 20 Northeast LACs including Bates and Middlebury, accepted at 2 schools in the top 20, admitted to all her LACS in the 28-40% accept rate range and all her safeties with great merit. She is attending the school that provided the best financial package, it did have a 38% accept rate, climbing now closer to 25%.
DD just finished IBD and is a predicted 44. Most of the international schools in our area are IBD and they routinely get kids into top 10 schools. My daughter did not get into her high reaches (closest was a waitlist at Brown) but did get into a number of top LACs, did get great merit aid offers, and did get a full ride (really really FULL) to the University of Pittsburgh.
IB is just as good as AP, and any school an AP student can get into, and IB student can get into as well. I took both IB classes and AP classes and went to Berkeley; lots of friends did one or the either and ended up in the same places (Harvard, Princeton, UCLA, Harvey Mudd, UPenn, CMU, etc etc).
D18 just finished IB program at our school; will not know scores until July. 3HL (Chemistry/English/History) and 3 SL (Calculus/Spanish/Biology) with TOK and an elective. My D18 chose an extra Science but could have chosen Theater or Art as well. We were told when touring the most selective schools throughout our search that taking the most academically challenging classes at your school is what you need to do in order to impress admissions. These were the ‘selective’ schools we visited but didn’t apply to some of them: Vanderbilt, UNC-Chapel, UVA (out-of-state), College of William and Mary (out-of-state), University of Richmond, and then also Duke, Rice, Georgetown and Washington and Lee but she decided not to apply. We took the comment to mean if IB is offered then you better be in the IB Program but if only AP if available then load up on them not just History and English (ie don’t take reg Government if AP Govt is offered; or reg Physics if AP Physics is offered, etc).
The way our high school structures the program you do not have many options for taking AP classes if you are on the IB track except Freshman and Sophomore years (D18 had APWH and APUSH and they let them take the AP English exam if they wanted even though their English was designated as Pre-IB/Honors… she got 4s). Also ONLY the students committed to the IB program (ie TOK on their schedules) can take the IB Classes at the Jr and Sr years; they make it a community type feel. My D18 LOVED being in the small classes with other academically minded students!
Not certain this will help but my D18 was admitted these ‘selective’ schools: Vanderbilt (RD), William & Mary-OOS (RD), UVA-OOS (EA), University of Richmond (EA)… also Furman (EA) and Birmingham-Southern (EA). She was waitlisted at Wake Forest (RD) and denied at UNC-Chapel Hill (EA) and then also accepted to UAB, Alabama and Auburn. My D18 is attending Vanderbilt in the fall and her 23 IB Classmates from our school will be attending these schools: Georgetown, Duke, Notre Dame, Tulane, Rhodes, Hobart-WilliamSmith, Loyola-Nola, SMU, U of Wyoming, SCAD-ATL, Ole Miss, Birmingham-Southern, UWF, UAB, UAH, Alabama and Auburn. My D18 dreamed of going out of state to a mid to small size school (3,000-16,000) where there was a strong collaborative student body, research opportunities and other like minded academically driven students; so those were the schools we targeted. Her other stats: 33 ACT, 4.46 GPA wtd, good ECs and Leadership of Service Club, Team Captain of Varsity Swim with a 6 year Letter, and great LoRs. I hope this helps (sorry wordy).
My IB diploma graduate went to Cornell and found that she was very well prepared for the demands of the curriculum there.
I think this is an important point. IB may or may not help you get admitted to the college you want (some of my daughter’s classmates thought that IB was actually a disadvantage because they had lower GPAs in IB than they probably would have had in the regular program), but once they get to college, IB graduates find that they’re very well prepared. IB teaches students how to manage their time, prioritize, and write – all very useful skills for college.
My D18 also just completed the IB program, no scores til July. She did take IB Econ last year and got a 6. She took mostly HL courses. Her courseload was the standard English, French, Bio, Math Studies, HOA, and of course, TOK. I don’t know her projected score (we don’t really focus too much on that) but she’s very confident in her French (7) and English (6-7) abilities, Bio and Math less so. She did take AP Euro (10th grade-4) and AP stats (4) last year as an alternative to Calc. Like the previous poster said, there’s not much room in the schedule for AP courses, although the kids can elect to take the exams if they choose (to get scores for college requirement waivers). Her extended essay was on a pretty obscure topic related to Peruvian immigration, racism, and assimilation. Most of her papers that the teachers pre-score (English/French) have gotten pretty good feedback (6-7) but of course the IB graders have the final say.
It’s my understanding that IB is looked on a bit more favorably than AP in the admissions process, just because it focuses more on critical thinking and writing than memorization. This is not to mean that AP is not rigorous, it’s just that those skills come into play more in college courses, especially those in liberal arts/social sciences/history that are required for graduation.
Her stats are iirc 3.9 UW, 4.5 W gpa, 32 ACT, 1320 SAT. As you can see, standardized testing is not her thing. She had lots of leadership, specialty French immersion programs, has taught herself several languages and is a very accomplished and creative writer, which I think helped her applications. Nothing big like published works/research, and no outstanding community service, just the same amount as what most kids do. One of her recs was good (IB French teacher), but averagely written, IMO, the other (IB Bio, IB program head) was glowing.
She didn’t do any ED or EA, and got into UVA (legacy), Richmond (half tuition scholarship), Florida (applied bec she was born there and we had prepaid college…this was a last resort), VCU (full tuition schol), Hampton (full tuition), William and Mary, and I think others, but she’s not here to remind me. She was waitlisted at Georgetown, denied at Penn and Brown.
She is going to Columbia in the fall. Her IB peers (total of about 35 this year) are largely going to UVA, William and Mary, and VCU (lots of Honors College). There is one going to Wake Forest and one going to American. One applied to Princeton but didn’t get in. Kids in this area tend to stay close to home/instate.
Selective colleges (if you’re talking Ivy or slightly lower) are mostly a crapshoot (based on acceptance rates) when you’re talking about many of the kids who are seeking info here on CC. Everyone’s going to be 4.0 and above, leadership in NHS/Beta/all the rest, has done community service, everyone’s taken high level courses. The only things that make them stand out are exceptional personal statements/essays or some really big hooks, and I’ve learned through reading here that most hooks aren’t as special as people think they are.
The Ivies were a pipe dream, and she wouldn’t have been shattered if she didn’t get into any. We expected her to end up at UVA, so make sure you set realistic goals and expectations since even the best of the best can’t often defeat a 5.5 - 8% acceptance rate.
Another perspective…
IB definitely prepares you for college level work.
Also, you can get many credits for doing the diploma.
For example, my DD went to SUNY Binghamton.
“Students in the International Baccalaureate Diploma Program may receive up to 32 credits. To receive the full 32 credits, the following conditions must be met:
The IB Diploma must be completed with a score of 30 or more points; and
The student must complete at least three Higher Level exams with a score of 5 or higher.
Diploma holders who meet these conditions receive credit for their individual exam scores plus additional liberal arts elective credit to total 32 credits.”
She took Math HL, CHem HL, Physics HL, German Ab Initio, English SL and Business SL.
She ended up graduating a year and a half early (with a couple summer/winter session courses) and was able to complete her Masters in that time so by the end of 4 years she had a Master’s Degree in Secondary Mathematical Education from Columbia University along with her BS in Math and was ready for a career in teaching.
IBD for admission IMO is way overstated, IBD as prep for college…priceless. My kids’ school spits out plenty of IBD kids, I can drive to 4 IBD schools, most of these kids will still go instate. The tippy top kids were tippy top in spite of the IBD, not because, they were already destined well before 11th grade. Most motivated students kids I see take 4 HLs/2sls and have 1 or 2 periods where they take 1 or 2 APs. Most good IBD kids here will have 10AP scores or more. They will often have 4 plus at end of soph year.
I know several IB kids that got into elite schools this year. We have a couple large IB programs close to us in an urban area, so we are acquaintances with few every year since I’ve had teens. They have unique stories and are from the Midwest though and I’m not sure had they gone an AP or dual enrollment route and all other things being the same for them, their outcomes would have likely been similar. For that matter, I know a kids from urban public schools that get into elites every year too that don’t do the IB path but have a fair number of college credits some other way.
Agree with Sybylla. IB kids may be poised better for college workload but I doubt it makes a huge difference in admissions. Heck - I know a kid heading to Princeton from a performing arts high school that only has a hand full of AP classes available. It’s probably more like a check mark on your application. Rigorous course load: Yes.
If you are deciding between IB and not, the real questions to ask are what does IBD drop out rate look like and what do the actual diploma scores look like, Good luck getting that data in the US schools .
@Alexandre
I recently watched an interview with the admissions director at Stanford who said they’re always excited to see an IB applicant because they know they’re well-prepared.
@NEPatsGirl
To answer your question about how selective I mean, here are the colleges my D wants to apply to:
Swarthmore
Haverford
Bryn Mawr
Wellesley
Washington U - St. Louis
Yale
Penn (Legacy)
Amherst (Legacy)
Princeton (Secondary Legacy)
Obviously there are a number of “reaches” on this list for any candidate, no matter how well qualified. We do need to find more choices in the safety range. Mainly, I wanted to be sure D’s program is rigorous enough that she can apply to any of these schools and be a competitive applicant (provided her scores/grades remain high).
@CValle
I’m not sure what you mean when you mention a score of 44. How are IB courses scored? And what would be considered a good score?
I’d be very happy to see my daughter get into one of her top choice LAC’s. At the top of her list is Haverford. The ivies are a long shot due to the incredibly low admission numbers.
@ASKMother
Thanks for the detailed info! Your D’s course load sounds similar to what my D will take. I’m glad to hear she got into some good schools.
@sunsheyen
I’m glad you mentioned there’s not much room in the schedule for AP courses when doing the IB diploma. Did your D do 3HL and 3SL courses?
@Sybylla
You mentioned most motivated kids take 4HL’s, 2SL’s and 4AP’s, and that they graduate with roughly 10AP courses on top of the IB Diploma. Am I missing something or is this insane?
Thanks for the input, everyone! My D’s school only offers IB courses, no AP courses and no regular (non-IB) courses. It’s a very small school. My D will work toward the IB diploma and she tentatively plans to take:
English HL
History HL
Visual Art HL
Mathematics HL or SL
Chemistry SL
French Ab Initio
Theory of Knowledge
CAS
I’m not sure if D should take Math SL or HL. She has been taking Honors Math in high school and she has earned all A’s. However, Math is not her favorite subject and I’ve heard the HL class is significantly more work. Can anyone comment on this?
Thanks!
Urbanmum, with the exception of Bryn Mawr, I would call all of these schools a reach for any student given the admissions rates of sub-25%. Add some match schools as well. Strongly consider ED to one of her LAC choices if she is leaning toward these.
Editing as I just went to another thread to see if you posted stats. Certainly the legacy will boost at Penn. and sounds like you are fully aware these are reaches. Lots of great schools on that list. With my older son (who applied ED to Haverford) he found Carleton, Pomona and Grinnell to be of similar feel to Haverford.
I know of full IB students at Swarthmore & George Washington, and just accepted to Princeton. I am sure all the top colleges recognize the rigor of the IB diploma.
My S is a good math student but it has become clear that he does not like it nearly as well as other subjects. He took honors pre calc as a sophomore and did well but it was not his strength, so he decided to do SL math for junior year and will do AP Stats senior year. S’s friend was over the other night and said several kids in the HL math class really struggled this year.
One of my sons did the full IB program. He took 3 HLs (Bio, English, Euro Hist) and 3 SLs (Spanish, Econ, Math Studies) and 11 APs.
Urbanmom, in S2’s experience, taking many APs was a way to ensure college credit/placement in case the IB scores weren’t high enough. My son did NOT prepare for the APs. He went in and winged it based on the IB courses, though some teachers covered both AP and IB topics in their courses.
He took the corresponding AP exam for most of these courses. In every case, the AP score earned him more credit than the IB score. Most colleges don’t give credit for SL exams, so S2 took AP for Calc AB, Stat, Macro, Micro and Spanish specifically to cover those bases.
He was well-prepared for college, but was seriously burned out by the end. His IB program was selective admit and very competitive, plus he had LD issues the school would not address. A gap year would have been a good thing for him. Got into UChicago, Tufts, UMD w/merit and URochester w/merit.
@MrMagoo You’re right…we’re on the lookout for some less selective colleges for D’s list. We’re looking at Grinnell, Brandeis, Smith, Mt. Holyoke, Carleton and Wake Forest. Wellesley has a surprisingly high acceptance rate. I think the women’s colleges are a little easier to get into and I’m thankful my D has the option. We also have an excellent state university in our city. Thanks for the feedback!