<p>I'm just wondering how prevalent it is that a student actually gets into a reach school?</p>
<p>Only if they are realistic reaches.</p>
<p>Well, HYPMS are reach schools for near everyone one of us non-royals, non-Olympian Gold medalists, right? That’s about 12000 right there.</p>
<p>@ hmom5, your cynical approach to college admissions does little to ease the anxiety of CC posters. You realize many of us are in the middle of one of the most stressful processes of your lives so far, right? Maybe you think you have the hard facts, but telling people you don’t even know where they stand and if they would make the cut…not helpful.</p>
<p>@ OP, The fact of that matter is that everyone has a shot at their reach school. If you have a decent record and are willing to pay the application fees and write the essays, then apply! College admissions is not a science, it’s an art. You never know when a school is going to be looking for a student like you, and you might be pleasantly surprised! That being said, obviously schools like HYPSM and the top liberal arts school are really hard to get into, so don’t get set on them. But yeah…they all accept people. And not everyone who gets into Harvard or Amherst has a perfect GPA and SAT score. Most of these colleges are using a holistic process. So, if you’re not shooting for Harvard with like…a 2.0 or something…you definitely have a chance.</p>
<p>@Hmom: Sorry to say that when your posts aren’t the least bit contributory no one cares what your past experience with admissions is. At this point i’ve rendered it as obsolete. I am not even talking about this particular post, for those of you who haven’t seen this woman tear apart ‘chance me’ type treads like I’m sure raelah and i have. </p>
<p>@Superjew: First of all i love your name XD. second of all my philosophy is that if you have a dream school or several dream schools and they seem out of reach, apply anyways. Wouldn’t you rather dish out the app money now to find out than regret not having applied at all? This is coming from a poor kid btw. My family has no money, but one thing that’s for sure is that we’re doing anything we can to get all the app money together.</p>
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<p>Raelah, my approach is factual as opposed to cynical. It’s based on experience as an ivy league adcom, the mother of three recent applicants, participation in the Country’s only college counseling program and a close read of common data sets.</p>
<p>Last time I looked, this was the chances board where students came to ask what theirs are. I know there are some looking for fell good answers and there are certainly enough of those made by posters such as yourself.</p>
<p>This is no place for anyone seeking a relief for anxiety.</p>
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<p>Statement like this are not only ridiculous, they are absurd. They show no understanding of the process and encourage kids to waste their time pursuing things that are not going to happen rather than facing reality and putting the effort into schools where they have a chance.</p>
<p>Jullia, your use of grammar and vocabulary is troubling for someone seemingly in the position to comment on admission to top colleges–I’d respond but I get caught up in that. Please make sure to have your application proofread.</p>
<p>@Hmom: Haha you’re incredible. You didn’t notice the spelling errors in your own response? XD At least I’m still a student…you should know by now.</p>
<p>Is this becoming the rip hmom5 thread?</p>
<p>In her defense, I’ve found her contributions to CC quite valuable. She provides a stark contrast to the deceptive and politically correct BS that admissions officers feed us.</p>
<p>“This is no place for anyone seeking a relief for anxiety.”</p>
<p>Actually that’s a big part of this forum, particularly the chance thread. Teens ask questions about colleges they are stressed out over. They will either find out their anxiety is misplaced and can relax over a school they know now is a reasonable match or safety. Or they can stop obsessing and move on about a college that they have little chance for. While your posts maybe factual they are done in a cynical way. Think about how you word your posts, not just their content. </p>
<p>You should not correct somebody’s grammar in a forum(it just further points out your cynicism), especially when the mistakes are so minor, I am pretty sure Jullia will be spending more time on her application then responding to a comment on the internet.</p>
<p>hmom5, I do agree that at times your posts may come off as somewhat harsh…although I genuinely value and commend your experiences. You seem like an impressive lady no doubt, however, I do agree with the posters above…sometimes the wording may of your posts may come off as offensive.</p>
<p>Thanks a ton for your help though!</p>
<p>[Cynical</a> Definition | Definition of Cynical at Dictionary.com](<a href=“http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/cynical]Cynical”>CYNICAL Definition & Meaning | Dictionary.com)</p>
<p>Those are definitions of cynical. What you’re objecting to is quite different from cynicism. You are objecting to straightforward delivery of facts pertaining to college admissions. Folks come here and ask, I answer. The OP and many, many others PM me for my opinions, so I freely offer them. I’m not here for tea or to make friends, I’m just sharing what I know.</p>
<p>I’ve been flamed many times and am well aware the state of delusion is preferable to many.</p>
<p>Should you not want my opinions, just put NO hmom on your posts, and I’ll skip them. Or do what I do–there are many posters including some on this thread that I skip over when reading threads–their opinions are not worth the time.</p>
<p>Here’s an article I posted yesterday. I’ll give you a new messenger to shoot. This explains why it’s highly unlikely for an unhooked kid, without very high stats across the board, to get into top colleges:</p>
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<p><a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/17/books/review/Wolff2.t.html[/url]”>http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/17/books/review/Wolff2.t.html</a></p>
<p>I haven’t seen hmom5 “rip” people, but the posts she has made have been helpful - at least to me. You can say whatever you want, but knowing that a former ad com is commenting on chances definitely adds some extra emphasis to the post because it’s from someone who has done this for a living. </p>
<p>That being said, it never hurts to tone anything down a little. Instead of saying something like “you have a better chance of getting hit by a meteor” (like that other kid did), you could say “your chances are pretty bleak. good luck.” It still conveys the message that you’re probably not getting in, but not as harsh. </p>
<p>As for OP - Well a reach is something that you would have a tough time getting into. Your question is too general because there are a wide variety of students with different backgrounds, and some obviously have better chances than others. All we can say on CC as students is “good luck man”. I hope you, me, and the rest of the great kids on here make it.</p>
<p>Hmom5 has been correct in all of her posts that I’ve read. If a school accepts 9-15% of their applicants, then 85-91% are rejected. And those are all rejections who thought that they had a shot. C’mon people - basic statistics says you aren’t getting in! What’s more, once you eliminate the URMs, athletes and legacies (who also must have the hurdle stats to get into the school in the first place and are part of that 9-15% acceptances), what is the REAL chance of getting in? Slim and none…</p>
<p>Apply to these schools, yes. Cross your fingers. But PLEASE don’t be disappointed when you don’t get in. It is highly UN-likely that you will.</p>
<p>Hmom5 and I aren’t saying this to be mean or to trash your stats/accomplishments/etc. But because it is the truth. Hear us!</p>
<p>Hmom5 is a great contributor on this board. I’m not gonna argue by saying she isn’t blunt in her responses, but since when was being blunt a bad thing? You go to “chance me” threads to get your chances at a particular institution, not to receive praise. The fact of the matter is, if you’re asking for chances at HYPS, chances (no pun intended) are that you will receive more criticism than praise.</p>
<p>@ hmom5, I don’t doubt your experience in the least. Perhaps your experience has made you an expert on admissions, and maybe you’re completely justified in offering the kiss of death to students aspiring to their dream schools. Most of the time, I have to admit, you’re probably right. However, judging by your extensive experience with this process, I’m shocked that you aren’t more empathetic towards what we students, especially overly-stressed ones, like on CC, are going through. I understand this is the Internet hence, very impersonal and it’s true, this isn’t just a “feel good” forum, but still, as a mother of recent applicants, and as an adcom member, I’m amazed that you see no merit in encouraging students along in this process. Why is it so necessary for you put down and respond so negatively? We don’t come here for support alone, but honestly, support is what most of us need to go through this process successfully. I’m sure it wouldn’t kill you to word your answers in a way that doesn’t rip us students to shreds. I know I’m not just speaking for myself when I say that sometimes your posts are downright upsetting.</p>
<p>Raelah, in fact, I am very empathetic which is why I’ve used much of my time as I’ve been off my feet recovering from surgery to post here.</p>
<p>Here’s what I know that is at the root of my approach: It greatly benefits students to get real about their chances early in the process. What I’ve seen over and over is kids hanging onto the hope of unrealistic schools and blowing their chances at realistic ones in the process.</p>
<p>They are so focused on getting the HYPSMCCCDDAWS supplements done and visiting those schools, they don’t focus on the schools they can get into and blow their chances at Emory, Vandy, Middlebury, Bowdoin, NYU and Colgate by not giving them priority.</p>
<p>There are few exceptions and few miracles in college admissions. If you don’t have the stats, no amount of prayer, great recs or great essays are going to get you in. Students here look at the numbers with no context. If they don’t have a hook getting into a school being being at the 50th percentile is highly unlikely. The sooner kids understand this, the sooner they can develop the strategy to get into the best possible college they can get into. Being the messenger is unpleasant, which is why I hired a private counselor to work with my youngest when I saw how brutal this ‘industry’ had become versus during my day.</p>
<p>Because there is so much white noise on these threads–kids with lower stats than the poster insisting they have a good shot mostly–it’s my opinion that some blunt assessment is necessary. Few others here are cutting to the chase and redirecting kids who need to be redirected.</p>
<p>@ hmom5 - See, wow! That just helped me understand you so much better. Thank you for posting that. I actually really agree with you, I just don’t think that you should pass judgement on students in such an all-or-nothing way. Can I make just one suggestion though? If you want people to hear you on this forum, it’s not blunt honesty that’s going to do the trick. You have you be more sensitive; tell them what you think, and then make a suggestion of a different school they might look at and love. I’m happy that you take the time to contribute here, I just wish that your great experience could be put to more productive use.</p>
<p>Truce.</p>
<p>Truce Raelah, but realize that’s just your opinion. My ongoing conversations with many, many kids here tell me I’m reaching them. As in life and business, there will be those who love me and those who hate me because my style is blunt. As I said earlier, I’m sure there are those who pass my posts by, and should, because they don’t like my style.</p>
<p>The clients who kept hiring me for 3 decades did so because they knew they’d get the truth right between the eyes. Others preferred to work with gentler folks. Whatever works for you! </p>
<p>I am who I am, as Popeye said, and I’ll never sugarcoat my posts.</p>
<p>hmom:
I read the link you provided to the NYT and found it very interesting. I looked around the blogs at the NYT and found one where the admissions head at Harvard answers questions. He didn’t come right out and say it, but it definitely reinforced what you have been saying on CC - normal, smart well rounded kids are a minority at Harvard. Several hundred are admitted who are intellectual super stars, several hundred others have enormous prestige though their ECs, and then there are the development admits.</p>
<p>I always look at what hmom writes. Her reality is so different from mine. Her background is of an east coast city professional with kids in private schools where college admissions is played like a contact sport. This is a very good counterpoint to my life in small town in the cornfields where the high school only sends one or two kids a year to a top 30 school. Her insights have been eye opening to me.</p>
<p>My answer to the OP - Occasionally people get into a reach school but you should never count on it. If there is a reach you want to go for, write that supplement towards the end of your application process. The supplements my daughter wrote for colleges 9 and 10 were better than the ones she wrote at the the beginning.</p>
<p>Twomules, I liked what you wrote about college admissions being a contact sport. My experience has been closer to Hmom5 but on the west coast: selective private school, SAT prep tutors, APs, ECs, college counselors, major support and competition – many kids sent to elite colleges. And even for those of us who are “privileged” with regard to admissions help and insight, we realize the cutthroat nature of the game. </p>
<p>I just wish that the students on this board would hear the experience we bring to the table and not think of it as a put down. It is meant to help. If it ends up as discouragement or a dose of reality, then take it to heart.</p>
<p>Reality is the name of the game. Don’t bet on your shot at the elite school. Really take a look at your true chances and bet on the match schools. Look at the chance backwards - if a school accepts 25%, 75% are rejected.</p>