Berkeley is becoming a basket case of left wing despotism and violence. That with funding problems, over crowding, inability to graduate in four years, huge classes etc make it increasingly seem like a third world basket case. GO MICHIGAN !
@Chrchill: This is why I’ve been working on my scurrying ability.
Does becoming a third-world basketcase lower or raise Cal’s PGD?
@Purpletitan Notice I said Go Michigan. Let’s not get carried away. From my lofty Harvard perch, we have to be kind to our mostly state funded all you can eat type institutions. Incidentally, that “we try harder” finishing school in New Haven is beginning to look at lot like Berkeley.
Let me elucidate the world order from you by sharing for what postion I, a Harvard graduate, finals club member and now CEO, would hire graduates from lesser institutions.
MIT – tech support
Cal Tech – assistant to MIT tech support
Princeton – landscaping consultant
Columbia – personal shopper
Stanford – personal trainer
UChicago – chess partner
Duke – body guard
Dartmouth-- bar tender
Penn – party planner
Cornell – chauffeur
Brown – art collection curator
Berkeley – shaman
Yale – have to draw the line somewhere; no offer.
^^^ You left out 1 unfortunate need…a lawyer
“Chicago law has always been top 5”… except when it was ranked 6th and 7th… sometimes it was even tied with Penn law (the horror!)
http://law.stanford.edu/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/lomio_etal-rp20.pdf
Actually Harvard, Yale, Stanford, and Columbia law schools are the only schools to have always been ranked in the top 5 since the rankings began…
Also, if US News is gospel then was Penn undergrad more prestigious and rigorous than columbia and chicago from 2008-2011?
http://publicuniversityhonors.com/2015/06/13/u-s-news-national-university-rankings-2008-present/
Looks like that “lesser” peer is pretty equal in the eyes of the rankings… the general public… reality… common sense… the list goes on
And yes, Penn students, like blondes, have more fun-- ain’t nothing to be ashamed of there
Please don’t insult blondes by comparing them to Penn graduates. There also was at least one year when NYU law school was ranked ahead of Columbia, which was sixth. In the eyes of the major law firms there are five clear top five law schools.
Yale
Harvard / Stanford
Chicago/Columbia.
@PennCAS2014 your valuable link shows that since 2012 both Columbia and UChicago are in a stable upswing and Penn has been declining.
Right so that was interesting and totally irrelevant. You said Chicago law was always ranked in the top 4; it was not. It also clearly wasn’t ranked 2/3 for “decades” since the rankings only started in like 1990 and by the 2000s Chicago was already out of the top 5.
Also, the years during which NYU ranked ahead of Columbia law, Columbia was still in the top 5, unlike Chicago. Meaning that since the inception of US News & World report rankings, only four law schools (Yale, Harvard, Stanford and Columbia) have consistently ranked in the top 5.
I literally don’t care about this beyond the fact that I don’t like misinformation about easily proven facts.
Me, the blondes, and the Penn grads are having a party that i’m gonna get back to now. BYE <3 
The blondes made me come back to make one last point which is:
Enjoy your “stable upswing” while it lasts! The US News gods giveth and the US News gods taketh away…
@Chrchill
Oh Jeebus!
I just tell my kid do your best but at all costs BEAT HARVARD!
Seems reasonable to me :-h
@Chrchill that’s some funny stuff there. Would you extend an offer to an ND or NU grad?
The most informative rankings are the WSJ rankings, which consider outcomes, engagement and resources – all critical factors in evaluating educational value. Based on those considerations, Stanford, MIT, Columbia, Penn and Yale come out on top. The WSJ’s scale (as well as the USNWR rankings, which are pretty good) offer a far more objective and static metric than the pre-disposed self-reporting numb nuts who are spouting off on this and other sites.
@Plato23 any ranking that does not have Harvard on top is sponsored by the alternative right. @sushiritto
I did not know that North Dakota and New Utah had universities.
As a variable, “outcomes” has big, big problems with “regional cost of living differences” and “scholastic/vocational selection” issues. To make it work, imo, you’d have to break it down not just by school, but also by major: that way we could compare students at different schools who have the same interests.
But I digress! More of @Chrchill’s staff:
Yale: Diva
Northwestern: Publicist
Johns Hopkins: Nurse
Vanderbilt: DJ
Emory: Soda Jerk
Wash U: Chef
CMU: Custodian/Handyman
Notre Dame: Altar Boy
Georgetown: Travel agent
Vanderbilt DJ would only play country music. That would not work with my cosmopolitan business associates.
Emory soda jerk may be a stretch as said graduate may not know how to operate the machine. I could not hire anyone whose university is a directional – Northwestern ?
I wouldn’t have a problem with the outcomes portion of the WSJ but they don’t normalize for area of the country. 60K in Phoenix is a lot different than 60K in San Francisco. Many graduates stay near there universities so yes, San Francisco and Boston are expensive areas to live. Schools in expensive cities get an artificial bump.
Vanderbilt might major in country but it minors in everything else. It can set up a Thomas Rhett/Beyoncé/NIN concert.
Emory, then, will hire their Coca-Cola lackey to run the soda fountain; Emory can be the safety/germ inspector.
And Northwestern is already working hard to spin your derogatory statement into something positive.
But by far the biggest problem with outcomes is that it is entirely dependent on your major, if I go to Stanford and major in social advocacy can I expect to make $90K? Probably not, so this average is almost worthless in determining salary by University. We all know what pays the best, MD, JD engineering/CS and graduating in engineering in any university way down the list is going to give you a better outcome than graduating from MIT in a social science.
Yep. At these elite schools, occupation is largely self-selected based on major, and CS/Engineering/Finance jobs tend to pay the best straight out of school. Not so much journalist, teacher, museum help, vacuum sales, wait staff, general office jobs. (it’s harder to get good jobs right away from the soft science and humanities majors. Anyone can move up in an office environment, but it takes time…)