<p>I attend a public school with thousands of students. My guidance counselor is very nice but doesn't know me very well and hasn't really heard of my favorite school (Penn). I'm afraid she might not have much to write about. Is it required to have a recommendation from a counselor? If so, how can I get to know my counselor better?</p>
<p>Thank you! :)</p>
<p>Take a look at Penn’s admission requirements. The way I read this, they want two teacher recommendations and a secondary school report, which your counselor will have to fill out (look at the Common App to see what that entails). [Penn</a> Admissions: Apply Online or Download Application Forms](<a href=“http://www.admissions.upenn.edu/applying/incoming.php]Penn”>http://www.admissions.upenn.edu/applying/incoming.php)</p>
<p>At my D’s school (also with thousands of kids) the counselors ask the kids and their parents to answer a fairly detailed questionnaire that they use to help fill out the secondary school report and recommendations, when needed. To find out what your school does … Well, you just gotta go in to the office and ask!</p>
<p>The GC recommendation is very important, and in my view typically much more so than other recommendations, because the GC is in a unique position to distinguish between top students, from that HS with 1000s of students, who are applying to the same college(s). Teachers, especially at the large HS’s, generally do not see all of the top students and so cannot make this comparison. </p>
<p>The GC recommendation should talk about your personality, aspirations, emotional intelligence and character, which are things that do not show up on paper. In my view the GC rec is especially important if you want to go to the top state public school or a well known private school to which a lot of students from your HS typically apply. </p>
<p>My son was in the same boat as you heading into his senior year – at a HS with 2000 students and with a GC office who did not know him well. At the beginning of senior year, he met with the GC, gave her a little biography of accomplishments, academic awards, work etc. He also talked with her a bit about what he had been doing the last few years, what schools he wanted to attend, and why.</p>
<p>This seemed to work as she gave him an excellent personalized recommendation and he got into the top state schools in his state (UVA and W&M) plus a good private (Wake Forest) and the honors program of an OOS public with a big scholarship (OSU). He also was wait listed at a couple of others where he may not have even hit the 25th percentile re SATs (ie Duke, Hopkins, Chicago with 2130 SAT). I am not saying the GC recommendation made all of the difference because he also had top grades and AP scores (including a 5 on Calc B/C) but I do think the GC recommendation significantly helped him. </p>
<p>I suspect that when people, on this board, with 2300-plus SATs and 4.4 GPAs, get wait listed or rejected by schools they considered matches or safeties, it is often due to a lukewarm (or positive, but generic) GC recommendation compared to other students from the same HS.</p>
<p>Well…
At my school hardly anyone applies to Ivies. Out of those few students, only a couple will apply to Penn (Stanford seems to be the most common choice for those who apply to top schools). Virtually everyone applies to state schools or state private schools. </p>
<p>I think the school has some sort of a questionnaire system. </p>
<p>I’d like to have a letter that isn’t just on-paper accomplishments; I really want my counselor to get to know my personality.
My original counselor knew me very well but retired 2 years into my schooling.</p>
<p>I think it will be hard for my counselor to distinguish between what you classify as a “positive, generic” letter and and a “wow” letter. It’s kind of a gray area, especially for a counselor outside of the prep school ivy-driven circuit.</p>
<p>Thank you absweetmarie and muckdogs07 for your insights!</p>
<p>Thanks for clarifying the situation and not trying to be haughty – sorry if it cam across that way.</p>
<p>In any event, write the letter you want the GC to send, with your parents and friends perhaps reviewing it to make sure your observations are consistent with what others think, and give the letter to the GC along with your bio and a few other materials. </p>
<p>Also, if you are really sure about Penn apply ED. Penn takes half its class ED and the acceptance rate ED is at least 3 times higher than RD.</p>
<p>The counselor recommendation is one of the few parts of the application over which you have no direct control. There are, however, some things you can do to try and receive a strong letter of rec from you GC.</p>
<p>Make an effort to meet with your counselor semi-regularly. This can be tough when a counselor is responsible for hundreds of students, but I think it’s worth it. Whether it’s just spending a few minutes talking over college options, or it’s a long discussion about your goals, it at least gives the counselor some idea of who you are. Some people wait until their senior year to talk with their counselor at all, which I think is a mistake because it doesn’t give you time to establish a good relationship.</p>
<p>If your school has a questionnaire to fill out for letters of rec, that can be a good way for you to give your counselor some details of your accomplishments. You can also simply ask your counselor to include certain details or to play up certain aspects of your high school experience in the letter.</p>
<p>@muckdogs07- Thank you for the advice.
Do you know if an ED acceptance would retract applications to my state schools? </p>
<p>Penn is my first choice, however my ability to attend would depend on the financial aid available to me. </p>
<p>@Penguinto22:
Thank you for the suggestions!</p>