<p>To all you abortionists - I hope you get aborted someday</p>
<p>Statistically, most Israelis are Jews. That doesn’t mean they consult the Torah for everything they do</p>
<p>If abortion goes against your religion, don’t get one.</p>
<p>Unless there’s a population crisis, really can’t see how people can be against abortion especially on secular grounds.</p>
<p>America was founded in Christian principles, but has never been a Christian nation. The establishment clause of the First Amendment makes that clear, as do the subsequent SCOTUS rulings over the decades.</p>
<p>Israel was created with the purpose of establishing a place for Jewish people to live because Western nations feared the Jews during WWII and didn’t want them migrating over to Britain or the US. (Yes, the West was pretty anti-Semitic then, too.) That’s why there’s the big argument over Palestine vs. Israel–Israel was created with the help of Britain, who pushed out the Palestinians so Jews wouldn’t flee to Britain.</p>
<p>Abortion is baby killing. I just read Ron Paul’s new book and it made a good point about abortion. Let me quote it</p>
<p>From Liberty Defined,</p>
<p>"On one occasion in the 1960s when abortion was still illegal, I witnessed, while visiting a surgical suite as an OB/GYN resident, the abortion of a fetus that weighed approximately two pounds. It was placed in a bucket, crying and struggling to breathe, and the medical personnel pretended not to notice. Soon the crying stopped. This harrowing event forced me to think more seriously about this important issue.</p>
<p>That same day in the OB suite, an early delivery occurred and the infant born was only slightly larger than the one that was just aborted. But in this room everybody did everything conceivable to save this child’s life. My conclusion that day was that we were overstepping the bounds of morality by picking and choosing who should live and who should die. These were human lives. There was no consistent moral basis to the value of life under these circumstances.</p>
<p>Some people believe that being pro-choice is being on the side of freedom. I’ve never understood how an act of violence, killing a human being, albeit a small one in a special place, is portrayed as a precious right. To speak only of the mother’s cost in carrying a baby to term ignores all thought of any legal rights of the unborn. I believe that the moral consequence of cavalierly accepting abortion diminishes the value of all life.</p>
<p>It is now widely accepted that there’s a constitutional right to abort a human fetus. Of course, the Constitution says nothing about abortion, murder, manslaughter, or any other acts of violence. There are only four crimes listed in the Constitution: counterfeiting, piracy, treason, and slavery. Criminal and civil laws were deliberately left to the states. It’s a giant leap for the federal courts to declare abortion a constitutional right and overrule all state laws regulating the procedure. If anything, the federal government has a responsibility to protect life—not grant permission to destroy it. If a state were to legalize infanticide, it could be charged with not maintaining a republican form of government, which is required by the Constitution. "</p>
<p>I hope this is allowed by CC btw</p>
<p>Xenophanes- The secular argument against abortion is that since fetuses are biological humans, they have human rights. Just because they’re dependent on someone else doesn’t make them sub-human. Using the logic of abortionists, there’s no reason we shouldn’t forcibly kill mentally disabled people or very old people.</p>
<p>In YOUR eyes. For other people, it’s not. In a world where people can make their own choices about THEIR OWN BODY, why should it affect you? Oh wait, it doesn’t. What a woman wants to with her body, is none of your biddnezzzzzzzz.</p>
<p>Nobody gives **** about the woman. It’s about the baby. Read the post again</p>
<p>Lullies- Why doesn’t the baby have rights to THEIR OWN BODY? I’m a strong secularist in terms of my view of government (I think pornography, gay marriage, etc should not be regulated by the government) but I just can not turn off my logic enough to say that a fetus is not deserving of fundamental human rights?</p>
<p>Tell me, if you were a fetus in your mom again right now, would you support her choice to have your brains vacuumed out because your life was inconvenient to her?</p>
<p>There’s no objective morality (disregarding God). Correct? Therefore, nothing is inherently good nor bad. Correct? So the humans rights argument is trashed outside the window because there’s no such thing as human rights in the sense that as a human you’re entitled to X. Now, you may ask why not legalize murder? Because it’s impractical. There’s no reason to allow murder. In a society where murder is legal, everyone will be free to kill each other thus causing the destruction of society. But, what exactly is wrong with killing a foetus connected to the mother? If we don’t need the extra population and she doesn’t need a child, why should we force her?</p>
<p>^ Woooooww.
Do you support the killing of small children? What specifically, is the difference?</p>
<p>Something tells me you wouldn’t be so confident if it was your life on the line. Yeah you don’t think there’s anything wrong with murder…until a kidnapper has a gun to your head.</p>
<p>Seriously, you have no idea how much of an absolute PUSS you sound like when you say murder is not immoral. It’s easy to say that in Whiteville, USA where you are spoon-fed life and have absolutely no threats to your safety or property. I guarantee if your mom was cooked alive you’d have a different tune. If you become a parent, I’d love to see your reaction if your 4 year old daughter was raped and thrown off a cliff, and then see what you just posted. What if you found out your incontinent grandmother had her limbs cut off and was left to be eaten alive by coyotes in a forest? You’d say the perpetrators were not immoral? What if someone burned your house to the ground, and you didn’t have insurance? You’d say they weren’t immoral?</p>
<p>Hell, if someone stole your computer you’d probably ***** a fit and want their head cut off.</p>
<p>Basically, infringing on the rights and freedom of others is objectively immoral. You’re a hypocrite if you say otherwise.</p>
<p>Lol, god I hate arguing against philosophically ignorant. But, yeah no I don’t support it. Dude, obviously I wouldn’t want to be murdered given the will to live. However, if the kidnapper was doing it to save his wife or some **** I can sympathize. Situations like that should be allowed. Look up logical fallacies and spot the one you used. Is it advantageous for society? No. Is it advantageous for the government? Is it advantageous for the individual? No. So why?</p>
<p>Dude, relax. Emotions and rationality don’t mix. Your post is full of emotions. Murder isnt immoral but it isn’t also moral. But, morality isn’t connected to the law so what’s the problem ese? </p>
<p>Disregarding God, how is wrong?</p>
<p>I may say they are immoral but that doesn’t mean I believe nor that they are immoral.</p>
<p>Also, if the mother doesn’t want a small child she can give him up for adoptions. But, if a pregnant lady doesn’t want her child she can’t transmit it onto another mother. That’s the difference.</p>
<p>Should a mother be given the right to have an abortion if she were raped? </p>
<p>Personal reasons make me pro-choice. It’s the mother’s choice, not yours.</p>
<p>America probably started off as a Christian nation, but it has surely dwindled far from Christianity. I agree that people should have entitlement to their beliefs, but why push Christianity out of the way? I’m not talking stopping gay marriage,or the like, but simple stuff, like praying over your food, then all of a sudden, you’re on the 8 o’clock news for breaking school rules. <em>smh</em> Everyone should be allowed personal freedom.</p>
<p>And to the abortion argument above me: pulling out an fetus, stabbing a hole in its brain, and sucking out the insides, just because a mother doesn’t want a baby seems pretty illogical to me. The only reason I can justify abortion in any way, is when you have been raped. But when your just straight up irresponsible (not rapes, but non-safe sex), the baby needs to live.</p>
<p>Xeno- Haaaaaaaa. You’re trying to use the ‘I’m smarter than you, therefore I’m right’ argument.
Sorry to break it to you, but I would all but guarantee you that I am, in fact, more intelligent than you are. You’re just an average American that thinks reading a book from an obscure philosopher or something means you just know more than others. I really, really am enjoying your pretend-time play as a pseudo-intellectual.</p>
<p>@tofugirl- No one is pushing Christianity out of the way. For your example, it is against school rules NOWHERE to pray personally at school, or with friends, with a teacher at lunch/after school, etc. School prayer is only prohibited in the form of public schools officially recognizing and mandating that students pray, with employees leading.</p>
<p>Dusterburg - Well Said. Tell it to the charlatan</p>