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<p>Mixed! While, it might be a great experience for the participants, it might not be the panacea some want us to think it is. Probably fewer than 20 percent of the teachers stay in the profession within four years. It could be part of the solution, but only a smallish part.</p>
<p>Here’s what Linda Darling-Hammond thinks about it. </p>
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<p>I have zero doubt that there are more than a few who would fit that pattern, and I HAVE met my share of such wonderful and … exceptional persons. Unfortunately, exceptional has also a meaning that intimates rarity.</p>
<p>According to the amazon book description, Shrag’s 2005 book (another 7 yr old reference) is about “describing in poignant detail the impact of funding inequities on individual students and why ‘money matters’ in rectifying educational inadequacies” and "describes a powerful new movement that has emerged across America in recent years to bridge the wide gap still separating the achievement of African American and Latino students from their white and Asian counterparts ". This sounds like a different focus than about the training of the educators per se.</p>
<p>Well, Xiggi, I hate to bang the drum too loudly for my H. He might have been surpassed edumacationally by the Biochem PhD who also teaches in his department, in this run o’the mill public school.</p>
<p>No service profession is exempt from critics and disgruntled clients/customers/patrons. If my worst professional experiences were those listed in #87, I’d consider myself lucky. Where I live, if I were a teacher who completely ignored all of those incidents as if they didn’t occur, there would be no repercussions to my career whatsoever. Very few employed persons can say that.</p>
<p>Xiggi, us students perform well above the median, which scores were you expecting on the Timms test?
The most recent data is from 2007)</p>
<p>jym26 - re achievement gap and testing: this is very interesting. There’s a public school system where the gaps are narrowing constantly, and where the kids continue to outperform other peers. That public school system is - on US military bases. And exempt from much politics that affect schools nationwide (for example, no child left a dime.) </p>
<p>“schools on the nation’s military bases have outperformed public schools on both reading and math tests for fourth and eighth graders.”</p>
<p>“the achievement gap between black and white students continues to be much smaller at military base schools and is shrinking faster than at public schools.”</p>
<p><a href=“Military Children Outdo Public School Students on NAEP Tests - The New York Times”>Military Children Outdo Public School Students on NAEP Tests - The New York Times;
<p>annasdad–funny because Saxon Phonics was a wonderful program in our kids’ school. By Halloween of 1st grade ALL of the kids were reading chapter books, and understanding what they read because of Saxon Phonics. The spelling was amazing with these kids too. The upper grades had to rework the curriculum because the kids had finished what was normally done by the end of second grade in 1st grade—so, explain why it was such a success in our school and your kid failed it? See the problem with blaming the teachers?</p>
<p>These kids are all now going to be seniors in high school, most looking at top schools around the country, very successful students with high scores on the ACT/SAT’s, etc. Also in a rural midwest area.</p>
<p>All of the studies on achievement gaps are flawed, I think. The issue is not the color of their skin but their income level. I would like to see studies done between college educated white families and low income white families. My guess is the numbers will look the same as you see between the upper income black families and the lower income black families.</p>
<p>eastcoascrazy–I think I know every one of those parents :D.</p>
<p>Steve, there are many studies that do control for socio-economic status that still show substantial racial achievement gaps.</p>
<p>Yes socio-economic factors play a role, as do housing patterns, but so does racism.</p>
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Not necessarily. I know a lot of wealthy Asian families and a lot of poor ones too. It is not uncommon for the students in the poorer segment to have a fierce drive to excel to catch up in the next generation. </p>
<p>I think the problem is multidimensional. The priority of the adults and peer group is a huge factor too - if they feel learning the 3Rs is not important or uncool, the best teacher with unlimited resources will still have problems</p>
<p>In our run of the mill surban CA high school, D’s teachers included a former lawyer who teaches English and TOK for IB. Also coaches Mock Trial. A Smith grad with a double major in Bio/Psych who teaches those subjects for AP and IB. And Art History/History grad from Pitzer who teaches AP Euro with amazing results (most of the students are sophmores). Many other great teachers whose background I just don’t know off the top of my head. Really, except for Spanish most of her teachers were excellent. I didn’t always love their policies (really hated the 7 bio finals this year), but they were good teachers.
At the end of every PTO meeting, we held an open discussion with the Principal. And in nearly every one of those discussions we heard from some parent complaining about the test/homework/grading policy of some teacher. Overall, the principal does a good job of balancing the teacher/parent interests. And the IB/AP/Athletics/Special Need/Music departments. </p>
<p>I really think the problem we have with education starts in kindergarten or at least elementary school. When the parents pull the kids for a vacation, or a mental health day. When they suggest that no homework be assigned during Little League season. As soon as education becomes a lower priority than XXX, a pattern is set.</p>
<p>I dunno, Mom2M. Homework in kindergarten and even first grade is unheard of in top scoring countries such as Finland, Norway, Japan and Singapore. Our friends from France were shocked how much was required of kindergarteners in the US. In fact, in northern Europe kids don’t really start serious reading lessons until they’re about 7. In the first couple of elementary grades in Japan, kids spend less time on characters or math than American kids - instead the focus is on art, music and ‘being a good citizen’ which includes social skills and even cleaning their own school. Yup, first graders mopping floors: I’ve seen it, and it’s impressive. </p>
<p>In most of those countries school revs up significantly, as does homework, only toward 5th-6th grade, by which time school authorities start separating pupils into ‘college prep’ and ‘vocational’ tracks. (Shocking to most Americans.) As we know, by the time they’re in middle school kids in Singapore and Japan do little during the day besides school work. Summer vacations include getting expensive tutoring and studying. By high school, the stress is significant and the pressure is relentless from school and parents alike. </p>
<p>I believe Americans simply would not put up with this. We live in a society that values other achievement, and in fact REQUIRES it for entrance to the most prestigious universities. You want to get into HYPSM? You can’t just be an outstanding student. You have to excel in other areas too. That is not the case in countries like Japan, Finland, Singapore etc. where good grades and test scores alone will get you into the top schools. </p>
<p>Simply put - academic achievement in and of itself isn’t valued very much here, even for entrance into the top schools. So I would say, our educational issues start with the university system and continue throughout the 13 years of education that precede it.</p>
<p>Dad<em>of</em>3–there is an achievement gap between Asian students and white students, to the favor of the Asian students though. To not be politically correct, the students are more pointed to black students across the nation than any other minority group.</p>
<p>katliamom–our younger two had homework in kindergarten and first grade. It took all of 10 minutes on a bad day to complete. They had it done before they finished their after school snacks. I LOVED that homework. It instilled a fantastic routine for getting homework done that they still use today. Even now, parents that complained about that homework are saying the same thing, it was a great way to help start teaching study habits.</p>
<p>Read the “Outliers”…it gives some interesting information regarding Asian academic achievement, especially in math…tied to their language & Rice Paddies!</p>
<p>Not to generalize too much about Asians…“Poor Asian families” are poor becaus they are the first generation, a lot of those parents were professionals and middle upper class in their home country. Their educational level is comparable to most middle class parents in the US, so it is not surprising that their next generation should do well in school. On top of that, those parents must have a lot more drive and work ethic to leave their home country and move to this country. It’s a very self selecting group.</p>
<p>Quite a few teachers have told me that they would far rather teach motivated students who are poor, non-English speaking, or developmentally delayed than unmotivated smart students who come from well-off families. More than anything except the student him/herself, the parents determine whether a child will be successful in school. </p>
<p>In our schools, we have a lot of Hispanic children whose parents speak very little English. (With the numbers we have, some of them must be here illegally.) Most of these parents believe strongly that education is the key to the American Dream. They come to every PTA meeting, they come to parent-teacher conferences, and they treat the teachers with respect. They may not be able to help their children with homework, and they may not have computers at home, but they do their level best to support their children’s education. Guess what? Even with the disadvantages at home, a lot of these students do very well in school – because of the values they are learning at home from their poor, uneducated, non-English speaking parents.</p>
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<p>I think the way we do it is better. We need citizens who can excel in every facet of society, not just book learning.</p>
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<p>I disagree with this. Academic achievement is highly valued here. But scholars who have something additional to offer are valued more. I don’t see anything wrong with that.</p>
<p>I don’t see that much wrong with that either, Bay. Our system places a huge value on personal engagement, leadership, risk taking and out-of-the-box thinking. None of these qualities square terribly well with performance on standardized tests. Which may be a reason why American kids don’t do as well on those tests as their counterparts elsewhere.</p>