Issues w/ writing and French major schedules - who to contact?

Parents Forum
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<p>Hello everyone, </p>

<p>I'm planning out my tentative schedule for the next 2 1/2 years, and I'm trying to fit both a French and Writing major in this time frame (including summers). I'm finding some quirks and concerns that I know I should talk to someone about. I just don't know who since I might want to take two classes at the same time/find other alternatives. The last time I asked someone about a French class, I was referred to 3 other people, so maybe with your experience you can help me determine which head to talk to from the bat. </p>

<p>I'm taking FRH 201 now and am set to take 202 in the winter. Here's my major concern, however: next fall, I'd have to take the intro to French lit class AND the grammar review class AND the 2 half-classes consisting of writing and speaking. So that'll be 12 full credits of just French, along with an upper level writing class. </p>

<p>That seems like way too much, and for the intro to French lit class, they highly recommend you to take the grammar review class as a prerequisite. But how can I do that when I'm only set to take 202 this winter and that's the grammar review's prerequisite?? My thoughts are to either try and test out of 202 and go on straight to the grammar review or to ask to take them together. </p>

<p>I don't want to sound like a snob, so I want to approach this carefully. By no means do I think I'm ultra-smart in French, but I am pretty good and most importantly, I work really hard at it. I know I could catch up on grammar if I have to, but I don't think my speaking is quite up to par for jumping into the lit class. Reading and writing grammar is one thing, but talking out loud about what I think is another.</p>

<p>I'm honestly concerned that I'll be in over my head trying to take all those upper level French classes next fall. Wouldn't it be easier for me to take the easier 202 and grammar review together rather than the grammar review with the harder ones?</p>

<p>Should I even ask anyone about this? And what should I try to do? Ask to take both at the same time? I know I'll need the extra speaking practice in 202, so I wouldn't be opposed to taking both. My school doesn't offer French classes over the summer, so that's not a possibility either. And I have to take 4 lit classes in a sequence with the intro lit class next fall being the first. So that's basically set. </p>

<p>Should I contact the Chair of the Department of Modern Languages, the French Section Head or the major's adviser? I know the Chair and we have a good rapport, but I don't want to pester her. However, last year the adviser didn't know what to do and the section head said it's up to whoever teaches the class, which only the chair knew at the time. It was a headache of an email circle. </p>

<p>I'm also going to see if any of my writing classes can be taken during the summer so I'd have more room for French. I'd contact either the major's adviser or the Chair for this Department as well. </p>

<p>Thanks so much, and sorry for the rambles! I just want to get this straightened out soonish so I can adjust my winter schedule and start independently studying accordingly.</p>

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<p>What level is 202 at your school…?
At mine, there is FREN101+102, then two 200-level grammar courses, then you’re allowed to start taking intro literature classes but there is a conversation course and another grammar course recommended before going into lit, with good reason. I don’t know how the classes at your school are, but at mine, the vast vast majority of the students in even the intro lit classes (the highest level you’re allowed to place into for the major, even with a great AP French score) have been taking French since the beginning of high school or even the beginning of middle school (which was what I did). There were precious few students who started through 101 in college or otherwise only had 4 semesters’ worth and they were at a huge, obvious disadvantage. Their accents were very flat even if their pronunciation was… okay… and their understanding of overall grammar was shallow – understanding of the very nuanced grammar found in a lot of literature was nonexistent. They really, REALLY struggled. I hate to be a Debbie Downer but you REALLY should probably take 202 and a grammar review before even thinking about trying to start literature classes if your school is anything like mine. If there is no room for Writing classes over the summer, if I were in your shoes I would think about dropping Writing down to a minor… (Also depends on how many credits are required since our French major requires, IIRC, 8 credits past the intro literature level).</p>

<p>Good luck in any case!
(–a French major)</p>

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<p>12 credits of French courses plus one other course seems like a typical normal course load of 15 or 16 credits. Is that more than you have usually taken?</p>

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<p>Hi there, </p>

<p>202 is the second part of “intermediate French.” Students are meant to take through 202 (by either placement or taking them) before they take the grammar review and then the conversation/speaking courses. After the grammar review, we have to take 2 “intro” lit courses (called “intro to French Lit” and then “survey of French Lit”) before taking 2 full-fledged lit courses. These are all offered in order once a semester, so intro lit fall, survey lit winter, lit 1 the following fall and lit 2 that winter. </p>

<p>I had 3 years of French in high school, and even though I originally tested into 102, I started over to get a better foundation (mine was a pit patchy since I had a few terms without French in high school). I’m doing pretty good right now in 201, but my accent isn’t great and I know I could use more practice. I’m planning to study abroad, so I’m sure that would help with it. </p>

<p>And I usually take 16 credits, but I’ve only ever had one French class at a time. I’m worried that I’ll get confused and overwhelmed with 3 going on at one time. </p>

<p>I mean, if I have to, I supposed I could take 5 years to finish both, especially if it means a better mastery of French. But COULD I do it in 4?</p>

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<p>If you had 3 years in high school but tested into 102, that makes me think your high school instruction was not particularly good/thorough :|. I see this too much in the school system these days, grumble grumble. Even if you went some time without French, after 3 years I’d think you could still expect a solid base to test into 202ish - I don’t think that’s your fault. How easy are you finding 201? If you feel like you were maybe placed a bit too low (after 3 years!!) then yes, I might ask them to make an exception re: taking 202 and the grammar review in the same semester. (+If you want accent help, feel free to shoot me a PM, I have skype?) If your grades are great and your teacher likes you and can vouch for you, departments can sometimes be persuaded into being flexible on things like that.</p>

<p>How many credits are required for the major? Or is it just the ones you listed? I’m thinking about ours now–we had to take intro to lit, then 3 literature courses (medieval[which is hard], roughly 16th-18th century, and 19th-modern), then 4 more courses chosen from 2 different lists of upper-level lit/special topics courses. If your program is fairly exhaustive like ours^ I would think it might be easier to take 5 years to do it since you’re being forced to waste class space on the lower-level courses if you really really want to double major; all of the majors I knew went directly into intro to French lit their freshman year. You’ll definitely end up taking more than one French class per semester regardless, I’m sure - I had one semester that was 3 different French classes at once, hah. I had trouble thinking in English for the rest of the day. :P</p>

<p>I had language ADD and was trying to double major and ended up hopping around a lot and dropping my second major (English) to focus on French - you may find later in your undergrad career that you care more about one than the other and drop one down to a minor to finish in 4 years if it looks like it’s going to take 5. It wouldn’t be the end of the world if you did since liberal arts degrees tend to be fairly interchangeable for getting into most grad programs. :P</p>

<p>edit - re: study abroad - general advice - if you do, try to stay with a host family, not in student housing, and try to stay away from making too many American friends; try to find French ones. I stayed with a host family for 2 months for a summer exchange program and spoke not a single word of English (didn’t have a choice, lol!) and came back with my accent/fluency leagues above those of students who studied abroad for a semester and still better than most of the ones who stayed even a year because they stayed in the dorms with the other Americans and spoke English in their downtime or were speaking French with students on their same level who couldn’t correct their mistakes. This probably seems super obvious but I figured I’d mention it anyway just in case. :P</p>

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<p>Oh and on who to contact - you’d probably need to talk to your teacher for a recommendation first, since I doubt any exceptions will be made without a professor vouching for you and saying s/he thinks you can do it. Then, if you and the chair are pretty tight, I’d go straight to her, yes. I have a better relationship with my department advisor so I usually get her to point me to the right person which is also an option.</p>

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<p>Thanks so much, frenchie! I will for sure pm you after I get out of work :)</p>

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<p>Is there any reason why you need to major in both? In my opinion (I am a professor so I interact with a lot of students about this issue), students are often over-invested in having a double major, or having a long string of minors.</p>

<p>Is there any reason why you can’t major in French and minor in Writing (or vice versa)? I can’t imagine any future employer of yours saying, Why did you major in French and only minor in Writing?</p>

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<p>You’re not going to get any answers if all you do is send emails. You need to make a sit-down appointment with the chair if the advisor does not know the answer to your question. </p>

<p>I also agree with Amesie re the double major. Unless you have some very arcane goal, I’m not sure why you have to fit in two majors either. Spending an extra year in school for a double major in French and Writing is only for those who have money to burn, and it won’t make you more employable.</p>

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<p>Thanks so much for your replies! I appreciate it, and also, please allow me to elaborate a little bit. </p>

<p>This is quite clich</p>

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<p>The classes you’d be taking aren’t random extra classes; they are the things that will make you an educated person, a better writer, and a much better French major.</p>

<p>Do you realize how much contemporary French culture was influenced by both world wars, and are you signed up for a 20th century European History class? Do you understand why French film is so influential in the world, and have you taken a history of film class? Do you know why places like Versailles are influential in the development of architecture, landscaping, design? Why is French spoken in parts of Africa and the Caribbean (and Canada) and have you taken a class in African culture to understand how French colonialism changed the globe? Why did educated people in Russia speak French and how was Tolstoy influenced by the mythology surrounding Napoleon?</p>

<p>You don’t need to double major; you need to get an education. French is a wonderful subject but you are cheating yourself if you view the other classes you take as “filler”. Writing is a wonderful major as well, but you need to fill in the blanks on your education to be a good writer as well.</p>

<p>And don’t even think about an extra year to double major. At many colleges, you could be mostly done with a Master’s degree in that extra year… not worth it for a second major at all, regardless of what you are paying for it.</p>

<p>If French is “your thing”, then go be the best you can be. That means History, Painting, sculpture, literature, design, film, world politics and geography, law, etc.</p>

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<p>Another thought: what if I offer to even audit the grammar review class while I take 202? </p>

<p>I don’t care about when I take it. I just want to be prepped for the lit classes. If I audit it in the winter and then take it for credit in the fall, I’ll be prepared for the lit class and still be on track. </p>

<p>Would that prove to them that I’m serious about doing well with the major?</p>

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<p>Can you talk to your professor and see if you could take the Grammar Review in the winter, skipping 202 entirely?
Your idea of auditing Grammar review before taking it is a good PlanB though.</p>

<p>When are you going to study abroad, if not this Spring - next Fall? Spring 2015?
If Spring 2015: due to where you live, can you fit in a little trip to Qu</p>