<p>I want to be a teacher after my education, and people tell me that (including my parents) it's a "waste of my mind." I might as well go to UConn, they say, and pay way less if I want to become a teacher. Didn't teaching used to be considered a fairly noble profession? I think I have teaching in my blood. I love tutoring kids, and seeing them "get" what I get after practice and various explanations. But why is it that the majority of people don't think teachers work hard? I guess there are some issues with secondary school teachers, but I'll tell you, I know a LOT of high school teachers who work hard too. Why do doctors, lawyers, engineers, writers, and scientists deserve Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, MIT, etc., but teachers should only bother going to their state schools? (Not to mention that my state school doesn't have my degree program.) Also, people think teachers don't make good money. They do. Sure, you're never going to be rich, but if you have a Ph. D, for instance, in my hometown and have worked at the school long enough, you can make over 100,000/ year. I'm serious. That's not half bad.</p>
<p>Who do your parents thing are responsible for providing the biggest educational contribution needed for students to attend Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, MIT, etc. TEACHERS. It is an honorable profession and does not nearly get the credit that it deserves.</p>
<p>As a former HS and university teacher I can tell you that is certainly is a real job, and one I enjoyed very very much. BUT the pay is such that it is very difficult to live. My wife and I were both teaching, so two salaries made it a little better, but when she stopped when we had a kid, I had to move on to something that actually paid better. In areas where there are unions, the pay is better, but in our district most of the teachers cannot afford to live in the town where they teach. The starting pay around here is only around $33K. While that might sound like a low, but livable salary to a HS student, let me tell you: It isn't. That's why these teachers are painting houses during the summer or doing anything else they can to get extra money. It's sad, but true.</p>
<p>Hmm...that's true, and unfortunate. I am lucky enough to be wealthy in my life-I can afford going to graduate school, etc.</p>
<p>I don't understand how you can attend school for all of these years and yet buy people's erroneous belief that teaching is not a real job.
Do you think so little of the people who have worked hard to educate you that you would believe those kind of lies? How could you possibly believe that a job that holds one of the most important responsibilities in the world could be a waste of your mind?</p>
<p>I went to Harvard and I have classmates who are teachers. They are not looked down on by their classmates who are doctors and lawyers.</p>
<p>I personally don't know anyone who thinks that teachers should only attend public institutions. I also think that if a person is a good teacher and is also willing to move, they can find places where they can get good pay for their work. They won't make the kind of money that corporate lawyers and doctors make, but they still can live comfortably. The rewards of being able to touch young people's lives are immeasurable. </p>
<p>As Lee Iacococa said, "In a perfect world, the best of us would be teachers. The rest of us -- would have to settle for less."</p>
<p>That's a great quotation Northstarmom! I like it. I guess your Harvard classmates are more aware of great teaching? My parents are more practical.
** As an aside, I did not mean to sound pretentious or condescending. I did not mean to say that UConn is a bad school. I have nothing against UConn (well, I don't like its party/alcohol atmosphere, but that's another story). UConn simply doesn't have a department in the degree I'm seeking, so it wouldn't work out. **</p>
<p>i know in NYC certified teachers straight out of college earn $39,000 (their contract is currently in negotiation, union is looking to raise the starting salary to $45,00) but there are bumps in salary when you obtain your masters, master + 30 credit, tenure ets. If you teach summer school and after school programs your apy will increase. I think the current cap is about $80,000. Administrators (principals) can earn 6-figures. Some teachers also work as private tutors in different subject area. I have a friend who tutors math at $75/hr which is not an unusual rate.</p>
<p>Areas in Westchester county and Long island have higher starting salaries and it is not unsusual for tenured teachers to make close to 6 figures.</p>
<p>I had an instructor for a college history course (he wasn't a full professor) who seemed to have a chip on his shoulder about the low pay he received as an educator. He loved the work and that is the only reason why he stuck with the job and accepted the low pay. He had also done some high school teaching in the past. If I wanted to be a high school teacher I wouldn't go to an expensive college. It is an investment and since I am not rich it would not make any sense for me to build up a large debt only to get a job that wouldn't allow me to comfortably pay it off.</p>
<p>I'm an English teacher, and, of course, I don't see my chosen career as a "waste of my mind." In fact, I chose to teach precisely because the tasks involved--discussing the best that human beings have thought and written with a group of bright and open people, helping them become better readers, writers, and observers of their world (and helping myself do the same in the process)--seemed to be worthy of my time and intelligence. That may sound arrogant, but don't we all long for careers that draw on all our talents and allow us to live with a sense of meaning and purpose? Don't we all seek work that seems natural to us, that makes us feel like ourselves? I found that in teaching, and I've never regretted my choice. If you really feel that teaching is in your blood, you may find similar fulfillment as well. </p>
<p>In this flood of high-mindedness, I don't want to discount the worldly concerns of your parents. They're right to suggest that money matters, and while there are well-paying teaching positions to be had, you must go into any career with a clear sense of what to expect--both good and bad. If you do that, and you have a little bit of luck along the way, you will be one of the lucky ones, rich or not-so-rich, who get to spend their days doing something they feel is worthy of them.</p>
<p>If you love to teach, GO FOR IT!! because obviously the best teachers are the ones who love doing it. I think it is the "noblest" of professions, especially the good ones. </p>
<p>As far as stereotypes, I will admit there is a lot of room in the teaching profession for slackers. Because of the tenure system and the daily and annual calendar, if you want to arrive at 8am and leave at 3 pm and have summers off, there is unfortunately room for that kind of person. But if you are dedicated like many of our teachers, you arrive at 7 am to see students and give them extra help, and you stay late, and you work at home grading papers and preparing for the next day.... but you still get summers off!!! :D </p>
<p>I also think it is generally not appreciated that teaching young people is a real skill that is separate from knowledge of the subject matter. A good teacher with no knowledge of the subject could teach a class and learn with the students.</p>
<p>As a long-time HS math teacher, spoonyj has hit it dead on. The brightest minds I'm around are those of my fellow teachers and my students. It doesn't matter where they went to school - I work with the gamit from Ivy grads to those from state unis. Our campus resource officer (a city policeman) is a Stanford grad. Besides the comments of being a rewarding job, working with kids, etc., I have to add that it is an incredibly stimulating job. We all wish the $$ were better, but it is not the motivator to do what we do.</p>
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<p>If I wanted to be a high school teacher I wouldn't go to an expensive college. It is an investment and since I am not rich it would not make any sense for me to build up a large debt only to get a job that wouldn't allow me to comfortably pay it off.<</p>
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<p>This is the message that I as a parent would send my daughter or son, I would feel obligated to tell them that. Is teaching a worthwhile profession? - of course, we wouldn't have any other professions if we didn't have good teachers. Am I glad some teachers are educated at Harvard or Yale? - yes. But to tell a young person that going to a school where you emerge educated, but $100,000 in debt, and expect to pay it off on a high school teacher's salary with any kind of reasonable lifestyle - that would be irresponsible. Besides, coming out of say, Swarthmore, with a burning desire to change the world by teaching, you don't want to take that enthusiasm to Westchester where the kids have had every advantage - in the Mississippi delta you'll be lucky to start at $30000, and they will expect you to be getting a masters degree as well.</p>
<p>It is the coming out in debt part that makes it irresponsible. I wish it were different, but teaching high school as a career after a Harvard education is a luxury for those who aren't deep in debt.</p>
<p>Where I live (NJ) teachers with exp. can make 75, 80k. If a married couple has two teachers I think they are pretty well off.</p>
<p>I have to side with cangel. My mother, a special education teacher, and my father, make a combined 100,000, and paying for my education, as well as my 3 siblings is something constantly hanging over their heads. I can't even imagine the debt we would be in if they attended some ivy league school. And I live in a suburban area. Often the most experienced teachers get fired the quickest, because they have the highest pay. You have to decide if going to a really expensive school is worth being in debt for years- you're not going to be a doctor, a lawyer or an engineer. YOu're going to be a teacher.</p>
<p>cangel,</p>
<p>Your point is a good one, but the OP went out of his way to mention that he comes from a wealthy family, so that going into debt is not something he needs to consider. In light of the OP's background, the issue is not whether it's worth going into debt to be an educator, but whether it's worth pursuing the very best possible education if one's ultimate goal is to teach.</p>
<p>No teacher in my hometown would be making $100,000 a year, Ph.D. or otherwise.</p>
<p>But I've been thinking of teaching and I agree with you. I don't like that education has become a ticket to wealth rather than a tool for becoming a more complete person.</p>
<p>sybbie, those rates are not nationwide I can assure you. </p>
<p>I am a teacher, with an ivy education. I was born a teacher, tutored and taught all my life even while pursuing a different career....eventually I left a better paid profession to become a professional certified teacher because I believe public school education is essential to a democracy. I have taught in several different types of school districts. I love students and learning, but I would not suggest it as a career to anyone.</p>
<p>As low as it is, Teacher pay is not the biggest negative about becoming a teacher these days. Legislative and Administrative policies (national, state and local school board, down to the building principal) that dictate what words to use, what page to be on, where to stand...are unbelieveably stifflying to teachers. The best teachers today are the ones who have learned how to work around the scripted lesson plans and who partially shielded by tenure break the rules. New teachers have no tenure to protect them. </p>
<p>Teaching to a test is what the growing majority of school districts are insisting on and a new non-tenured teacher is forced to read these scripts, stay on the mandated task. "Open Court" for reading and "Saxon" for math are two examples of these scripted teaching strategies.</p>
<p>The longer these programs are in place, the smaller the population of skilled experienced teachers who know the joy of creative lesson planning and the value ad-libbing a lesson to take advantage of a learning moment.</p>
<p>As for respect, my former career used to get me invitations to museum openings and new zoo exhibits. I don't know many teachers who get invitations to anything unless there is a potential field trip tied to it. On the other hand, there are other people who seem very respectul although sometimes I sense it's blended with pity.</p>
<p>Outside of rural America, there are declining locations where a teacher can afford to buy a house. California has an average house price that exceeds the teachers salary ten fold. How a public school teacher can afford to live in San-Francisco is beyond me.</p>
<p>I have taken one summer off in the past ten years, otherwise I teach summer school, take classes and the other things that most teachers do.</p>
<p>No Child Left Behind and it's Lake Wobegon Philosophy that all children are above average is a disaster for education. If cooks were treated like teachers, all meals in resturants would be microwaved pre packaged with the same meal served in all the resturants in town each day. New cooks could be fired or not rehired if they were caught adding spice or garnish to a meal.</p>
<p>Thanks for letting me vent. By the way, the kids are great, and if you become a teacher search out an administrator that is willing to take some flack in order to let you do your job.</p>
<p>If you want to go into education you should, there are ways to pay for your college even if you don't stay in education, teach for america gives volunteers money for college loans after working in urban /low income areas, you don't need to be an education major.
While I think that it is worth it to get the best education you can no matter what field, I also acknowledge that many teachers at least in our area, attended public colleges and I don't see them getting paid less than teachers who attended private colleges.I also do not see teachers getting fired when they have experience because they cost the school more. The teachers union is one of the most powerful in the country, and what I see in our district are teachers who are burnt out but still teaching and new teachers being let go because they don't have enough tenure.
My daughter is seriously thinking about teaching science to middle/high school students but I am advising her to consider private education after my experiences with a large urban district. Public schools may pay more, but you have less autonomy and less control over curriculum.</p>
<p>lionswim,</p>
<p>My in-laws have lived in Lawrence for nearly forty years, and I spend several weeks there each summer. In fact, there are many faculty membersat KU--full professors, not just administrators--who make six figures or very close to it. As for high school teachers, the average pay in Lawrence is around 40-45K. A couple who both teach could very comfortably in Lawrence, even with home prices skyrocketing. In fact, for what it's worth, what I consider the nicest home in Old West Lawrence (no, not the one with the dopey purple conservatory) is owned by two P.E. teachers. Go figure.</p>
<p>Remember that the $50 K is only for part of year, many teachers that I know in the public( & private) school system either teach summers & or travel ( some teach and travel at same time!). They also have pretty flexible schedule, many holidays and breaks, and get to do fun things like go to Hawaii and NYC/DC. ( in public school- When my daughter was in 8th grade she went to Maui with a high school biology class, also in 8th grade was a dc/nyc trip to do the expected rounds. While the kids did a lot of fundraising,the teachers not only recieved their pay from the school, but the kids & parents subsidized their trip)</p>