I’ve noticed that most students are given the choice between, say, regular Biology, Honors Bio, or AP Bio. Same goes with World History, etc. I’ve also noticed that some people can go directly from pre-calc into Calculus BC. My daughter’s school handles things differently. Honors World History is a prerequisite for AP World, as Bio (or Honors Bio) is a prerequisite for AP Bio. Calc AB is a prereq for BC, and so on. There are a handful of AP classes that don’t have a prerequisite of having already taken a version of the class before (APUSH, APES - though that requires Bio, Psych, Microeconomics come to mind) but a good portion of them work the way AP World and AP Bio do.
When colleges review transcripts, how is that system communicated? I wouldn’t want them to think that she was taking the easy path by taking AP classes that she already had taken the general or honors version of already. It’s literally required that she do so. Is that something the counselor should explain?
Good to know. I was reading some posts about how people were able to squeeze in all of these AP classes, and I was wondering how - and then I realized that not every school does it the way my daughter’s does. She hasn’t 100% maxed out the rigor of her schedule, but in general, she’s usually opted for the most challenging option. I just wouldn’t want it to look like she was trying to play things super safe.
If the guidance counselor checks the box on his/her college recommendation saying your D has taken the most rigorous course-load available at the HS then there will be no question that is the case. Your D can ask if her schedule is sufficient for him/her to check that box when the time comes.
Along with the transcript your HS will send a school profile that gives admissions officers information about the school, courses offered etc.
At my daughter’s school (middle of the road high school), some AP courses have a pre-req and others don’t. Bio, chem and physics all require an initial year-long course of either regular or honors in the same subject. She doubled up on bio and chem freshman year, took physics sophomore year and then AP Physics junior year - and planning on AP Chem senior year. History courses do not have an same subject prerequisite, nor do Psychology or econ or the computer science courses.
Calc BC requires recommendation from the pre-calc teacher. It does seem odd that your daughter’s school requires Calc AB as a pre-req for BC since BC is roughly equivalent to a 1st semester AND 2nd semester of college calculus whereas AB is equivalent to one semester of college calc. The AP Calc BC test includes an AB sub score.
I would hope the high school profile that the colleges get shows what AP courses are available and if there are constraints (some schools only allow juniors and seniors to take AP courses or limit the number in certain grades, etc.).
Schools will only compare her AP classes with others at her school. Some schools offer 20+ AP courses, but some only offer a few. I went to one school that had 0, and even now only has about 6. It is one of the top high schools in that state but if students needs an advanced class, they take them at university only a 1/2 mile away. I transferred to another school in another state and it had 10-15 APs and now offers over 20. Two different ways of setting up the curriculum.
I’m not a big AP fan. I don’t think the material is ‘just like college.’ If 25% of a high school class needs that advanced level of instruction, shouldn’t the school just teach at a higher level?
If it’s a checkbox, then she won’t be able to check it. There are a few places where my daughter took the less rigorous path:
After Honors Algebra II, she could have gone Math Analysis --> AP Calc AB --> AP Calc BC, but instead did Algebra III --> Foundations of Calculus --> AP Calc AB
She took AP Japanese as a freshman (since she'd been studying it at a language school since Kindergarten) so had an extra period in her schedule Sophomore, Junior, and Senior years. She could have added one of the harder AP classes, like AP Chem or AP Physics, but she took interesting (but not as difficult) 1-semester electives, including Forensic Science, Personal Finance, Digital Graphics, and AP Microeconomics (so far for jr. and sr. year). Next year she'll be using those periods to take International Relations and Biotech, I believe.
For science, after she finished Honors Chemistry + Physics (1 semester each, but 1 year's worth of content) and Honors Bio, she was qualified to take the AP version of those classes, but junior year she took AP Environmental Science which is considered to be less challenging. Next year she'll be taking AP Psych - again, less challenging than AP Chem, Physics, or Bio.
This year she took regular US History instead of APUSH.
Other than that, I think she maxed out the rigor. Just as an exercise, her younger sister and I went through the catalog and came up with a 4-year schedule that completely maxed out the rigor and also met the other graduation requirements. I think it would have been possible for her to squeeze in something like 16 AP classes if you really tried to cram everything in there. My daughter will have completed 9.
I believe that’s just a 1-sheet, correct? If so, I think they post that on the school’s website. I’ve seen it, and it doesn’t describe how Honors Bio is a prereq for AP Bio, etc. It just says that it offers AP Bio - so I’m concerned that that begs the question of why she took Honors Bio instead.
Yes, that’s the case at my daughter’s school as well. AP Micro didn’t have a prereq, nor does AP Psych. (But maybe it required Bio?) APUSH is the same, but AP World I believe does require Honors World first.
Yeah, dunno… Other high schools in the area seem to handle it the same way. I always thought BC was like Calc II, so it seemed natural that AB was the prereq. Only by reading some forums did I realize that some people just jump right into BC after precalc.
I would hope that too, and maybe there’s a more detailed explanation somewhere, but on the 1-sheet on the school’s website, it doesn’t seem to show that information anywhere…
Everyone says that colleges will compare you and view you in the same context as other applicants from your school. That’s all fine, if you typically have more than 1 applicant most years. Many colleges my daughter was interested in don’t even get that most years from our high school.
Some high schools use AP simply as another level of HS difficulty – so the course levels would be regular, honors, and AP (with no prereq).
Other high schools use AP as a true college course, which would of course mean that the student would have to complete the “high school course” before taking the “college course.”
And remember, your GC will send a “school profile” that will outline what classes are offered etc.
I honestly think it better overall for your DD to take interesting classes like Forensic Science, Personal Finance, Digital Graphics, and AP Microeconomics instead of just filling with APs.
Even Stanford says:
“We expect applicants to pursue a reasonably challenging curriculum, choosing courses from among the most demanding courses available at your school. We ask you to exercise good judgment and to consult with your counselor, teachers and parents as you construct a curriculum that is right for you. Our hope is that your curriculum will inspire you to develop your intellectual passions, not suffer from unnecessary stress. The students who thrive at Stanford are those who are genuinely excited about learning, not necessarily those who take every single AP or IB, Honors or Accelerated class just because it has that designation.”
And keep in mind:
Find a college that fits your kid…don’t try to fit your kid to a college.
There are 3000 colleges in the USA…there will be a good one for your DD.
Yes, she definitely wants to find a college that fits her. I was just getting worried that those colleges will think she was taking the easy way out when she wasn’t. Right now she’s looking at LACs. Wesleyan, Bowdoin, and Scripps are among the top of her list.
Honestly I think this is much ado about nothing. As I noted above, the way things are done at this HS is not at all unusual. In addition:
– If the guidance counselor checks off the box saying your D has taken the most rigorous curriculum available at the HS then there will be zero issue (as I noted earlier). Do you expect that your D’s schedule will fall into the “most rigorous” category? If so, stop worrying – a student can’t take anything more challenging than the most rigorous schedule offered by your HS.
– If students from your HS regularly get into top tier colleges, it is safe to assume admission officers are familiar with the protocol at your HS. As noted elsewhere, it is not at all unusual.
–IF the colleges your D is interested in do not take student from your HS regularly AND IF your D hasn’t taken the most rigorous curriculum at the high school AND IF is not clear in the class profile THEN you can ask the guidance counselor if he/she would note which APs have prerequisites in his/her letter of recommendation.
I wrote above about the areas where she technically could have taken a harder schedule. I guess it depends on how broad the “most rigorous” category is. This is the first I’ve ever heard that such a checkbox exists, so I’m not sure what the standards are.
Fair point. Every year several kids get into the ivies, so I suppose they know what they’re doing.
This is a good suggestion. She is planning on applying primarily to east coast LACs, and not many people from her school go to those. Still, it sounds like this is a non-issue so I won’t worry about it much.
My school is a little bit of a mix. Standard or honors level courses are necessary for AP Sciences, Languages, ELAs, and Music Theory, but not history or math. We’ve had decent success with it.
I have never heard of a high school that didn’t have prerequisites for AP calculus or an AP foreign language. Social sciences and the Sciences tend to be where some schools have prereqs and some don’t.
