My understanding from coming from a family of all lawyers is that you should go to the most highly rated law school you can get into-without consideration of other aspects of the school. And that the LSATS and GPA determine what that will be. The difference between going to to a highly ranked law school and some other law school is marked. Unlike with college, the rank of the law school really does matter forever after. If a student attends a top school, they will do well regardless of where in the class rankings the student ends up falling-top of class or middle (not sure about very bottom). True a student who goes to a mediocre law school can do well-if they are ranked #1 or #2 in their class but it falls off quickly after that. For law school, loans make more sense than they do for college because those graduating from top ranked law schools make very good salaries-and can pay loans off quickly.
My understanding differs a bit. Almost always accept if offered a position in a top 3 law school. But a significant scholarship to a top 6 is worth considering vs. a top 3. A full scholarship to a top 14 is worth considering over a top 6.
If you do not want to pursue Big Law, then take a full tuition scholarship at a regional law school in the area of the country in which you want to practice law.
Depending upon one’s definition of what constitutes a “mediocre” law school, finishing in the top 5% should yield a decent position. Finishing in the top 20% can also yield some good offers, But, once outside the top 14 law schools, it varies by school.
Of the 203 ABA accredited law schools, the 48 or so tier 4 law schools should be avoided unless on a full scholarship with assured employment after law school with a family firm.
Of the tier 2 & tier 3 law schools, varies by jurisdiction & career goals & whether or not one is offered a full tuition scholarship.
In short, it depends.
P.S. To a certain extent, one’s law school will matter beyond 5 or 6 years later, but the significance diminishes greatly with time. Accomplishments & portable business matters much more than which law school one attended.
http://schools.lawschoolnumbers.com/ may help you with law school admission.
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/ may help you with employment outcomes out of various law schools.
An extraordinarily high percentage of the young lawyers in big law are miserable. If he hasn’t a clue as to what the work there is like, the K-JD route is a very risky.
@roycroftmom: Why is K-JD “very risky” ?
Many, maybe most, young lawyers in Big Law take those positions in order to quickly pay off Big Debt. Of course they are miserable due to the work demands and pressure & lack of control. But an older, more experienced person might be less likely to be willing to endure Big Law for 5 years in order to be debt free & experienced in a field of law.
Non-law related work experience rarely teaches one about law school & the practice of law so delaying law school offers little to no advantages & may increase one’s family responsibilities that make attending law school an unrealistic option.
No doubt, but until you have “billed” 2,000 hours, you have no idea of the extremely low quality of life of BL. Doesn’t matter if you are 25 or 35, the quality of life still sux. There are few industries that have the work/time requirements of Big Law. Big Consulting? IB?
OTOH, if you are suggesting that college grads go to work first in the hopes that they might find something they like and eschew law school, then I’m in perfect agreement.
Within the past few days, I read an article in a weekly law publication that the lawyers who would be receiving the largest year end bonuses at a NYC based Big Law firm were those who billed 2700 hundred hours or more during the last year. I hope that this was a misprint because while 2200 hours is not unusual, 2700 hours is either the ultimate in dedication or borderline fraud or an example of one who has mastered the art of double & triple billing multiple clients for the same work.
^^It’s entirely possible, publisher. My Son is in NYC Big Law and he has been working 7-days a week for the past 6 months, primarily for one client – a regulatory/fine thingy. Had his holiday plans cancelled while he was en route to the airport. Put in 3 hours of essentially doc review on Christmas Day. He’s as straight an arrow as they come, so he wouldn’t even think to bill aggressively. He’s at a lock-step firm, so all bonuses were the same.
Bidness is booming in NYC. Like I posted earlier, kids have no idea on the quality of life. (I did Big Consulting in a former life, so I tried to warn him, but until you’ve lived it day after day after day…)
Yes, I billed 2700 hours my last year in big law. It wasn’t by any means unusual. Most of my colleagues were K-JD who hadn’t really thought much about the work world before hand. If they had taken time off, I think far fewer would have gone to law school, and they likely would have been happier.
@roycroftmom wrote “If they had taken time off, I think far fewer would have gone to law school…”.
For one intending to practice law in the private sector, time off after graduation from college is best used in a one year effort to increase one’s LSAT score & to apply to law schools with that improved score.
I disagree, Publisher. That time might be better spent learning about the world and many different career options, and carefully reassessing whether law school is really the right fit. Some of the happiest people I know threw out their perfect LSAT scores and continued on to remarkable non-legal careers. Look before you leap into law school.
Non-law related work experience doesn’t teach someone much about law, but it teaches a lot about working. It also provides employers with some metric that the person in front of them understands how to behave in an office setting. When I am recruiting, prior work experience is a big plus.
@Demosthenes49 : Wrote something that is worth repeating: “Non-law related work experience doesn’t teach someone much about law…”.
Recruiting practices & priorities vary by type of law firm. For the most part, one’s law school & first year class rank and whether or not law review will determine who gets interviewed. Time spent improving one’s LSAT score before applying to law school can have a significant effect on one’s life with respect to career opportunities & avoidance of crippling debt.
P.S. Even law related work teaches one little to nothing about law school. And, often, little about the practice of law.
The major benefit of working between undergraduate school & law school is to enable one to mature if needed. In short, it depends upon the person.
Some BigLaw firms care about 1L grades and only 1L grades. That works for them because a 50% attrition rate gets rid of all the first years that can’t work in an office, and the firms get the benefit of the billable hours until those associates burn out. They don’t care about prior work experience, that’s true. But prior work experience would tell the student a lot about the firm. There are also plenty of firms that do care about work experience, like mine. It’s silly to throw that advantage away (and pay down some law school tuition) if a student doesn’t have to.
I have a good friend who went to a T6 law school (i.e. Columbia, Chicago, NYU) half a lifetime ago. He followed the traditional path and went to work for a white shoe firm in Manhattan after graduation. Five years later, he quit the law entirely, got his MBA, and went to work in finance, where he remains to this day. I remember asking him at the time why he was giving up the law. His answer: “I don’t want my 30’s to be like my 20’s.” I always think of that when I pick up the NY Law Journal and see a headline about the starting associate pay at Skadden or Cravath.
@Demosthenes49 : Not sure I understand your last post.
BigLaw recruits new hire associates mostly from their summer intern pool. Work experience as a BigLaw intern is very valuable, but that comes after one has completed one’s second year of law school–not between undergraduate & law school.
If I may ask, as a hiring partner are you in BigLaw ?
@TheBigChef: A regret that I have is that I did not explain the difference to my son between law school & pursuing an MBA, and the different type of personalities best suited for each type of professional school & profession.
New associates usually come from summer associates, that’s correct. Who gets to be the summer associate is the big question. One of the factors many firms look at is work experience. I am not the hiring partner in my office, though I am involved in recruiting.
But are you in BigLaw ?
I ask because BigLaw wants grades & pedigree. This work experience line seems a bit misleading if referring to BigLaw.
P.S. Work experience as a clerk for a Federal Judge is valued by BigLaw, but that comes after one has completed law school.
Yes, I am in BigLaw.