<p>I have friends, both undergrad and PhD grads of a certain Ivy, one of whom teaches at said Ivy, whose husband is having a book published by the academic press of said Ivy, whose son, A student with scores in the low to mid 700's, athlete and musician was deferred on ED. Shocker.</p>
<p>My S ran out of space listing all the Penn alumni, but didn't get in. We figured it was 'cuz he applied last minute, never got/inquired about an interview, etc. I might haqve been upset if he applied as a senior and followed thru.</p>
<p>What I mean is that since most of the heavy drinkers in my circle of friends are legacies, the money their parents give them would be going towards purchasing alcohol. </p>
<h2>My post is in response to:</h2>
<p>lkf725 </p>
<p>I look at it this way: now I have to fork over big bucks for tuition while my taxes and previous donations are supporting alcohol abusers and international students. My pockets are only so deep.</p>
<hr>
<p>Wow Allmusic, That's amazing!!! I sure wouldn't take it well if I were his parent. Don't see how the college could justify refusing that kid.</p>
<p>Last year my son was 'deferred' and then accepted to a school where he was a legacyX1 and wait listed at a school where he would have been a 3rd generation legacyX5. The former is a school known to like legacies in the ED round, the latter a school which reports it gives no preference to legacies. So be it. </p>
<p>When the alumni fund pledge card came for the 2nd school I sent a minimal amount, enough to keep me on lists, getting the magazine. I attached a note saying I would have been happpy to have sent $40,000 more, but that the school had decided otherwise! I know full well that the tuition costs evidently only cover a portion of the cost of the education...it was just the reality at the time...</p>
<p>Did my not sending real money constitute a change in my feelings about the worthiness of the school as a recipient of our hard earned, and not unlimited, funds? No, it represented a reality that paying full fare for 2 kids in private colleges is a sock to the pocket book...A long time ago I saw a bumper sticker saying "My kid and my money go to>>>>" That's the reality of our life as well.</p>
<p>I probably wont get into Umich this year because I applied really late and im OOS. My parents had a 3.8 and 4.0 at Umich respectively and both got MBA's. However, they havent donated much. </p>
<p>Ive gotten in everywhere else, but because of rolling i probably wont get into umich. Too expensive anyway.</p>
<p>Been a few years but my oldest applied to 10 schools and received just one rejection from----you guessed it---- Penn (ED) where he was a legacy. In hindsight his gpa was a bit low for the present day Penn but he was loaded with AP's, had test scores above Penn's average, and leadership EC's. In my opinion it's a bad PR move to outright reject an ED legacy kid....I don't consider myself a particularly sensitive person, but I couldn't help feeling insulted(?) is that the right word, although son bounced back quickly and life went on. Although a polite deferral (if rejection were definite later on) might have confused son's future plans, my opinion is the deferral is much more palatable (at least to the alumnus!). Also ED rejection from legacy school makes you think you've just blown the whole college selection process (you aimed too high)...and there isn't enough time to make adjustments since it's the middle of December.</p>
<p>All of course turns out for the best, he ended up at a school ranked much higher for computer science, loved it, etc etc, has the "perfect" job for him at a top NYC investment bank... there was a thread about this a few months ago. STILL, I have great respect for Penn but I can't contribute to them, just the minimum to keep the Gazette subscription, and you might not understand that childish reaction unless it happened to your kid.</p>
<p>Two years ago, my son was a legacy reject from Cornell, ED. (Cornell was my alma mater.) Not deferred, not even good enough for a waitlist. Just take-a-hike-mike. </p>
<p>Was it a reach? He was admitted everywhere else: Northwestern, VA Tech, and UVa (where he now attends and is doing well). If anything, it seems that being a legacy cost him rather than helped.</p>
<p>So, I've had two years of fundraising calls (and one Cornell reunion) under my belt. Will they get any more money from me? Not one red cent. I almost wish I could win the lottery so I could donate a big wad of cash to UVa (with a c.c. to Cornell).</p>
<p>And, yes, yes, let me anticipate the responses: Cornell: $40K/yr, UVa: $13K/yr (instate). He's among his 'peers', and not overwhelmed by overachievers. Better weather. Still, the Redbeard family wallet will remain forever closed to the gnomes of Ithaca.</p>
<p>redbeard, as glad as I am to hear that you'd like to donate to UVA (my future alma mater), I think it's unfortunate that you wouldn't donate to your own because they dinged your son.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I don't like how some of you seem to speak of donating to your alma maters, but once your precious "D's" or "S's" get rejected, your wallets close tight. Seems kind of irrational to me.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>think of it as how happy alumni are with a school.</p>
<p>or, if the parents want to donate money to where their child goes, that is understandable, no? Not everyone can double their donations when there are two schools in the picture.</p>
<p>I would also like to add that UVA has a special legacy rejection letter, which encourages you to apply to transfer in.</p>
<p>I think parents are more annoyed at the flood of fundraising calls they get from the schools. Rejecting their kids and asking for money to boot is a no no.</p>
<p>I guess I'll just have to see how I feel when I get there. I'm hoping my children succeed where I failed, though, and do a bit better than UVA (ie, getting into Princeton.)</p>
<p>I apologize...I do not mean to offend any international students qs3kbenzene. Certainly I did not mean to group international students together with alcohlol abusers. Private colleges can and do give aid to whomever they see fit: athletes, legacies, academic superstars, women, urms, internationals, students with special talents, etc. One mission of state colleges, however, is to offer reasonable priced education to their own state residents. Most state schools offer lower tuition rates and more scholarship money to instate applicants. I was just a little miffed that my own state school gave more financial aid to equally or less qualified non-residents. </p>
<p>Again, I am very sorry for the unintended offense.</p>
<p>I understand, :). I also overreacted. </p>
<p>Reading all of these, seeing how much time and effort parents spend on their children's futures, is pretty amazing. </p>
<p>I'm a college senior and while I would never say this to my parents, I have always appreciated everything they've done for me and know that their suggestions and advice (how ever different from mine) come with the purest of intentions. No matter what I do, even if I end up in jail, I know they'll be there for me to depend on. </p>
<p>On some level or other, I'm sure your Ss/Ds would agree with me.</p>
<p>I am speaking broadly here, not about any individual: There also needs to be equity in the process, and a situtation in which those not as privileged are given a chance, too: where things are mixed around, a bit. That is the situation today, and it is all to the good. That is what a vital society and a vital institution strives for. If every one of these schools accepted every single legacy, it would be the reinforcement of a rigid class system: After a few generations, ONLY legacies would be accepted (do the math) and then the schools themselves would lose their diversity and vigor. I understand how each person, individually, feels --but it is not possible for these schools to accept more legacies than they do and sustain their strengths and nurture new ones over the generations.</p>
<p>The thing about the fundraising calls is that they inadvertently rub salt in the wound. The caller goes on about what your contributions have meant in the past, and what they would enable current students (not your child) to avail themselves of. So while you might have been a reasonable person reaching over to the receiver to answer the call, the words of the caller have a way of drilling themselves into the most primitive part of the human brain (the one where resentment and immaturity live). </p>
<p>I'm sure they don't have a dossier on every person they call so there's no way they would know your child was rejected, but they should know if the 'mark' might have kids of college age, and maybe they shouldn't bring up the advantages to current students but appeal to your sense of nostalgia or gratitude (that you've found a job that enables you to pay another institution's tuition).</p>
<p>It's just a practical matter for me. If my child is receiving need based financial aid, I'm willing to send $20 to the three colleges our family has attended (and even to the one we're currently paying tuition at) as a token of support. I don't know that we'll ever donate as generously as we did when our kids were little - by the time we finish educating them we'll be retired. Our kids can then donate to the colleges that changed their lives and the circle of alumni relations is complete.</p>
<p>I've often wondered just how much these schools care about the "smaller" donations from alumni. I have to believe that with enrollment management consultants, ratings dependent on % alumni donating etc. that they have all this down to a science. </p>
<p>My guess is that just like some schools pick and choose the students to whom they will award merit scholarships, it is the same for legacy. They know they can't make everyone happy, so they focus their efforts on some (big developmental admits, legacies from certain geographical areas, etc.) Certain schools do seem to suffer the most bashing for their treatment of legacies, despite the fact that ,as a group, the numbers show they are treated more than fairly. I do agree, that it would be much nicer from the alumni POV to receive that deferral or a letter softening the blow. The fact that they don't can also mean that they don't have to.</p>
<p>My college sent a very nice letter when D applied setting expectations and explaining the process. It appears this went to all alum who had children applying for the class of 2010. After reading it I felt D would be treated fairly, but given how highly competitive it is, she is unlikely to get in. She has set her expectations accordingly, as have I (not to say we both won't be disappointed but we know it is truly a reach). I am very active in alumni activities in a few capacities. I would be surprised if the person reading her app knows a thing other than she is a legacy.</p>
<p>I have also read a short study on the net which stated that those legacies who do not request fin aid have a higher acceptance rate than those who do request fin aid. This was specifically in connection with Brown. What I'm not sure of was how recent this study was. Brown changed to need blind status only a few years ago, and this could have been from that earlier period. I also don't know how they got their data. </p>
<p>Has anyone else seen/experienced anything like that?</p>
<p>You might be right about the financial aid thing...my son did need financial aid, and who knows if need blind behind closed doors really is need blind...I'd like to hope so.</p>
<p>redbeard verbalized the problem I have with my son's ED legacy rejection from Penn....for the most part these aren't a bunch of losers! His son was good enough to make it into Northwestern and UVA but couldn't muster a deferral from Cornell even as an ED legacy? Mine also received just one rejection out of 10, but still was welcomed by Johns Hopkins, Carnegie Mellon (computer science, where he went)....he's no slouch. I understand they aren't as selective as Penn, but they're still among the best. Make no mistake an eventual deferral, then rejection, would have been far more acceptable (to me). Just involves a little more paperwork on the school's part. I would think it would be worth that minimal effort to keep an alumnus happy...it's just good business.</p>