<p>Assume that there are 25 merit scholarships available to the (non-restricted) applicant pool. (Angier and Robertson). </p>
<p>That would be 25 out of 18,062 total applicants. The chance of getting one then becomes 0.01 %. I think this is an important consideration. How the heck do they determine who the top 0.01% applicants are?</p>
<p>Potential applicants really need to be aware of the true availability of merit money at the schools that they are interested in.</p>
<p>Wow I found this thread a personal eye opener. Thanks for sharing your invaluable experience through this thread. As my kid approach to senior in 2006 fall, I would like to know few things. My son attends an elite prep school on full financial aid. We were thinking that we might get similar aid in colleges. But, we may have to look for more colleges. We are Asian family with middle class background. Our kid is interested in pursuing economics and international relations. The kid is among top 10% at school, and have taken the hardest possible course load. His SAT is outstanding. Some parents suggested us to use the Princeton calculator. We did use it and our self-help came say maybe around $6000. When I compare his grades, stats and ECs with other Kids, I think he is in very good shape. But what makes me nervous that he may have done better than others but at the time of college admission, he may be a kid who is looking for financial aid versus kids who are a little below him in academic and ECs but do not need any financial aid. </p>
<p>Believe me I can see that college may owe us nothing and we have to apply colleges which offer him challenge but offer him $$$$ to attend the school? Any suggestions how should we approach it. This is our first kid who will be going to college in America. Kid has two national level awards, which make him outsating, but I am not sure if that helps him with fin aid situation. My Kid is a US citizen so we may get loan.</p>
<p>I welcome all positive ideas parents can provide so we may not be in same pitfalls as other parents are. Suddenly college like Vanderbilt, Miami, Emory, Tulane, Washington U, Rice and Duke, Grinnell, Wake Forest, and Davidson looks good to us.</p>
<p>yes but those 2 scholarships do not penalize in state applicant.....actually at Duke carolina residents have preferece for some of those (and I think # of scholarships for them is larger than out-of-state). The point being that at places like Rice or CMU 'locals' are penalized.</p>
<p>Parentny, I don't think needing financial aid is going to be an issue for admissions since most of the schools you are considering are need blind. Merit aid is a whole different story. If you decide to aggresively seek scholarships, that is something you and S need to research when you pick your schools. I would recommend having a little of several types of schools for choices, so that there are many options.</p>
<p>My advice is to look for colleges where Asian students are not very well represented. I think that they may be underrepresented at some midwestern colleges and possibly some southern colleges. While places like Harvard are 30% Asian because of floods of Asian applicants, that's not the same in some other parts of the country.</p>
<p>I believe that at U Wisconsin, a top 35 rated university, Asians are underrepresented and could be considered for some generous merit aid related to diversity (and of course would be considered for other aid).</p>
<p>I notice that Asians can apply for Grinnells' free summer science honor program that is only open to students of color. That tells me that Grinnell is trying hard to attract Asian applicants.</p>
<p>My impression (do check this out with the stats) is that Asians may be underrepresented at places like Davidson, Wake Forest, Vandy and Tulane. All of these universities also offer nice merit aid.</p>
<p>When I say "underrepresented," it's possible that 2-3% of the student bodies at such colleges is Asian, but that's a low percentage considering the large numbers of Asian students applying to colleges.</p>
<p>Rhodes in Memphis is another solid liberal arts college to consider. It also has some fabulous merit aid.</p>
<p>A person making $100K a year should have made some arrangements for funding college--perhaps to the tune of $15K per year. He should be able to pay $15K a year out of income and then split the difference with the kid--a loan for $5K and the kid works and makes $5k.</p>
<p>yea but its really hard to cover the other 10000 and also how can one earn to the tune of 5000 in your first year of college? Sorry but i am curently in that situation.</p>
<p>You work. You work weekends and spring break. You work double shifts in the summer--80 -90 hours of work. No trips, vacations, rest, etc. You use your brains to find lucrative work like tutoring, elderly care, child care that isn't so hard. You do back breaking dirty work like dishwasher, bus boy. Plus you should have some money in the bank--you did know you were going to college, didn't you? You should have something savied if only $1000 or so. Graduation gifts--ask for cash for college. If you can't make $5K, borrow the the gap, work during the school year. When you figure it out and are in the rhythm of always looking for job opportunities, you will be able to make the money. And I did not say it was easy. The more you have saved, the easier it is.</p>
<p>My d got 1/3 merit at u miami and 1/2 at Rhodes. We were surprised, knew she was a strong candidate, but never expected any aid. The great thing is that consideration for merit is automatic with the application. She was accepted to Wake Forest, but we had never bothered to fill out the merit aid forms. Didn't even bother with Fafsa after doing the quick calculation. We always figured we would just work it out when the time came. Of course now it's hard to think of paying full freight for Wake when we have other good options. The key is to convince d, who started with an impression that we would manage to send her to her top choice. (Waitlisted at Vandy--doubtful she would get any aid even if she ever got off the waiting list.) Wouldn't you know she's leaning toward the school for full price? I know Rhodes isn't as well known (specially in the midatlantic states) but is it really worth 14,000 more?</p>
<p>rikki55.......if your daughter is considering UMiami, you need to fill out that FAFSA ASAP! Miami requires the FAFSA be completed to actually receive that 1/3 scholarship. I would have your daughter look on the EASY system under the financial section there will be a needed information section. It will probably say "FAFSA for 2005-2006 needed." Until they receive it, you won't receive any funds credited to your students account should she choose to go there.</p>
<p>If your daughter is not insanely happy at the state school, you may want to consider Northstarmom's suggestions as transfer possibilities.</p>
<p>But, being the go-getter you describe, she'll probably <em>love</em> the state school. Put 200% into anything and you will very likely love it. Your daughter's type is university-proof, class-size proof, peer-proof. She's the type who can thrive anywhere. That is something really special that no "name" school can outweigh, and you gave her THAT!!</p>
<p>rikki.....your so welcome. Any other info about UMiami you might need just give me a shout.....my s is a student there. So we've dealt with it all.</p>
<p>Now...back to your regularly scheduled thread........:)</p>
<p>My daughter applied to every scholorship that was available - over 30 applications - the end result was a single $500 scholarship. Also we dont qualify for any financial aid. Total cost for us to instate UCSD is $19K per year but that would be about 37K for out of state applicants. So I dont think that all this money is growing on trees waiting for plucking as some would suggest in this thread. The problem is real.</p>
<p>The working during college is ok so long as the student can handle the load - UCSD discourage working over 15 hours per week since at that point it starts to affect college work. It would be easy to make 3K per year but end up graduating in 5 years instead of 4 resulting in a net loss. So my advice is to be really careful about working during college. At UCSD the average freshman had a GPA over 4 in HS so it is really competitive and the workload is very high. Adding a job could be the straw that breaks the camels back. The deal I have with my D is no working unless your GPA is over 3 and you have a full courseload and no working over 15 hours pw.</p>
<p>I find the views on this board a little extreme - anyone who is reluctant to go into financial ruin is considered too mean. I would assume all of these people who advocate huge parent loans etc have 18 times their gross salary already saved up for their retirement. Any financial planner will tell you that it is foolish to spend money on kids college tuition at the expense of your own retirement plans. If you dont have enough money saved, you are putting your retirement financial welfare on the backs of your kids - a burden worse than college loans. Spending everything youve got on their education is not doing them any favors.</p>
<p>I would also caution against taking huge loans in college unless your doing something like medicine or law where the undergrad college makes a big difference. For many if not most careers, it is not worth it financially to go to the big ivy. Sure it is nice, but 5 years after graduation for many degrees, where you went to school is irrelevant - this is especially true in sciences and engineering. In those professions there is no pattern between salaries and where people got their undergrad degree. Graduating with 100K in debt is going to make it hard to buy your first home, start saving for retirement have a family etc when you also have those loan repayments. And with those types of things it, there are big advantages in starting as early as you can. So I would encourage people to look at the big picture before spending the farm.</p>
<p>timcob,
A very reasonable post. Although I have learned ALOT from more experienced and knowledgable parents on this board, I'm also sometimes sorry I found it. I agree with you that some of the opinions expressed are a little extreme and tend to encourage maximum spending for the "best" college your kid can get into. It makes me feel guilty for being moderate in terms of finances. But there seems to be alot of parents paying for private high school here too, so maybe that's why. It wouldn't be a stretch to move that high school tuition over to college tuition.</p>
<p>We have examples of both extremes in retired grandparents in our family...one side comfortably well off, and the other side wondering who to pay this month. I would never want to burden my kids by being in the latter situation, nor would I want my kids to be making a college loan payment equal to a mortgage payment. I just hope that we come to a reasonable and happy decision for all this month!</p>
<p>I think many middle class families go into the college thing totally unrealistic. Somehow a notion is out there that there will be money in financial aid for everyone. People don't seem to see private colleges as businesses and education as a comodity we can or can not afford like everything else.</p>
<p>But the problem I see is that by having mostly the poor who can get aid and the rich who can afford it at many top colleges, we are limiting the mobility of middle class kids. By keeping them in State we are limiting their golbal exposure and future connections. I think years from now we'll see what we've done to this generation which is make class dinstinctions more pronounced.</p>
<p>But the problem I see is that by having mostly the poor who can get aid"</p>
<p>The poor in general are not getting that much aid. Relatively few colleges guarantee to give students 100% of their documented financial need.</p>
<p>There are, I think, only 14 colleges in the country that have need blind admissions and guarantee to meet 100% of documented financial need. Most of those are colleges like HPYS that most poor students have no chance of getting accepted to particulary because most poor students go to inadequate schools that don't prepare them well for any college.</p>
<p>When it comes to aid packages, most aid packages contain loans, which are much harder for poor students to pay back than middle class students. Students who are poor may have to help support their parents. It's not likely that their parents can give them the help that middle class offspring expect -- help setting up an apartment after college, buying a car, getting a computer, getting business clothes, etc.</p>
<p>Increasing numbers of colleges are giving merit aid to attract students that will raise their stats. Much of that merit aid goes to middle and upper class students, not poor students who aren't likely to have the very high SAT scores that qualify students for merit aid.</p>
<p>Fla. guarantees free tuition to in-state students going to Fla. public colleges who have SAT scores of about 1330 and higher. The overwhelming majority of the recipients of such scholarships are middle and upper class. Poor students are lucky to get SATs of 800, even if they are tops in their class. Why? Poor students tend to go to high schools with lots of uncertified teachers and with few AP/IB course offerings. The rigor of the curriculum is the factor most associated with high SAT scores.</p>
<p>I agree with NSM fully. This refrain I constantly hear about the poor being the big beneficiary of financial aid is really nonsense. Statistically it does not pan out. The reason one hears it so much is because the "middle class" does not feel it is getting enough money and the truly poor do get full rides to those schools that do give 100% of need. If your EFC is -0-, then you need a full ride. It is when the number is not zero, that the arguments begin, because no one want to pay, and federal and college methodology is not generous. It hurts to pay over and beyond financial aid even with 100% of need covered.</p>