My experience at Stanford was that engineers ruled the roost and the career placement and counseling office and resources. Now DD is deciding between there and other top tier choices. We are very interested in hearing whether non -STEM majors are still second class citizens and whether Stanford is still having to cancel small humanities classes as they had to just 3 years ago due to under enrollment. Thank you.
It would be helpful to hear about experiences in finding work and what companies recruit there. Thanks.
Hi, I worked on wall street for a long time and I have a JD/MBA from Stanford. Here is what I think. Stanford is one of the best STEM schools in the world. Having said that, Stanford’s brand name is very strong. With a strong GPA and solid social skills, your DD will get a job on wall street, no problem. Having hired Stanford kids, they all say that on campus there is the sense that all the tech kids think the humanities kids are lazier/ less intelligent etc. So there is a little bit of elitism.
Can you explain in more depth, exactly what your experience was and how you came to that conclusion, because I haven’t seen anything which would support that? If anything, the resources devoted to supporting grads other than engineering are more bountiful.
MY son is a freshman at Stanford. He has taken both STEM courses and non-STEM. His courses have been stunningly good–great teachers and demanding. He has chosen well. The non-STEM courses include several seminars will fewer than 15 kids. World class full professors (believe me on this one)'He has worked hard in all classes. If a kid is selective and is willing to put in the time, there is probably no better place than Stanford. On the other hand, if you want easy courses they are available (as they are at almost any school).
I also disagree with jwong. I don’t believe there is an “elitist” STEM culture. Alot of kids do STEM, yes of course, but they don’t look down on non-STEM majors at all. STEM majors tend to consist of harder classes, but that’s really the case at any engineering school.
At the end of the day, if you want study humanities at Stanford, you will do great. There’s nothing holding you back.
My husband went to Stanford and was a STEM major but he also had to take humanities classes which were some of the best classes he had.
OP, please pick up a copy or subscribe to the in-house Stanford magazine. It will give you a very good idea of the humanities at Stanford and all of the cool things going on that are non-STEM.
Thanks everyone. @JustOneDad I know that Stanford is not concerned about its non-STEM faculty or facilities but the number of students so interested. (Please don’t argue this point; it was in the faculty senate’s minutes from last June. Those same minutes though also said that their non-STEM yield is increasing.) Also, the class cancellation was also in the Stanford Magazine. So what I am trying to determine is how far along the school is with its transition to a more balanced student body. Thank you for the responses and suggestions.
I should add that I am a Stanford grad and there is just no question that back then Engineering and STEM ruled. There were very few jobs for non -STEMS and much of dinner conversation was STEMish. As in Humanities classes were looked down upon because they were not “objective”, etc. But that was a long time ago. I am hoping that as it has now become very clear that interdisciplinary study is important that people would be laughed off of campus to now say that there is no intersection of arts and science. If the student body is on board with that then Stanford should be a marvelous place to study.
Do you have a link or a specific quote to what was said?. Stanford currently has a record number of faculty in the humanities and sciences school and in the process of opening a new humanities themed dorm, which largely relates to the success of the SLE program – a special program that targets students who are especially interested in humanities. There are also an increasing number of classes and special programs that combine STEM and humanities, such as the new CS + humanities joint major (see https://undergrad.stanford.edu/academic-planning/majors-minors/joint-majors-csx ).
Similarly, my experience at Stanford was quite different. For example, I took a good number of psychology courses. In the early classes, I recall being amazed by how many of the prominent names in my psychology textbooks were members of the faculty, which probably contributes to why Stanford is usually ranked as the top university in the US in psychology. One could make similar statements for other non-STEM fields, but the point is none of this gives the impression of a university that is not concerned about non-STEM faculty or facilities.
It’s true that a a larger portion of students do major in STEM related fields than in the past at Stanford, as well as at most other highly selective colleges. 10 years ago, the major distribution was roughly half STEM, half non-STEM; while the current distribution is roughly 1/3 CS or engineering, 1/3 other STEM related (I am including things like Human Biology; Economics; and Science, Technology, and Society), and 1/3 non-STEM related. CS in particular has had a large increase during the past decade, becoming Stanford’s most popular major. However, decreasing in popularity does not mean that Stanford only cares about STEM, or non-STEM majors are treated as 2nd class citizens. I think this change more relates to the external environment and culture. For example, if a student can earn a 6-figure starting salary in CS at a company that has a reputation for being a fun place to work and a job that society thinks highly of, that can be an enticing option.
Stanford has career/internship services specific to non-STEM majors, but there will always be more demand for certain majors than others from external companies, which largely relates to the boom in CS recently, as touched on above. Note that this demand is not a strict STEM/non-STEM division. For example, prior to the recent CS boom, HumBio was Stanford’s most popular major even though various career stats such as starting salary, suggest no advantage over typical non-STEM majors from a career prospective (without grad degrees, a large portion or both HumBio and non-STEM majors qt Stanford pursue grad or professional degrees).
While it’s true that many students on campus are currently focusing on STEM, I actually think that non STEM students are able to get a better education here because of that. Stanford has some of the best humanities departments in the country, and there are an abundance of resources and opportunities available to humanities students. Think about this for a second purely in terms of supply and demand. While there might be slightly more demand for STEM majors, there is also significantly more of a supply. In essence, a Stanford CS major is not unique. When it comes to applying for opportunities both on and off campus, there is much less competition for humanities students, which ultimately leads to much more success. If a student wants to do research or simply engage with faculty more frequently, it’s as simple as sending an email and meeting for coffee. In contrast, STEM majors, who generally are in larger classes, don’t have the same opportunities to actually get to know faculty. While STEM majors are more widely publicized, Stanford humanities and social science departments are equally as strong. Since I’ve been here, I’ve had multiple classes with less than five students in them. More commonly, classes will have 10 - 20 students in them, which is equally as engaging. Regardless of what you major in, the opportunities are available at Stanford. However, I tend to believe that non-STEM students are able to utilize them much more effectively while at school here.
@myyalieboy if tthe choice is between stanford and yale or harvard for humanities chose yale or harvard. It is not even close
@mainebh I don’t necessarily disagree that Yale or Harvard make more sense for Humanities based on reputation, but in my opinion to say it’s not even close is a little too far. Besides, for example, social fit is probably more important than the slight difference in department reputation. Also, is the student absolutely sure he/she wants to do humanities? If not, maybe it makes more sense to go where there is a little bit more balance.
Many have different opinions. For example, The Times World University rankings at http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2014-15/subject-ranking/subject/arts-and-humanities have ranked Stanford as #1 in the world in humanities for each of the past 4 years, with an increasingly large gap beyond #2 (usually Harvard) in each of those years .
First a clarification. When I said Stanford was not concerned about its non - STEM faculty or facilities I meant that they have no worries about them because they are good. My concern is about the interests and breadth of the student body. Since I posted this I have read much, including fair criticisms that STEM people take real humanities classes more than humanities people take real STEM classes. I have also read the Stanford Magazine and listened to many viewpoints. My hope is that my DD will go to a college where her interests can be discovered and not channele. Thus curricular and student body balance matters. I conclude that Stanford is not as balanced as it would like to be but that it is getting there at a fast once and so I am not as worried. BTW, the reference to the student body concern can be found on the Stanford site under faculty senate minutes for June or May 2014. Thanks for your thoughtful responses and polite discussion.
.The specific humanities quotes I found from the minutes are below. The make it sounds like Stanford has been making an intentional effort to increase the portion of the student body pursuing humanities and social sciences, but I don’t read much more than that into the statements.
I’m not following your conclusions at all. Stanford must have 10,000 or more courses overall. Let’s say, for the sake of argument that it is not “balanced”. What if only a third are in the Humanities? Can your student max out 3,300 humanities courses?
Less than 40% of the degrees awarded are in STEM according to the most recent common data sets.
I don’t understand what you’re trying to get at.
@Data10 I don’t know what you mean about not reading more into it. I don’t know how much clearer it can be that S is making a concerted effort to address exactly the concern I have. I am not reading anything into it. And I is a fact that they have go cancel under subscribed Hum classes at a greater rats than STEM classes. It is ok to acknowledge a flaw. S has and is addressing it.
I am not talking about what the school offers. I am talking about what the students want to study.
The balance I am talking about us the balance and breadth if interests in the student body itself.
Your first post that started this thread talked about engineering students ruling the career placement and council counseling offices and non-STEM students being second class citizens. I wouldn’t read that the senate minutes support such comments. I wouldn’t even read that Stanford humanities enrollment is low compared to other highly selective colleges that are further away from Silicon Valley. For example, the referenced Senate minutes mention that 19% plan to study humanities at Stanford. At Harvard and Yale, the numbers of entering students wanting to study humanities are 15% and 17% respectively, lower than Stanford. However, Harvard and Yale blow Stanford away in terms of percentage of students wanting to study social sciences, likely due to the closer proximity to Wall Street.