<p>West Point is different D had the whole formal appointment 2 months before USAFA made a decision. They didn't even complete the MALO interview, or have half the paperwork back. It was the last app she completed. It was very difficult to see that nice Award folder and wait on USAFA, and she was an earlier USAFA Appt...Jan. Meanwhile a large number of Westies had to wait until amrch and beyond. They passed on D for SLS too; definetly a different way of doing things.</p>
<p>So I'm guessing therefore that team sports are more calculated into the "leadership" category? I wonder if having a job with leadership experience will have any substantial weight on that category in my application.</p>
<p>SPORTS SPORTS SPORTS....Like Hornet D did TKD and competed at State, Regional and National Levels. The ALO really rained on her parade about it. She took up running CC and Track. Lettered in both. It was shortly after the first CC letter she got her appointment.</p>
<p>Well, a lot of what is being said here is definitely encouraging for my son. Albeit some of their policies may not be fair. So, if my son gets chosen this fall, (Won't know until it happens), he should receive an "Appointment" instead of an LOA being he already has a nomination. Correct? Or are there other reasons to give him an LOA? Later... Mike....</p>
<p>He could get an LOA instead of appointment if his medical has not cleared. At least, that is my understandig.</p>
<p>Sorry, should have qualified my statement. His entire application is 100% complete. Including medical, interviews, CFA, transcripts, nominations, etc... everything is complete.</p>
<p>So, should he be fortunate enough to be selected in October-November, it should be an appointment instead of an LOA. Correct? Thx... Mike....</p>
<p>It's an LOA until he recieved his nomination.</p>
<p>It's an LOA until he recieves his nomination.</p>
<p>nope, TEAM SPORTS. <em>stomps foot</em> I had 2 jobs. Teaching TKD. I was in charge of advertising/customer support/IT at one of the largest aircraft brokerages in the country. They STILL insisted on TEAM SPORTS. TRUST ME.</p>
<p>Sorry HG yes Team Sports, Team Sports, Team Sports....They didn't care about TKD, but liked the Track and CC</p>
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So, should he be fortunate enough to be selected in October-November, it should be an appointment instead of an LOA. Correct?
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<p>Yes. The only reasons LOAs are given out instead of Appointments are for pending nominations and pending medical paperwork. If he's got both done, then the good news would come directly via an Offer of Appointment.</p>
<p>I believe that they look highly upon team sports, but I think it's rather foolish to not also look highly on job experience. I personally think that leadership abilities and skills are better developed when money is on the line rather than winning a game.</p>
<p>Thanks Petko. Now for the hurry up and wait. Although, it did look like some people were able to be notified in the October time frame. That would be great if it were then. Football season would still be in progress and I know if my son found out then it would definitely boost him up.</p>
<p>My son has wanted this ever since he was little and the F16's would fly over the house about 3 times a day. I thought it was a phase he would grow out of. I loved my 21 years in the Air Force, but I thought with his grades that he'd go to a traditional college or University. Every year he reminded me how much time was left before he could apply. I'm sure many of the parents on this forum know the feeling when the little ones grow up and want to find their own wings. In this case literally. Well, he's worked his butt off for 12 years, I hope he gets the chance. Thanks again everyone for clearing up the LOA process. Later... Mike.....</p>
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I believe that they look highly upon team sports, but I think it's rather foolish to not also look highly on job experience. I personally think that leadership abilities and skills are better developed when money is on the line rather than winning a game.
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<p>"Upon the fields of friendly strife are sown the seeds that upon other days and other fields will bear the fruits of victory." - General Douglas MacArthur [Contrails, page 92]</p>
<p>Soylent, I believe that they do look a lot at leadership and skills. They even ask about it on the applications. My son's ALO asked about a lot of leadership things that weren't sports related. Such as his position as secretary in the NHS or being selected to go to Boy's State. There are a lot of leadership traits that they look at. </p>
<p>From what our ALO said, and what I know about the Air Force, the sports emphasis is on Teamwork and extreme physical fitness. Don't get me wrong, I believe that martial arts and such are very physical and demanding. I've been doing Aikido for many years and have the sore muscles and bruises to prove it. It's just that the Air force and military in general is the Ultimate team environment. They like to see candidates with that mind set.</p>
<p>Some people believe that winning isn't everything. That's becoming quite popular in many schools now where "recess" time they don't allow kids playing games to keep score. They think it hurts their self esteem if they "Lose". Well, we are old enough now to realize that in life there are times when you succeed and there are times when you don't. Basically, there are times when you win and some times you lose. The most important part of team sports isn't winning. It's how to teach you to lose and use that experience to try harder next time. And how to sacrifice yourself for the team so that the team can win. When it comes to the military, that is exactly what you need to believe in. My son has been playing varsity football and soccer now for 3 years. I believe that sports have developed a form of team work that is hard to achieve from other places. You definitely develop teamwork in the workforce and in other life experiences. I think it's a little different however. </p>
<p>So, I don't believe that the actual playing of sports is what is important to them. It's the environment that sports, especially varsity high school sports, provides for individuals to look beyond themselves at the greater good of the team. I think that there are plenty of other areas where they can see that you have leadership type qualities. Later... Mike....</p>
<p>I've heard that quote a million times. I've worked in a high volume restaurant for two years and I've played team sports. The teamwork and comradery at my restaurant means a lot more than anything experienced in any sport I've played.</p>
<p>Well, it sounds like you have a really good place to work at. That's excellent. That does count for a lot. That's why they ask if you work on the applications. You are fortunate. Most people don't find that type of environment until they find a career. Big difference between a job and a career. You've obviously had the opportunity to develop team work and your leadership skills. </p>
<p>Most students in high school don't get those opportunities. Any jobs they get traditionally will be the fast food type and similar where they go in and do their time. Usually very high turnover rate type of jobs. </p>
<p>Nothing to take away from, definitely. There are a lot of good experiences that can be gained from working in a good team environment. But a lot of the same characteristics are found in the sports arena. After all, the number goal of the Air Force Academy is not to give you a college education. It's to teach hundreds and/or thousands of people who have very little in common, to find what they do have in common and learn to work together as a team. Then, to be able to lead others to be part of that team. Then, God forbid, use this teamwork if necessary to protect and defend.</p>
<p>I don't think anyone is saying that these teamwork skills and self sacrifice can't be learned and developed in a work environment such as what you have done. Just that the type of team attitude and self sacrifice similar to the military environment is found quite closely in the world of team sports. Team sports is a common denominator that most high school students have the opportunity to participate in. And that it is one of many factors the academies use to measure their applicants. Add to this the physical conditioning required of most team sports, and it's a very good indicator to judge by. Now, whether or not the academy puts to much emphasis on sports compared to work experience and such, well that will always be debatable. Then again, nothing is perfect in life. Most of the times we don't get to write the rules. If however we want to play the game, we do have to play by the rules. High school team sports happens to be one of those things that if you really want to go to the academy and become a military office and serve your country, then it is highly suggested that interested applicants get involved in. Later... Mike....</p>
<p>Soylent, sorry to be blunt, but whether anyone thinks differently really doesn't matter in terms of application. As far as the Academy is concerned, the most consistent and proven activity in promoting strong teamwork (in both physical and mental states) as well as a leadership environment is team athletics. This is why they place such a huge emphasis on intermurals and intercollegiates. IIRC, USAFA was ranked in the top three for schools with athletic participation, this includes all civilian and military schools. It's important in building the bonds that the military is looking for when combat rolls around. </p>
<p>Sure, there are work environments that also have this going for them, but not as consistently as athletics. I really wasn't concerned with my salary at my jobs, I just wanted to be working really. </p>
<p>Spot on Christcorp, I wish this country would stop the attitude that a little competition makes everyone unhappy and miserable...blahblahblah. It's pathetic honestly. This country has always been in its prime when competition ran high. It's a proven concept!</p>
<p>It's funny how you talk about your son. I've always wanted to fly from the time I can remember. Ever since I learned the academies existed when I was 8, I've wanted to be at one. In fact, I joined TKD at that young age for athletic reasons because I was horrible and uncomfortable in school athletics. So now, I'm livin' the dream. :)</p>
<p>Right after I posted my message, the server shut down and I didn't have time to edit. My situation is quite unique and I understand that the academies aren't going to change their applications and procedures just for me, but that doesn't mean I can't wish :D</p>
<p>I don't mean to bash McArthur or the stance of Academies on anything.</p>
<p>IMO, team athletics make a huge difference in trying for an LOA, but not as much for the appointment in March.</p>