Mac iBooks -- Pros & Cons.

<p>i want a macbook but i want a 14'' alot more cuz im worried that 13'' will be too small. so im on the fence about buying one.</p>

<p>plmok- Yes, but legaly, you have do to that for all computers. Pc or Mac. Its 150.00 for student teacher.</p>

<p>Riptide880- I had a sentia 12" and its fine, its weird at first but after that its cake.</p>

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I've heard they run warm, as do the old iBooks (except the original clamshell iBooks--I have one and it has a fan in the hard drive!)

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<p>MacTech, I've seen desktops with cooling for HDs. It just seems to be a consequence of packing all those transistors and tiny "moving parts" together in such a small space.</p>

<p>I don't really find my MBP to be that unbearably hot, though.</p>

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If you buy a Macbook and want to use powerpoint/word do you then have to pay for Windows and Microsoft Office?

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<p>Yes...and no.</p>

<p>Yes, because you'd have to buy it on any system (Office doesn't come with most Wintel machines, either.)</p>

<p>No, because there are always "less than legal" ways of acquiring the software.</p>

<p>No, because there are free alternatives like OpenOffice.org.</p>

<p>Uhh, IBM thinkpads are MUCH better in terms of durability versus a Mac Book.</p>

<p>The extra money you pay for a thinkpad is all quality.</p>

<p>The extra money you pay for a mac is all about style.</p>

<p>Mac's can and do often break down. Its not like they make them special versus PC's. Everything is made in China, its only the quality assurance that differes among all the brandname companies, and Apple is definitely not better than IBM/Lenovo.</p>

<p>Ranking of quality IBM>HP=Mac>Dell.</p>

<p>I don't see why anyone would really get a mac apart from the user interface and certain specialized software niches, especially now that Mac's use almost the exact same hardware as PC's (INtel Duo Core).</p>

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Plus Pro's arnt fixed yet

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<p>Neither is your spelling.</p>

<p>BURN.</p>

<p>Anyway, I have a Pro and it runs fine. Yes, there's a whine, but it's no worse than what I had in my last Wintel machine.</p>

<p>Pros
-It works</p>

<p>Cons
-You are paying over a thousand dollars more than you should because its a fashion item</p>

<p>seriously, you can get a working laptop that will do everything you want for well under 1,000 dollars, hell, if you dont play games, you can get a good laptop for 500. a mac now uses intel and microsoft office.</p>

<p>BUT A MAC IS WHITE AND SHINY AND LOOKS SO COOL AND ITS A MAC SO ILL MAKE MY PARENTS PAY</p>

<p>cmaher,</p>

<p>The problem with "bargain" laptops is that they're usually heavier, made of inferior parts, and prone to hardware failures. Nevermind the increased productivity you get out of a system that's designed well and has a good keyboard.</p>

<p>"they're usually heavier"</p>

<p>Oh geez, what, 5 pounds more? Please...</p>

<p>A2Wolves6,</p>

<p>5 pounds starts mattering when you're carrying it everywhere with you. Don't believe me? Try putting a 5 pound weight in your bag for a week and see how it affects you.</p>

<p>DIOGENES,</p>

<p>That's why most reviews of Apple products put them around the top 3, along with IBM?</p>

<p>It has nothing to do with WHERE it's made, it's all about components. What separates the Apples and Lenovos from the HPs and Dells is the quality of the components.</p>

<p>Of course, I tend to notice that the higher end Dells like the XPS also share good build quality.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Uhh, IBM thinkpads are MUCH better in terms of durability versus a Mac Book.</p>

<p>The extra money you pay for a thinkpad is all quality.</p>

<p>The extra money you pay for a mac is all about style.
[. . .]
Ranking of quality IBM>HP=Mac>Dell.

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You sound like you speak from experience.
Either that or unsubstantiated bias. Whichever one.</p>

<p>
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Mac's can and do often break down. Its not like they make them special versus PC's. Everything is made in China, its only the quality assurance that differes among all the brandname companies, and Apple is definitely not better than IBM/Lenovo.

[/quote]

Whether or not a machine breaks down has nothing to do with where it's made, it's the quality of the components and the system of putting them together that matters, and believe me Apple makes a huge difference. My iBook is 4 years old and people still look at it and think it's brand new. The only time it ever failed me was when I stupidly gave myself root access and screwed around with the kernel. </p>

<p>
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I don't see why anyone would really get a mac apart from the user interface and certain specialized software niches, especially now that Mac's use almost the exact same hardware as PC's (INtel Duo Core).

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There is far more to hardware than just the processor architecture. It's not just the processor that matters, putting the components together properly and optimizing the whole system to work properly together counts for a lot. And don't sell short the UI. A good UI isn't just about being pretty, it's about being productive. It works, and not having to hassle about a software update every week and patching security holes incessantly and dealing with spyware constantly goes a long way towards improving your computing experience and making you more productive.</p>

<p>
[quote]
-You are paying over a thousand dollars more than you should because its a fashion item</p>

<p>seriously, you can get a working laptop that will do everything you want for well under 1,000 dollars, hell, if you dont play games, you can get a good laptop for 500. a mac now uses intel and microsoft office.

[/quote]

Over $1,000 more? Unlikely. Macs are marginally more expensive, but it's usually closer to a $200 discrepancy maximum for a comparably equipped computer. But then if you factor in the quality of the software (the iLife suite is some damn fine software) and the overall amount of stuff you get built in (microphones, iSight, etc.), as well as the general ease of use (most drivers are built-in so plug-and-play is a breeze, and most tasks are made mindnumbingly simple so everything from using peripherals to networking or anything else becomes infinitely easier) many would factor that it is well worth it.
Sure if you buy a cheap $500 computer it will do what you need it to do for a while. The typical user's computing needs are usually very basic. But when you go that low-end your computer is going to go obsolete fast. The extra money you pay for superior specs is so that the computer will last you a long time. Skimp too much now and you'll end up paying more in the long-run.</p>

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Whether or not a machine breaks down has nothing to do with where it's made, it's the quality of the components and the system of putting them together that matters,

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</p>

<p>A good example is the mobo market. Though Abit and Gigabyte are both manufactured in the same region (Taiwan), Gigabyte models using the SAME chipset will run more stably and quickly. </p>

<p>Look at benchmarks on sites like TomsHardware and it's really quite self-evident that certain brands of RAM, northbridges, HDs, and other usually overlooked components can have a noticeably large effect on system stability and speed. </p>

<p>I find it telling that the most common destabilizer of a Mac is crappy generic RAM.</p>

<p>I can tell you from experience building computers that brand name components (which are not always used in low-end machines) make a HUGE difference in stability. Try it. Go out, buy $500 of crappy hardware from no-name companies, and then run a burn-in test.</p>

<p>I went through high school carrying 32 pounds on my back in books. If you're complaining about 5 pounds then you have some issues to work out in the weight room.</p>

<p>A2Wolves6,</p>

<p>Nice attack on a person's health there.</p>

<p>Again, take that 32 pound bag and add a 5 pound weight to it. You'd be amazed how much it affects you.</p>

<p>And besides, why would you want the computer to weigh MORE? Why pay the same price and get a heavier machine, when you can get a lighter machine? Just to be macho? No thanks. </p>

<p>By the way, you'd be amazed how much your tolerance for carrying weight in a crappy knapsack wanes once you hit your 20s.</p>

<p>Because you don't have to pay the same price. You can opt for a PC that's 1/2 the price with the same components.</p>

<p>Find me a Wintel notebook with the same exact build quality for 1/2 the price. Remember, there's more to build quality than just megahertz and HD size.</p>

<p>The best built Wintel books are easily the Lenovos, and they're comparably expensive (maybe a tad bit cheaper.)</p>

<p>Sorry, i'm not a notebook nerd, I don't know what Wintel is and I don't know what Lenovos are. </p>

<p>I was looking at Macs that had the same processor, same RAM, same hard drive, that were twice the size of the Dell I purchased. And that was with no discount on the Dell and a student discount on the MAC.</p>

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Again, take that 32 pound bag and add a 5 pound weight to it. You'd be amazed how much it affects you.

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And don't forget the hell that is a messenger bag. Weight distribution on those things is a nightmare. Even 4 or 5 pounds in one of those can drag you down.
Besides, 32 pound bags in high school where you walk a maximum of several yards to get between classes is very different from 32 pounds in college where you may find yourself literally needing to walk for nearly a mile or more to get to class.</p>

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Wintel is and I don't know what Lenovos are.

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Wintel = Windows machines.
Lenovo = IBM laptops.</p>

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I was looking at Macs that had the same processor, same RAM, same hard drive, that were twice the size of the Dell I purchased.

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I'm assuming you meant twice the cost, and I'm pretty sure you're exagerrating.
But you're not comparing a comparable system. First of all, it's not the same RAM and the same hard drive. The Mac likely has higher quality RAM, which goes a huge way towards ensuring system stability and efficiency. It also likely has a higher quality Hard Drive which ensures less seek-time, quicker reading/writing of data, and less chance of data getting corrupted. It makes a difference. Instead of looking at the MB and GB of the RAM and Hard Drive, also look at the Hard Drive's RPMs and seek time. Look at the RAM's specs and make sure they're the same.
You'll also have to make sure you check the graphics card. Make sure they're the same.
And depending on which one you're looking at, you have to make sure you're comparing the same processors. The clock-speed of the processor isn't what matters. A 1Ghz Pentium 4 is actually "slower" than a 800Mhz G4 for many calculations (except floating point I think.) You need to check whether or not the processor architechture is comparable before you can go making that comparison. Even a 1.2Ghz Core-Duo is superior to a regular Pentium clocked at 150% of that speed.</p>

<p>Mac has higher quality ram? Have you ever opened up a MacBook? I have since a neighbor wanted me upgrade the hard drive for him (which is a total pain in the ass because you literally have to take the computer apart). Apple uses RAM from Samsung, Hynix, Nanya, and Micron. Now none of these brands are known for ultra low latency ram (which is all that matters since RAM nowadays are pretty much all the same, ironically Dell uses the some of the same RAM as Apple). As for hard drive, it uses the exact same hard drive found in many Dells. I cant seem to see how the same hard drive will be "better" in a Mac. As for the video card, any video card in a MacBook will perform not as well as a Windows counterpart. ATI supplies the video card for the MacBooks and the OS X drivers are no where as good as the Windows drivers. There are many benchmarks that show this. Furthermore, MacBooks are more expensive no matter how you look at it, it is not really 2x the cost, but more like 30% more. The price is about the same as a Lenovo Thinkpad though. With a Thinkpad you are paying for its ruggedness and reliability. With a MacBook you are payiing for style and OS X. This doesnt mean MacBooks are not as good as Lenovo Thinkpads. They stress different priorities. However your argument that Macs perform better than Wintels and uses "higher quality components" is just totally false. Quality nowadays = keyboard flex, quality of the LCD used, hinge strength, overall sturdiness.</p>