Yes it’s amazing. No it doesn’t matter at the bulk of the schools. Yes it matters and impresses at Chicago and Vandy.
For Bama - which the parent is looking at for free tuition, housing and even some grad tuition - the psat matters. Tulsa is another they might look at if they like Vandy/Chicago.
It’s certainly impressive but not always in use given the list of schools.
A fine accomplishment though.
The student seems wonderful.
It’s a great score (only about 2200 test-takers score 1590+ each year); and clearly he did great on the PSAT as well, as the NMSF threshold is pretty high in California.
As you’ve observed, the UC’s are test blind anyway. For schools like Emory, Vandy, and UChicago, high scores help with both admissions and merit, but scores aren’t the be-all and end-all. These schools turn down kids with 1590’s, and accept others who have lower scores and either submit those scores or apply test optional. High scores are a plus, increasing the odds of the merit that the OP is seeking, but they’re not a golden ticket. OP’s strong performance on tests certainly bodes well for the LSAT and law school admissions, though, if he decides to go that route!
He has expressed interest in alternatives to Alabama where he can get generous NMF merit packages - particularly ones with a little less of a “party school” reputation - which was why I thought UTD sounded like a great fit - lots of serious, high-performing students there - it’s neither a “party school” nor “too liberal,” which was the OP’s other concern. Making suggestions that may be helpful isn’t about being sufficiently impressed; it’s about finding the right cultural, financial, and academic fit. There are high-scoring kids at many schools, especially the ones that reward high scores with big discounts.
Thank you for the recommendation. I think that you are right on the better fit. He probably needs a little more Asian student population than Bama. It’s likely we will replace Bama with UT Dallas. He will be looking into it.
Thank you for the compliment. I’m here for other’s advice, not for bragging.
I also saw your post on Equine major mentioning criminal justice major. Your comments prompted me to read a lot on that major. I wish I knew more about it before.
As a result I plan to talk him out of the idea of having criminology as his major and will recommend him to take is as minor if he still wants it. At the same time he showed interest in UCI/UCLA/UCSD’s quantitative economics/Mathematics-Economics major. That would use his brain better, be more marketable, and be a better preparation for law school if he wants to continue there. Please don’t hesitate to be direct. Thanks!
He is busy writing UC essays. procrastinating… I cannot understand why it takes so much time, but it’s what it is.
Per the plan, he should get the UC application draft done by the end of month, then put it aside for now in order to focus on private college application in Oct. and Nov. We are finalizing the list for merit-aid schools.
A new criteria is that he prefers the schools to have a fair share of Asian students. So we likely will skip Bama (with 1.5% Asian population).
will remove UT Austin (thank for the suggestion, the 40-acre is hardly designed for him)
UT Dallas most likely to be added to replace Bama
UChicago, USC, Vandy, Emory, and BU stay
Note on BU: I studied the timing of designating first choice college for his NMF (he got 1520 on PSAT so we don’t think that should be an issue). It looks like that BU’s early 3/1 deadline does not affect the plan to apply to multiple schools for NMF scholarships.
Although I don’t know your son personally, from what I have read about him a Criminal Justice major might not be a good fit, but a Criminology major certainly could. Criminal Justice is more of a pre-professional major to prepare students to work in the law enforcement or prison system. In contrast, I think of Criminology as a more theoretical and cerebral major with a focus on analyzing the sociological, economic and psychological factors that contribute to crime statistics. It would involve a lot of math, data science, CS etc. It would impart skills that could easily transfer to other fields.
The “analysis” is not likely to involve “a lot of math, data science, CS” and certainly won’t require the sorts of quantitative courses seen in math econ. Seemingly there’s not always even a requirement for basic econ and quantitative methods courses that are typical of sociology or public affairs majors. My S did public affairs and despite these two courses he was one of only a handful of students who did real “big data” analysis (for his honors thesis). Most students hated math and some objected even to having a final exam in the quantitative methods course.
Here’s the criminology major at UCI, which has no math or data analysis whatsoever:
https://catalogue.uci.edu/schoolofsocialecology/departmentofcriminologylawandsociety/#courseinventory
Also, a student who doesn’t want a school that is too “politically liberal” might well see some red flags in the course descriptions, such as “ Develops an understanding and critique of private property. Draws from interdisciplinary sources to explore the foundations of private property, the institutions that support it over time, and possible alternatives to it.”
Yeah, I think @fiftyfifty1 is on the right track around Criminal Justice - that does tend to generally be a pre-professional track, not an academic track - but Criminology can vary quite widely depending on the school: it can be part of or associated with a Science/STEM-oriented Sociology department, or it can remain quite abstract/theoretical.
The typical basic undergraduate sociology or criminology* major likely requires just basic statistics (on the AP statistics level) or something at a similar level. Some students (perhaps the OP’s student) may want to learn statistics to a more advanced level to apply to the subject or other social sciences.
*As in the research / policy oriented majors, not the criminal justice majors aimed at pre-professional preparation for law enforcement careers.
Have you thought about Houston? A USA Today article rated it as having one of the top 10 Chinatowns in the U.S.
Rice (TX): I’ve heard this is a really collegial, fun group of academically-minded students. Rice is in the middle of Houston, but feels set apart. Like most of the Top X schools on your list, Rice also offers a limited number of merit scholarships. About 4500 undergrads here with about 25.7% identifying as Asian.
U. of Houston: Your son would be guaranteed full tuition, a research stipend, and a study abroad stipend as a NMF, and he’d be a very strong contender for the full ride for first two years (Tier One Scholars), but to qualify for Tier One he’d need to submit the app by Nov 1. About 38k undergrads here with 24% of students identifying as Asian.
More useful might be “big data” analysis. Not just statistics but data science. So for example my son ended up taking a class in R and learning about GIS systems so he could analyze housing permits and how they were impacted by different zoning regulations.
In his job (real estate consulting) he now spends a lot of time on complex Excel models with Visual Basic.
If OP’s kid is good at math then a math econ major is far more useful than criminology.
Yes I did for Rice.
A few years ago our family visited a close friend who lives in Houston. She and her husband graduated from Rice and U. of Houston. We walked Rice campus and really enjoyed it. I checked its website again. Its merit aid is very limited. I’ll look into U. of Houston. Thanks!
You are right. He doesn’t see himself being a peace officer so criminal justice does not work. In some colleges there are Department of Criminal Justice. These will be avoided. Others have Department of Criminology and Criminal Justice, so they are comingled. I looked at UCI (#2 on criminology) curriculum of their Criminology, Laws and Society program, and cannot say that I’m impressed. I guess that the more serious research work on criminology only exists at a higher degree level.
Note that research on crime can exist in other subjects. For example, economics research can include research into how illegal markets and businesses work. Other economics research into illegal actions includes research on the economic aspects of illegal discrimination.
Psych, Sociology and Urban Planning are also disciplines where important research on criminal behavior, long term impact of incarceration, etc. is being conducted- in addition to Econ as UCB accurately points out.
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