Match me - rising senior looking for some target/safety school recommendations [MI resident, 3.97, 34, <$70k]

Chance Me / Match Me!
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Demographics

  • US citizen
  • state - MI
  • private high school - considered fairly rigorous
  • South Asian/Female

Intended Major(s) - Unsure :frowning: Potentially Biology

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores

  • Unweighted HS GPA: 3.97
  • Weighted HS GPA (incl. weighting system): ( not sure )
  • Class Rank: not sure. Counsellor at school did mention she is one of the top students he is working with .
  • ACT/SAT Scores: 34 ACT

Coursework
2 AP classes in Junior year , 1 IB class , 2 Honors classes , 3 years of Spanish overall , Will take 3 more APs in senior year.

Awards

Extracurriculars
School community service club leadership position, various volunteering activities throughout high school ( food banks , department of natural resources) , varsity lacrosse since freshman year , work experience in a restaurant over summer breaks.

Essays/LORs/Other
Working on these

Cost Constraints / Budget
<70K if school is worth it

Schools
Safety - MSU
Reach ? - U of Michigan , Vassar , Northwestern
Targets - No idea

Looking for some potential recommendations for target/safety schools.

Location - prefer a smaller town setting on the East Coast, in the Midwest or the Pacific North West.

Suggestions/ advice most welcome. We are getting overwhelmed trying to narrow schools down.

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I think she has a pretty good chance at U Mich. Sounds as if she is top 5% or higher, but did she take only a few of the APs offered, or did she take most of those offered?

Does she want a big school? Is she willing to look at small liberal arts colleges? She might do better at the “little Ivies” than at the Ivies and bigger T20 type schools. How far is she willing to go?

Will you qualify for any financial aid? If not, full fare these days is over 80k a year. She might get merit money at lesser schools, and possibly at some flagship state U s.

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Thanks. She didn’t take all the APs offered. Her school advisor generally recommends what courses to take and she went with those I guess.
She is willing to go anywhere in the North East , Pacific NW or even CA ( apart from the midwest of course ).
Thank you ! We will look into some of the little ivies as well . She does not really care about school size .
No financial aid based on income :frowning: .
Fingers crossed for U of M since tbh that is the best option financially and it is a great school and only 20 mins away !

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Then you’re going to have to chase merit or apply to schools whose COA is below 70k.
Take Northwestern and the UCs off your list.

I agree your daughter has a very good shot at UMich.

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The good news is that there are some excellent schools that, because of their Midwest location, are easier to get into than schools of comparable quality on the coasts. Most of these schools will also be cheaper after merit.

Examples for LACs include Lawrence, Beloit, St.Olaf and Macalester.

Women’s colleges also often provide more accessible admissions rates and lower costs than comparable quality co-ed schools. Examples include Mt. Holyoke etc.

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Interesting - you go to a private school and that’s where your chancing should begin. They will have the resources to best know where your student fits.

Since you can spend 70k+, I’ll assume full pay

The question is why Michigan, Northwestern and Vassar.

That runs the gamut - certainly of size. I understand the in state part for cost but what does the student want in a school?

Bio is one of the most difficult majors outcome wise - ie underemployment and under paid. So you should factor in cost - especially if grad school is planned - whether law, medical or otherwise.

How rigorous is her schedule - that will matter. In other words, I see what you wrote but it sounds like the school offers many more APs and perhaps the student hasn’t taken the most rigorous schedule ? If not, that will hinder, especially at the reaches.

Michigan / Michigan State -

Targets or other safeties can range from other MW, NE, or NW publics - from a Penn State/Pitt, Ohio State/Miami, SUNY schools, UVM, Delaware, Oregon Schools, UMN, UMASS, Kentucky, Illinois, WVU, Purdue, IU etc. these would hit budget and bring merit. YES I SAY UK and WVU hit your defined geographies as would the acclaimed KU Honors program and it’s cheap relative to budget.

I guess targets in that group would be Wisconsin, Washington, Maryland. They may even be slight reaches but certainly get-able.

But I’d ask - if Michigan State plus Honors for an In state price, why look at any of those ?

Of course if you don’t want big or somewhat big then none of those should be applied to. Given the stats and budget, they’re not needed.

If Northwestern is the reach, Syracuse is a solid match but bio isn’t what it’s known for. But I’ve always thought, since being an SU alum, that it’s the Northwestern cousin. Perhaps slight reach but in line would be Rochester and Brandeis. These three require merit. Miami - southeast - is a likely with demonstrated interest and would be in budget with merit.

Lehigh, GW, American might be others. RPI but it’s STEM heavy. And merit is iffy.

For LACs you can hit cost and even many many thousands less whether a Beloit, Kalamazoo, Wooster in the MW or Clark or Gettysburg or Susquehanna type in the NE. Or out West Willamette or a Puget Sound or Lewis & Clark. The LACs and many more are safeties. A Macalester or Kenyon or Dennison or Bucknell or Lafayette or Dickinson type might be a target or the first two a low reach but can you get to budget?

I’d say forget having a list. Besides location and budget
what attributes do you want. Size, weather, urban/rural, access to an airport, sports, Greek life and other things?

For someone with your stats, there are schools from $20k on up and a ton up to $70k

What’s your true budget and are you willing to trade location for cost ?

Put another way - if U of Alabama or UAH were $20k or Arizona $25k but Wisconsin $56k, which would you choose? Or SUNY Bing potentially in the 30s or lower. Or WVU in the 20s.

If Vassar is $85k, are you choosing it over Kalamazoo at $40k and Beloit, Depauw, Allegheny and Wooster all are under $50k?

How about a U Denver - again not your geography or a Butler etc or sub under $50k vs a Northwestern at $91k and increasing.

And knowing a bio major is low paid, and that cost is not one year but for four years.

I think you have more to think about vs just names.

Your student has afforded you financial freedom if you desire based on their incredible academics.

So you can spend but don’t have to.

And given the major or other interests that the major gets changed to whether forestry, public health or otherwise, there’s a good chance outcomes will be similar regardless.

But don’t put schools out there yet. Think first about what the student wants. Then build a list from there.

Good luck.

And I don’t buy the any school size. Has she been to small schools to compare vs a UM ?? It’s important to be exposed to schools of different sizes and environments.

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It appears that the OP has indicated that it’s a given that the Midwest is open to full consideration.

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My bad. I misread thinking they were saying not Midwest. Since I had already responded and included the MW then all good. Thx

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Skidmore, SUNY New Paltz, SUNY Geneseo, SUNY Binghamton

The smaller SUNY schools are generally less expensive than Bing. She will likely get merit to Bing (not sure about the others).

Does she know what she wants to do with her bio degree?

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Thanks all for your great replies. Lots to consider here. A huge problem is she does not have a clear or even somewhat clear path on what she wants to do with her degree career-wise.

Pure engineering/comp sci is out - we know that for sure , rest is sort of maybes ? But that is a different subject and don’t want to derail this . Her counsellor suggests psych/English as well just to put some major down for now.

She did visit Vassar but very briefly a while ago in fall and she loved the campus , lol .
MSU with honors is definitely going to be something she applies to.
I will look at the others suggested here - appreciate all the help !!!
I didn’t quite realize NW was so expensive .

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NW is very expensive.

She doesn’t have to figure out her career now. She has time.

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As U Mich seems to be a great match for her both academically and financially, she should of course apply to it early action, by the Nov 1st deadline. It’s just too bad that they don’t give an answer until late January, which means that she still has to apply to a bunch of other schools. One of the best things about those colleges who reply by mid Dec to early action/decision apps is that the accepted person doesn’t have to submit regular decision applications, making the entire process a whole lot less stressful.

If you really will not qualify for any fin aid (and you’d be surprised, even if your household income is as much as 250K but without significant assets other than your own home, you might qualify for a little fin aid), but you can budget 70K/yr, you’re kind of on the edge of affording private, which will be as much as 85K/yr rack rate.

You’re really in a difficult situation here. For her, academically U Mich is a match/likely, but not a sure thing. MSU is a likely, but she can probably do better. Financially, all the other privates are a reach for you. Academically, other flagship state U’s that might give her significant merit money are a match/low reach/reach, but they’re all financially within reach for you. And the entire complex, expensive, stressful, time-consuming process would be largely unnecessary, if U Mich would only give an answer to early action by mid December!

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I disagree they are on the edge financially.

90% of privates - I’m guessing - maybe 80% - will come in under $70k. But they need to stop talking about Vassar or any colleges that don’t offer merit. But the student’s academics have opened an entire array of schools that will clamor financially to have them on campus.

There’s a ton of great LACs - in the NE, MW, and PNW that will throw money at the student. Do they have the name as Vassar or Bowdoin - no.

Anything wrong with a Kalamazoo, Depauw, Wooster, Allegheny, Willamette, Clarkson, Lawrence and so many more. No.

And frankly if OP is doing bio, English, psych etc then where they go will matter less.

To OP, that your student doesn’t know what they want to do - join the club. At many colleges, you don’t declare a major right away. Or at some undecided is the biggest or one of the biggest majors.

Given the students stats, there are OOS publics that will be inexpensive if leaving Michigan matters. For English and other majors, Iowa is top notch.

Lots of great midsize schools and especially the LACs.

First thing you have to do though is set a budget with your child.

You say $75k or more if worth it. So will you go $90k for NW or $85k for a Vassar ? And don’t forget college costs more than they tell you. There was a recent thread that b4 students even stepped on campus there were charges for orientation. Don’t forget about going out, weekend trips, travel home, hotels fir getting there, coming home if driving, software, buying a computer etc.

Maybe you truly only want to spend $40k or $50k. Come up with a # and stick too it. That’s step one. And share that with your student so you don’t consider schools you can’t afford or don’t want to afford. As you review schools and realize they have no way to hit budget - you cross them off.

As @parentologist says, run net price calculators. If Vassar is giving a $40k grant based on your income and assets, $85k is $45k. But if not and you don’t want to spend $85k and more in future years - eliminate it NOW.

You might look at schools with Open curriculums - meaning there’s less Gen. Ed requirements. At all/most schools you can sample but if a school is open you can sample a bit more.

Grinnell and Rochester have merit aid. They may or may not come in at cost. They are reaches, especially Grinnell. Kalamazoo has the K plan
it’s a safety and I’d be shocked if it didn’t come in well below even $50k. And it’s close. Go check it out. Actually you are close to many great schools - small and large - if you have time for road trips this summer.

Lots of us are full pay parents but set up strict budgets and our kids had tons to choose from as did you. But the trick is not even letting your kids talk about or especially visit those schools that have zero possibility of getting you to a # and that’s both Vassar and Northwestern.

For any school you can google the school name + cost of attendance. The same with school name + net price calculator. The latter will tell you if you qualify for need aid. Some NPCs will include a merit estimation. If you google a school + merit aid, you can figure out right away if they offer scholarships and if so, how likely you are to receive. If they say we have 10, assume it’s a no or at least unlikely. So apply but always ensure you have 2 or 3 affordable safeties. Michigan State will be #1 - but if and only if the student can see themselves at such a large school. Otherwise we will find you different safeties.

Best of luck.

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They’re willing to pay up to 70K for a school that is “worth it”. That’s code for a highly prestigious name, and most of those schools don’t offer merit money, and those that do, it’s very tough to get that award. This is an “average excellent” student with a great academic record and nice ECs, not gonna get the very few merit awards that the T20 schools offer, might not even get in.

Of course she could qualify for merit at less selective private colleges, the less selective, the more merit money, also OOS merit at OOS flagships, maybe even a ton of merit at the OOS publics that are offering big money to students with fantastic stats, especially if they are NMSFs. But with a good chance at U Mich at in-state tuition, I don’t think that they’re gonna choose to chase merit at less selective private colleges, or at less selective publics than U Mich.

I just wish, for their sake, that they could be certain that she gets accepted by U Mich and not have to go through the entire RD app process!

Maybe the college counselor at the private high school could let them know if she’s a shoe-in for U Mich?

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I will second the suggestion of @tsbna44 that the OP’s daughter might want to look at Kalamazoo College – right across the state – which checks off several boxes. Here is a link to K College: https://www.kzoo.edu/ ; and here is a link to scholarships that are available at K College: Cost and Value – Admission | Kalamazoo College .

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And to your point with prestige - that’s likely what’s happening here although Michigan State was mentioned.

The Midwest has so many top level publics - whether Ohio State, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Purdue, IU etc that short of majors OP isn’t considering - it’s unlikely to matter.

And for the privates - parents and students should understand the cost vs name recognition and also note many of the prestigious schools aren’t known to the general society.

Many a lesser known and less expensive school put out successful grads in the workplace and into graduate school, no different than the prestigious schools.

And most importantly don’t require parents to stroke such a large check two times each and every year - which to me is frightening. Easier said than done.

Too many say - I want to go to a top school - like it’s some kind of guarantee - but anything is farther from the truth.

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These is much in here to disagree with. If you have a somewhat flexible budget and cost isn’t a dealbreaker (ie a school is affordable, and there are certainly people do pay full pay, though certainly people prefer not to) then there is NO REASON to take a school off your (her) list now. You never know what she might get offered if she doesn’t apply. As someone said, even if you have a good income and assets, there are things that may offset it in FA calculations and you can always write a letter of reconsideration for financial aid if there are extenuating circumstances. Appeals in some cases can work. There is nothing wrong with deciding what school is “worth it” to you.

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I didn’t say not to take off schools that are potentially affordable.

I said you don’t leave schools on that are 100%, definitely unaffordable.

If OP has a $70K max, then you don’t go over - just because it’s Vassar. If $70K is truly your max - then you don’t go over. If the school is full pay and offers no merit - there’s no point having it on the list.

As a successful merit chaser, I advise:

  1. Need an assured safety - preferably two - that work both admission and cost wise.

  2. Need some schools that likely achieve #1 - this might be a Miami of Ohio, a Pitt, some of the LACs I mention.

  3. You can take a flyer on schools that even if full pay, have merit - no matter how limited. That’s a Mac, Kenyon, Rochester, Vandy, WUSTL, W&L, etc. You just assume you are not going to this school, even if you get in. But there is that tiny chance you get the money you need.

What you don’t include - if you are full pay - are the Ivies, Georgetown, the Vassars of the world.

What’s the point if they’re over your budget and you won’t qualify for aid (hence you check out the NPC).

Hoping that you can “convince” financial aid that they are mistaken is akin to winning the lottery
that’s not a method one should count on.

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Where does the OP say that 70k is their absolute “max” ? They put a budget, but we don’t know (a)how “firm” that budget is or (b) what kind of possible package the schools might offer. This is doesn’t sound like an applicant who is unable to consider expensive schools, so telling them they have to remove a school that may currently be a school they desire is IMO off the mark. They can certainly augment their list with schools that may be more in their budget and worth adding to the list, but that is in addition to schools that may be manageable, not instead of.

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I would suggest this student look at some of the great flagships in the Midwest with honors programs. They can also look at the Colleges that Change Lives where there are some wonderful schools that fly under the radar screen and would be within the price point mentioned on this thread.

I see Miami University in Oxford Ohio been mentioned. That’s worth checking out.

Plenty of smaller colleges that are worthy of consideration
Denison, Rhodes.

What about University of Dayton? Loyola Chicago or Loyola Maryland?

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