<p>I am a European history and medieval and Renaissance Studies double major and will be applying to graduate school at the end of this term. I had originally planned to apply for history, but am now considering applying to medieval studies programs as well. I know there are pros and cons to both in terms of hireability - a PhD in history fits more neatly into a particular department than medieval studies, but medieval studies programs are interdisciplinary and offer training in multiple fields, in theory making that PhD more adaptable. I think I'm a pretty solid applicant - 3.6 overall GPA, 3.9 and 3.8 major GPAs, respectively. I haven't taken the GRE yet (I'm doing so this weekend). I go to a small but prestigious liberal arts college, have presented at a local conference, and am quite sure that I will have strong letters of recommendation. I've studied abroad twice and received a grant for independent research this summer and am writing an honors thesis for the medieval and Renaissance major (which won't be written in time to submit it with my applications). My language skills are somewhat lacking - I consider myself proficient in Latin and Spanish and I can read Italian.</p>
<p>Northwestern and Yale are my ideal schools, both of which have medieval studies programs in addition, obviously, to history. Both programs are also very competitive, so I'm wondering if I would have a better chance at getting into either of them if I applied for their medieval studies programs rather than history. I'm also planning to apply to Harvard, U Chicago, Texas, Emory, and Wash U in St. Louis. Thoughts on history v. medieval studies or my chances in general? Any schools with strong programs I'm forgetting?</p>
<p>I'm in medieval history. The problem with "medieval studies" and other interdisciplinary degrees is that they are looked upon with quite a bit of skepticism during hiring, no matter where they are from. You may have a medieval studies degree from Yale, but there will be other people applying to the same job with a history degree from Yale. The name doesn't give you an edge.</p>
<p>The big problem with hiring is that many unis will want their hire to be able to teach a few different things within the department. Many job ads will ask for someone who can teach medieval Europe and classes in an additional one or two subfields, such as US, Asia, Africa, etc. With a medieval studies degree, you will not be able to make the case that you can do this. With a history degree, you can use your minor fields to fill these needs.</p>
<p>With a medieval studies degree, you will study the medieval period through several different fields. That's exciting and interesting, but it also means different methodologies. Historians don't want to see research where England is studied through Chaucer. They want to see England studied through primary sources. They may not see you prepared to follow the methodologies of their field.</p>
<p>It's true that a Medieval Studies person may be able to apply for jobs in lit, history, art history, and religion. However, all these fields are ultra-competitive, and a "studies" degree puts you at a serious disadvantage. Being able to apply for more jobs doesn't help you if you won't be considered for any of them.</p>
<p>All this having been said, there are certainly people who come out of these programs and do well on the job market. I just don't think they do as well or have the security that a straight field degree has.</p>
<p>You may want to consider programs that allow you to pursue a history PhD with an extra medieval certification. Berkeley has such a program, and I'm certain there are a couple others, though I can't recall them off the top of my head.</p>
<p>I second everything DespSeekPhd said, especially highlighting that last line:</p>
<p>You may want to consider programs that allow you to pursue a history PhD with an extra medieval certification.</p>
<p>ADD to your PhD, don't restrict it. Interdisciplinary is less powerful than it sounds, mainly because the whole point of a PhD is supposed to be to focus in on one very specific topic/area. The irony is as said above: a "history PhD" sounds a lot more flexible than a "medieval studies PhD," as there's much more demand for variations in chronology within a specific field than there is for variations in topic in a specific chronology.</p>
<p>Thanks! That's pretty much what I had suspected and am looking at schools like Northwestern and Yale because they do have separate medieval studies concentrations in addition to the history PhD. I'm sure this question has been asked ad nauseum, but do I have a reasonable chance of getting into one of the programs at NWU, Yale, Harvard, U Chicago, Texas, Emory, or Wash U in St. Louis? Most of those schools have a medieval studies program that can be completed in conjuction with a history PhD, so I plan to focus on that in my statement of purpose.</p>
<p>I don't think anyone can tell you if you have a reasonable chance for those programs. I'm not being negative or coy, but a lot rests on your GRE, SOP, letters, and fit. Also, you'll need French and German. Not having those may hurt you, but not necessarily.</p>
<p>Have you also considered Notre Dame and Toronto? Both have strong medieval programs. At Toronto, I believe you have to do the MA first, but you can move from the MA to the PhD there if you do well.</p>
<p>I also advise you to add a couple of MA programs. Grad admissions are brutal, and they are getting worse with the downturn in the economy. It will give you a chance to work on languages as well.</p>
<p>Fair enough. My lack of French and German is probably my biggest concern, though I am able to pick up languages pretty easily, I know that most PhD programs prefer them from the get go. Do you think not having them will have a large negative impact on my application? I have looked at Notre Dame, but discounted Toronto due to the necessity of having an MA first. My biggest concern with MA programs is financing - I cannot afford to go into significant debt for graduate school and it seems that most MA programs don't offer funding. I'm definitely willing to consider an MA, provided there's money available. I'm also looking at the M.Litt program at St. Andrew's University as a backup if I don't get into a PhD program - it's a one year taught program with a 15,000 word thesis at the end and would give me a chance to pick up another language.</p>
<p>I've heard tell that there is funding available at Toronto. I'm familiar with the MLitt, but there is no funding for internationals in UK universities (OK, there's a tiny bit, but it's darn near impossible to get). Not having the languages will have a negative impact - it's tough to become conversant enough in two languages in one year (which is usually as much time as you have to take the test) on top of the coursework. There's plenty of people who apply with all three languages, and most of those will have a solid 2-4 years in each language. That doesn't mean you won't get in with what you have, but it does mean that if you don't get into a program, that's one thing you should target immediately.</p>
<p>Elderpegasus, medieval studies aren't really easier to get into. There are a lot of applicants and not as many programs. Yes, there are most applicants for history, but most of those are not applying for medieval. Ultimately, it comes out close to the same. Besides, what does it matter if you've gotten into a program if it hurts you on the job market? It's important to see the big picture. For most people, the PhD is not the endpoint.</p>
<p>Good to know. I'm still going to apply for the history PhD programs and see what happens, then go from there. Worst case, I have to take a gap year, which would give me time to work on the language issue and probably to travel, which wouldn't be a bad thing at all.</p>
<p>I'm a medievalist in English and I did the M.T.S. (Master's in Theological Studies) at Harvard Divinity School in preparation for Ph.D. applications because a) it has significant funding and b) the degree was so flexible that it allowed me to put together a program in medieval religious studies and literature. The program allowed me to spend time on languages and paleography. Moreover, HDS allows you to cross-register into the Arts and Sciences programs, so I took several literature PhD seminars in GSAS and got some strong letters of recommendation from Harvard English and Comp Lit faculty. HDS has since reworked the degree requirements a little bit, so I don't know whether the program is still flexible enough for you to put together a self-designed two-year program. Still, if you have any interest in religious history specifically, I'd suggest that you look into it. (HDS is also vastly less selective than most other grad schools at Harvard and most PhD programs in general, so it can be a great stepping stone institution if you feel that your application is not yet strong enough).</p>
<p>I just checked out the HDS website and the program looks really intriguing. I'm interested in what you mean by 'significant funding' if you don't mind elaborating on that. Also, did you have the opportunity to take multiple languages? My main reason for considering a master's program rather than going directly to a Ph.D. is that I still don't have French and German competancy. I'm quite confident about being accepted to two of the Ph.D. programs I'm applying to, but neither is considered one of the 'top' programs. However, the faculty I've contacted have been nothing but friendly and helpful which is very attractive - I'd much rather go to a less prestigious program with helpful faculty than one of the top programs where I'd have to beg, borrow, and steal to get help.</p>
<p>The program is $20,000 for tuition. I got $10,000 a year for year 1 and $20,000 a year for year 2, so my total cost for the program in tuition was $10,000. It does vary. Funding can be significantly better (up to and including living expenses) if you're from an underrepresented minority group, I think; on the other hand, if you came in debt-free, you might get a little less money, because they take past student debt into account. (I had some.) You could probably call and talk to fin. aid.</p>
<p>I took four semesters of medieval Latin (including a semester of medieval Latin paleography) and a year and a half of Old English. I imagine that you could do a full two years of two languages, although again, they've changed the program, so I can't promise it's still possible. The advantage of the program is that some of the language courses are cross-listed so that they meet other requirements: for instance, a couple of my Latin courses counted for against as Religion and Culture. So I found that it was possible to sneak extra languages into my schedule in that way.</p>
<p>The faculty at HDS is also very warm and supportive for the most part. It has something of a different culture from the rest of the university, I find--not that Harvard on the whole is cold and brutal, just that HDS in particular is a collaborative, personal environment.</p>
<p>I'd like to jump in a little as I'm in a interdisciplinary field (Jewish Studies) and did go through history PhD program applications last year. </p>
<p>Let me sum up how Prof X and other professors convinced me to take the MA route in this ultracompetitive world of PhD admissions. While the idea of spending two extra years doing the MA seems a bit daunting because it seems like postponing your future in the academia. You question yourself if it's worth the cost. Well, the truth is that many PhD programs, especially top ones, are seeing more and more applicants with MA in their hands. Not only did they prove their ablity to succeed in their grad coursework, they have the languages to boot. It's part of the curriculum. They come in with experience and ready to tackle the demands for PhDs- including TA-ing. These are simply the advantages that they have over straight-out-of-undergrads. Not only that, they have their thesis and seminar papers that are expected to be of A-quality for excellent writing samples. Also, as my professors in Jewish Studies mentioned, having that interdisciplinary degree (in your case- Medieval Studies) is a booster in your academic CV showing that not only you can teach in history (if that's what you want to get your PhD in), you can teach other courses that area that aren't offered by the department (like Freshmen Seminars, core courses relating to medieval). So it's a bit like a certificate, just more in-depth and obviously, more money.</p>
<p>But taking out up to $40,000 in loans? (Max allowance for a two year program) It depends how much you want to go to graduate school, get that dream PhD, and be one of the top candidates for tenure-track. It's not really very much- especially if you can do part-time work while getting your MA just to survive (rent, food, etc). It is a bit of a slough especially as you watch the PhD students nab up those TA-ships you'd love to have and get a bit more attention. But at the same time, you're not in the nitty-gritty of things so the demands aren't as high so you have the opportunity to get used to graduate school-especially if the campus environment isn't anything like your undergrad. </p>
<p>Apply to those MA programs on top of the PhD applications- especially as you've said you''re taking that GRE just once, don't have that senoir thesis ready to be used as a writing sample, and don't have the languages. Those were my drawbacks when I applied a year ago- I didn't have my research languages, bombed the GRE twice, and couldn't produce a decent writing sample that really showed my research abilities in time.</p>
<p>Once you get those decisions and acceptance to MA programs, you can, then, decide if it's worth taking the time off and try for straight PhD the following year providing you will work on those languages in the meantime.</p>