Most Frequently Asked Questions Concerning Law School...ANSWERED!

<p>Most Frequently Asked Questions Concerning Law School…ANSWERED! through careful study and derivation of information provided in this forum.</p>

<p>**Useful sites for prospective law students:<a href=“courtesy%20sallyawp”>/B</a>
• [Official</a> Guide](<a href=“http://officialguide.lsac.org%5DOfficial”>http://officialguide.lsac.org)
‘Official guide’ to American Bar Association-approved law schools, with searchable data
• [Legal</a> Education Statistics](<a href=“http://www.abanet.org/legaled/statistics/stats.html]Legal”>http://www.abanet.org/legaled/statistics/stats.html)
ABA legal education statistics
• [Welcome</a> to Brian Leiter’s Law School Rankings](<a href=“http://www.leiterrankings.com/]Welcome”>http://www.leiterrankings.com/)
Leiter’s law-school rankings
• [Federal</a> Appellate Judicial Clerks 2008](<a href=“http://www.lawclerkaddict2008.blogspot.com/]Federal”>http://www.lawclerkaddict2008.blogspot.com/)</p>

<p>**
In what should I major as a “pre-law” student?**</p>

<p>There is no pre-law major; choose any major in which you can seize a high GPA. Law schools accept students from virtually all majors (courtesy:drusba)</p>

<p>[Average</a> LSAT Scores for 29 Majors with over 400 Students Taking the Exam](<a href=“http://www.phil.ufl.edu/ugrad/whatis/LSATtable.html]Average”>http://www.phil.ufl.edu/ugrad/whatis/LSATtable.html)
Link courtesy: BerkeleySenior</p>

<p>Are there any classes I should take as a “pre-law” student?</p>

<p>Try taking a class in basic logic and/or philosophy.

Courtesy: Cardozo</p>

<p>Don’t necessarily try to take any classes about law as preparation for law school, if you do take a class, it is a valuable way to determine if you truly have an interest in the study of law.
**
Should I take pass/fail classes? (courtesy marny1)**</p>

<p>I strongly suggest, you stay away from other pass/fail grades. It may look “suspicious” if you have too many on your transcript.
I would not re-take the classes over. I think that will make it look worse and bring more attention to the situation.
Don’t become too obsessed by feeling you have to stay in the 3.9 GPA range.
a couple of B+/A-'s won’t keep you out of law school. Lots of kids get into top law schools with a 3.6 GPA.
Good luck!!</p>

<p>Should I graduate early? (courtesy bluedevilmike)</p>

<p>If anything, graduating early is frowned upon. Combining that factor with a lower GPA, I promise you law schools will look less favorably on a three-year candidate.</p>

<p>Should I participate in 500 extra-curricular activities? (courtesy bluedevilmike)</p>

<p>EC’s are not completely trivial. But they’re certainly not going to get you into a school where your LSAT is not remotely competitive.
**
What GPA and LSAT score do I need to gain admission to law school?**</p>

<p>Aim for the highest possible: GPA (4.0) and LSAT score (180) Keep in mind that the LSAT is normalized…
For the average score for accepted students at specific law schools, look in the helpful book U.S. News Ultimate Guide to Law Schools.</p>

<p>What is the LSDAS GPA? (courtesy [Career</a> Center - Law School - LSDAS & Transcripts](<a href=“http://career.berkeley.edu/Law/LawLSDAS.stm#4)%5DCareer”>http://career.berkeley.edu/Law/LawLSDAS.stm#4))</p>

<p>Because of the wide range of grading systems used by US colleges and universities, the LSDAS converts records into a standard format. Your LSDAS GPA may be different from your Cal GPA. For example, the LSDAS assigns an A+ a value of 4.3, while at Cal, an A+ is equivalent to 4.0. Since the LSDAS also takes into account all undergraduate coursework taken at other institutions, your LSDAS GPA will probably be different from your Cal GPA if you took classes at other colleges or universities. Detailed information about LSDAS GPA calculations can be found on the LSAC website.</p>

<p>What is counted in the LSDAS GPA? (courtesy im_blue and tifania)</p>

<p>Only classes that were taken before you got your first bachelor’s degree are counted in the LSDAS GPA, including those from high school, summer sessions, and study abroad. That’s why it’s useless to take additional classes after you graduate. Grad school grades are also not counted at all, although the fact that you have a graduate degree may be a small positive factor.</p>

<p>All grades and credits earned for a repeated course will be included in the GPA calculation if the course units and grades appear on the transcript. A line drawn through course information or a grade does not eliminate the course from GPA calculation if the course units appear on the transcript. and
If you do a dual degree program where you get a bachelor’s and a master’s degree at the same time, then those classes also count. All classes before you get your first bachelor’s degree, simple as that.</p>

<p>All college grades regardless of when and where you took them (high school, study abroad, summers).</p>

<p>What is the LSAT? (the following shamefully thieved from Wikipedia)</p>

<p>The LSAT is an examination administered by the Law School Admission Council (LSAC), intended to provide law schools in the United States and Canada with (to quote the LSAC) “a standard measure of acquired reading and verbal reasoning skills that law schools can use as one of several factors in assessing applicants.”</p>

<p>It has five 35 minute sections</p>

<p>The Sections
Reading Comprehension<a href=“RC”>/U</a>
Logical Reasoning <a href=“x2”>/U</a> (LR)
Analytical Reasoning
One Unscored Section <a href=“no%20one%20knows%20which%20is%20the%20unscored%20section.%20If%20you%20count%20more%20than%20one%20RC%20or%20Analytical%20Reasoning%20section,%20one%20of%20those%20is%20the%20unscored%20section;%20likewise%20if%20you%20count%20three%20logical%20reasoning%20sections,%20one%20of%20them%20is%20the%20unscored%20section.%20No%20matter%20what,%20do%20your%20best%20on%20each%20section,%20even%20if%20one%20of%20them%20may%20be%20the%20experiemental/unscored%20section”>/U</a></p>

<p>And one 30 minute section

Writing Sample</p>

<p>The writing sample is given in the form of a decision prompt, which provides the examinee with a problem and two criteria for making a decision. The examinee must then write an essay favoring one of two provided options over the other. The decision generally does not involve a controversial subject, but rather something mundane about which the examinee likely has no strong bias.</p>

<p>The writing sample is NOT SCORED! But is scanned and sent along with your score.</p>

<p>The writing sample is essentially an extemporaneous essay, hand-written in pencil at the conclusion of a four-hour examination. Between the quality of the handwriting and that of the digital image, some admissions officers regard the readability and usefulness of the writing sample as marginal. Additionally, schools require that applicants submit a “personal statement” of some kind. These factors sometimes result in admission boards ignoring the writing sample. However, only 6.8% of 157 schools surveyed by LSAC in 2006 indicated that they “never” use the writing sample when evaluating an application. In contrast, 9.9% of the schools reported that they “always” use the sample; 25.3% reported that they “frequently” use the sample; 32.7% responded “occasionally”; and 25.3% reported “seldom” using the sample.
**
How long does it take to study for the LSAT? (courtesy multiple users…and my input)**</p>

<p>A few months before the exam seems to be the general consensus, keeping in mind that collegiate level analysis in humanities classes prepares one for the Reading Comprehension section, that the logic games for the LSAT must be studied prior to the exam, that out-of-school reading is necessary in order to quicken the rate at which one reads text during the exam, and that one must focus upon one’s GPA in order to get into law school. However, some may study for a year prior to the LSAT. This is acceptable for students who wish to employ a less vigorous study for the LSAT. Keep in mind the QUALITY of your study is more important than the QUANTITY of studying you perform.</p>

<p>Remember the following formula!</p>

<p>Good GPA=learned materials/skills in college=learned skills and gained knowledge for the LSAT=Law School Admission!</p>

<p>How should I study for the LSAT?</p>

<p>[Preparing</a> For the LSAT](<a href=“http://www.unm.edu/~pre/law/lsat_prep.html]Preparing”>http://www.unm.edu/~pre/law/lsat_prep.html)</p>

<p>Books to buy in order to study for the LSAT</p>

<p>NOVA Master the LSAT (best!)
10 Actual, Official LSAT Preptests by LSAC
Powerscore LSAT Logic Games (or Logical Reasoning) Bible(s)</p>

<p>When do I take the LSAT? (courtesy ariesathena)</p>

<p>It is offered four times per year: June, October, December, and February. June is given at 12:30, while the others are at 8:30 am. The test itself runs for 35 min per section, plus 30 min for the writing sample. Now, don’t think of that as three hours - it’s more like six. They check your ID at the door, fingerprint you, have very specific rituals for handing out and returning exams, all that - so it will take the better part of a day. Schedule accordingly (if you hate working past 5 pm, take a morning one - and non-morning people should take it in June).</p>

<p>How do I take the LSAT?</p>

<p>[P</a>. Diddy’s Notes](<a href=“http://www.geocities.com/mobiusnu/pdiddynotes.html]P”>http://www.geocities.com/mobiusnu/pdiddynotes.html)</p>

<p>Refer the the aforementioned study guides for more elaboration.</p>

<p>**Is my LSAT scored good?
**
The lowest score is 120, while the highest score is 180. The higher the better!!! For average LSAT scores of accepted students at specific law schools, read U.S. News Ultimate Guide to Law School</p>

<p>See the LSAT Percentile Scale → [PowerScore</a> | LSAT Help | LSAT Scoring Scale](<a href=“Page Not Found”>http://www.powerscore.com/lsat/help/scale.htm)</p>

<p>Should I take the LSAT more than once? (courtesy sallyawp)</p>

<p>The following information is derived from the following law schools’ websites:</p>

<ol>
<li>Harvard Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
Should I retake the LSAT? If you take the test more than once, all scores and their average will be reported and considered.</p>

<ol>
<li>Georgetown Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
For reporting purposes, Georgetown adheres to the ABA policy of reporting the higher LSAT score. For evaluation purposes, the Georgetown Admissions Committee typically averages LSAT scores. Georgetown may consider the higher LSAT score if you have only taken the LSAT twice. Please address any mitigating circumstances you feel the Admissions Committee should consider.</p>

<ol>
<li>Columbia Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
Even though the ABA requires that we report the highest LSAT score, the Committee considers the entire LSAT testing history when evaluating applications for admission. Published statistics for this and prior years were based on average LSAT scores.</p>

<ol>
<li>NYU Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
If I take the LSAT more than once, does the Committee see the higher score?
Yes, but they evaluate based on the average score in most cases. The Committee may take special circumstances into account. If a candidate can point out specific reasons why the Committee should consider an LSAT score aberrant, they should detail those reasons in an addendum to the personal statement.</p>

<ol>
<li>Penn Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
Q. If I take the LSAT more than once, does the Admissions Committee consider the average or the higher LSAT score?
If there are circumstances that you believe affected your performance on a prior test, we encourage you to provide an additional statement with your application explaining those circumstances. The Admissions Committee will consider such information and may, at its discretion, evaluate your application based on the higher or highest LSAT score.</p>

<ol>
<li>U of Chicago Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
What if I took the LSAT more than once? We recognize that some students will take the LSAT more than once, perhaps because the first score was the product of unusual conditions or because it seemed low given earlier practice test scores. In keeping with recent changes in LSAC and ABA policies, we will focus on the higher of an applicant’s two scores. LSAC data suggest that the first score is an excellent predictor of a second score; applicants are thus advised to re-take the test only if there is reason to expect significant improvement. We certainly do not wish to encourage expenditures on repeat test taking.</p>

<ol>
<li>U of Michigan Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
How does the University of Michigan Law School handle multiple LSAT scores?
The LSDAS report for an applicant who has sat for the LSAT more than once will show every score or cancellation, as well as the average score. The ABA requires law schools to report score information based on an admitted student’s highest score, and therefore, that is the score to which we give the most weight. We do, however, consider the average score as well, because data provided by the Law School Admissions Council suggests that it has the greatest predictive utility. If you have a significant disparity between scores (six or more points), it would be very helpful to address any explanation for the difference in an optional essay or addendum.</p>

<ol>
<li>U of Virginia Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
What is your policy on multiple LSAT scores?
Multiple LSAT scores will be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. We do not automatically use the average, the highest, or the most recent score, but will evaluate any information provided by the applicant that may be relevant to the interpretation of test results, such as illness, testing conditions, or other extenuating circumstances. The recent change to the ABA rule regarding multiple test scores affects only how we report the LSAT score of an applicant who took the LSAT more than once. The old rule required that law schools report the average of multiple scores; the revised rule now asks law schools to report the higher of multiple scores. The ABA rule does not now, nor did it ever, tell law schools to rely on one score over another in making admissions decisions, but rather encourages schools to look comprehensively at all information presented in an application for admission. That practice has not changed.</p>

<ol>
<li>Northwestern Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
All applicants are required to take the LSAT. The LSAT is administered in June, October, December, and February. Applicants may take the test more than once, but repetition is not advised unless some disruptive factor has interfered with performance during the first administration. If an applicant takes the LSAT more than once, the Admission Committee will consider all scores, the circumstances surrounding each test experience, and possible benefits resulting from prior exposure to the test. Test results are sent to the Law School by the Law School Admission Council. According to LSAC, scores are valid for five years after the test date.</p>

<ol>
<li>Cornell Law School:</li>
</ol>

<p>Quote:
If I take the LSAT more than once, will you take the highest score or the average of the scores?
In general, Cornell Law’s policy is to take the higher score if it is at least 3 points higher than a prior score, but the Admissions Committee invites applicants to submit an addendum to their application explaining the different LSAT scores and why we should take the higher score.</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Duke Law School - no comment made on website</p></li>
<li><p>Boalt - takes the highest (I’m sure someone can find the quote, if necessary)</p></li>
<li><p>Yale - no comment made on website, school still states that they use a holistic approach to admissions</p></li>
<li><p>Stanford - makes no comment on website</p></li>
</ol>

<p>Moreover, the takeaway seems to be that if you take the LSAT more than once, you had better have a good reason for doing so (102 degree fever, power outage at the testing location, death in the family, etc.) and you had better take some time to explain that reason in your application. Again, I emphasize that you should prepare for and go into the LSAT as if you are going to take the test once and only once. Having explanations for one thing or another on your application, instead of just having a strong application, diverts attention from your strengths and may lead to questions about your ability and/or your commitment.</p>

<p>The LSAC has repeatedly emphasized to law schools that your first LSAT is the test most likely to predict your success in law school, and I think that most of the top law schools are clearly keeping that advice in mind. You may take the LSAT more than once (in fact, up to three times in two years), but I believe that you do so to your detriment in admissions.</p>

<p>Which is the best law school? (shamefully stolen from Wikipedia)</p>

<p>Schools that consistently rank in the top 14.</p>

<p>The “Top Fourteen” schools according to US News and World Report Rankings are (in alphabetical order):</p>

<pre><code>* Columbia Law School, Columbia University, in New York, NY.

  • Cornell Law School, Cornell University, in Ithaca, NY.
  • Duke University School of Law, Duke University, in Durham, NC.
  • Georgetown University Law Center, Georgetown University, in Washington, DC.
  • Harvard Law School, Harvard University, in Cambridge, MA.
  • New York University School of Law, New York University, in New York, NY.
  • Northwestern University School of Law, Northwestern University, in Chicago, IL.
  • Stanford Law School, Stanford University, in Stanford, CA.
  • University of California, Berkeley, School of Law, University of California, Berkeley, in Berkeley, CA.
  • University of Chicago Law School, University of Chicago, in Chicago, IL.
  • University of Michigan Law School, University of Michigan, in Ann Arbor, MI.
  • University of Pennsylvania Law School, University of Pennsylvania, in Philadelphia, PA.
  • University of Virginia School of Law, University of Virginia, in Charlottesville, VA.
  • Yale Law School, Yale University, in New Haven, CT.
    </code></pre>

<p>Do the T-14 schools really make a difference? (courtesy LaxAttack09, stacy, and brand_182)</p>

<p>Yes…if you define exit opportunities and job after graduation with $$ (which most people do) then most certainly so. Firms (the one that pay the big $$) will dip much lower into NYU’s class then, say, Notre Dame. While it may be possible to get that 160k job out of Notre Dame, you’re gonna have to finish top 10% for it to be almost guaranteed. Whereas if you go to NYU, you’re almost guaranteed a job like that if you finish in the top 75%. Now, is there a difference between Georgetown (14) and texas/la/sc/vandy (15-20 range)? A little, but not as much. Georgetown is seen as a “national” school, whereas many of the schools after Georgetown at 14 are seen as more regional schools.</p>

<p>Yes. T14 schools have more recruiters from more firms, place more students in clerkships and public interest fellowships, and have alums in a larger number of prestigious positions. while it’s possible for grads of any law school to get jobs, most employers will go “deeper” into the pool of T14 students (ie, they might interview only the top 10% of students at a lower-ranked school, and all students at a T14). T14s also tend to have better public interest loan repayment programs than lower-ranked schools.</p>

<p>The difference between T14 and a top 25 school or something is pretty minor, but if you can get into a T14 I’d think twice about going to a much lower-ranked school, unless:</p>

<p>a) the lower-ranked school is in a city or town that you’re positive you’d like to stay in (ie, if you know you want to work in Montana, the university there would be a better choice than almost anywhere else)
b) you’re very sure you don’t want a firm job, a clerkship, or a job as a professor or judge, AND the T14 to which you’ve been admitted doesn’t have a good loan repayment program, AND the lower-ranked school has given you a huge scholarship.</p>

<p>Judging by the average salary/job placement/bar pass rate of T14 schools, I’d argue that going to a T14 does give one significant advantages. I do, however, think the T14 can be too limited a scope as there are schools outside of it (UT, USC, Vanderbilt, GWU, etc.) that place well and are well regarded. At the same time, where you received your JD seems to be far more important than where you received your BA in the profession of law so there would have to be some pretty big incentives to make me pick a non T14 over a T14.</p>

<p>To how many law schools should I apply? (courtesy im_blue)</p>

<p>The best and worst applicants have the fewest schools to consider. Someone with T-14 numbers may choose to apply only to T-14 schools with 1 or 2 safeties, while someone with 3rd or 4th tier numbers should apply to the few schools in the area they wish to practice in. The people applying to 30 schools are those just below the cusp of the T-14, who apply to most of them as reach schools, several semi-national schools in the T-25, and a few regional safeties. Of course, there are always some people who overapply to reaches and safeties.
**
How hard is it to get into Law School? (courtesy Milton Roark and sakky)**</p>

<p>It depends, If you’re a good student and you prep for the LSAT then it is not incredibly hard to get into a law school. Here is some data from U.S. News’s Ultimate guide to law schools: the least selective law school has a 25th-75th Percentile GPA range of 2.58-3.23 and an LSAT range of 144-149. I believe that if you are a good student and prep for the LSAT then you can get into a law school.</p>

<p>Acceptances into California Law Schools and Top Law Schools → [Career</a> Center - Profile of Law School Admissions - UC Berkeley](<a href=“http://career.berkeley.edu/Law/lawStats.stm#school]Career”>http://career.berkeley.edu/Law/lawStats.stm#school)</p>

<p>What are the admission factors for law school? (courtesy jonri, sallyawp and hayden)</p>

<p>Law schools can do whatever they want in terms of admitting people and there’s really not one way they all do it. But keep in mind that law schools don’t have varsity athletic teams and orchestras, newspapers, intramurals, etc. except those organized by students just for fun. Perhaps even more importantly, everyone "“majors” in the same subject. There is no need to admit some classics majors, some pre-meds, some English types, etc. The end result is that you can forget the undergraduate admissions model for top schools that you are used to.</p>

<p>My own take is that about 80% of law school admissions is about two numbers:LSAT and GPA. How much weight each law school gives to these two factors varies a bit among law schools. Everything else counts about 20%. Roughly half of that 20% is made up of factors you have no control over: URM status, legacy status, celebrity/develpmental admits, geographic diversity or in-state preference (depending on whether it’s a regional school trying to become more national or a state U.) (That’s not an exhaustive list.)</p>

<p>All the rest–how early in the admissions cycle you apply, the college you attended, your LORs, your recs, your work experience, military service, community service, your ECs, the difficulty of your course work, etc.–make up about 10% FOR MOST people.</p>

<p>Are there exceptions when these can count more? Yes. But two years of work experience and good LORs from two profs aren’t going to get someone with a gpa and LSAT score at the 25th percentile into a top law school.</p>

<p>MOST of the time at most–not all, but most–law schools, if your LSAT and GPA are both above the 75th percentile, you’ll get in. However, it is also true --and isn’t, IMO appreciated enough on this board–that you can shoot yourself in the foot even if you have perfect #s. Blow off the personal statement or submit two LORs that say “he took my class; he got a good grade” and you can–despite near perfect #s–be rejected, especially at the law schools at the top of the totem pole. But the converse really isn’t true–all those other things can’t make up for weak #s unless they are extraordinary.</p>

<p>When your GPA and LSAT are within the 25/75% range, other factors come into play. My observation (which is purely anecdotal) is that when you are in the 50%-75% zone at top 14 schools, you need SOMETHING else. It doesn’t have to be extraordinary, but if you don’t have some ECs or work experience or internships, you aren’t going to get in UNLESS you are above the 75th percentile (and even that won’t work at Yale and Stanford.) But it doesn’t have to be anything outstanding. When you are in the 25-50% zone, then the other things will matter more–and they do have to be significant. For example, if you played a Division I sport, you’ll get cut some slack on the gpa, especially if you have a good LSAT.</p>

<p>Remember to that it varies a bit among law schools–Northwestern, for example, weighs work experience more heavily than most other law schools.

Let’s not overgeneralize here, though. It is quite clear that generally, if you don’t have a high enough GPA and strong enough LSAT scores, your probability of getting into a T14 law school is greatly diminished. However, simply having a high GPA and strong LSAT scores does not guarantee you admission to a top law school. For example, having a 3.7 GPA and a 170 on your LSATs puts you squarely within the category of people that is likely to be admitted to one or more T14 law schools, but there are many others with similar qualifications vying for spots in T14 entering classes.</p>

<p>You need to make yourself stand out – and not in a negative way. Your application needs to be clean, neat, spell-checked and free of typos. You need to have a well written, thoughtful (and again, spell-checked and free of typos) personal statement, even if it isn’t the kind of essay that would knock someone’s socks off (though that could only help). Don’t underestimate how important these factors are.</p>

<p>You also need some decent recommendations and a few things on your resume that show that you didn’t spend your four years of college locked away in a library or a lab. Try to show that you are not socially inept. The stronger your activities, leadership positions, work experience, recommendations, etc. are, the more likely you are to make an impression on someone whose voice matters in the admissions process. Are over-the-top, stellar activities and recommendations absolutely necessary? Perhaps not – but the absence of activities and mediocre recommendations could kill an otherwise stellar-on-the-numbers application. Admissions professionals have to make assumptions about who a person is and how likely they are to add to the classroom discourse, law school community and ultimately, to succeed in the legal profession, from a few pages of writing. Do you want to have negative inferences drawn because you had nothing to offer other than a high LSAT score? I wouldn’t.
…</p>

<p>Don’t get arrested. A good idea, of course, even if you don’t plan on law school . . . .</p>

<p>Questions about Recommendation Letters (courtesy Student615 and massguy)</p>

<p>Is the number of recommendations important?</p>

<p>LSAC has a list of every law school and how many letters they require/prefer/accept (the list definitely has require/accept, and I <em>think</em> it sometimes has prefer, but I’m not positive). I had three b/c they were all from people who knew me in very different ways, and they were all pretty different recs. I would definitely say that it’s better to have two great recs than two great and one or two “fine” (not b/c they don’t say good things about you, but because they don’t really add anything). Having talked to other (non-law) admissions reps, they just want a well-rounded picture of you, and they don’t want redundancy.

Should I inconvenience new professors if I think they might be better positioned to write me a letter?</p>

<p>Yes. In general, writing recommendations is part of being a professor. And on top of that, the LSAC LOR service makes the whole process pretty painless, relative to those of other grad programs. They won’t have to fill out any paperwork/worksheets for each school…just one letter, sent to one place, by one pretty flexible deadline (if a LOR arrives after you’ve applied to a school, LSAC will sent an updated report to that school). If you plan to ask each professor to write directed, rather than general letters, then the process will be a bit more involved, but this shouldn’t be necessary in too many cases. Regardless, yes…get the best rec letters you can. Just ease the process as much as possible: plenty of advance notice, pre-addressed/stamped envelopes, polite reminders/follow-ups, a nice thank you, and so forth.</p>

<p>Do I need a letter from someone in my current program?</p>

<p>No idea, but my guess is no. Usually you’re told to get recs from people who know you well, and you’re told that academic recs are strongly desired, most important, or whatever (b/c presumably, people who know you in an academic setting can best address your potential as a law student). Whether this person is from undergrad or your current program is probably not an issue, although I suppose some schools could specify otherwise. Each application will let you know, so look through apps when they come out in the fall. This’ll still give you more than plenty of time to notify your recommenders.</p>

<p>If its an allied field, it probably would be to your benefit, though I can imagine some types of graduate work which might be less likely to point to your success in law school. If thats the case, you probably shouldn’t feel compelled to do so.</p>

<p>Where can I go for an accelerated law program?</p>

<p>Contact the school ASAP to confirm information and determine qualifications!!!</p>

<p>Five Year
London School of Economics and Columbia University or University of South Carolina</p>

<p>Six Year
Union College and Albany Law School
Russell Sage College and Albany Law School
St. Rose and Albany Law School
SUNY and Albany Law School
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute and Albany Law School
The George Washington University
Columbia University
Adelphi University and New York Law School
Suffolk University
Whitman College and Columbia Law School
Hamilton College and Columbia Law School
Rice University and Columbia Law School
Georgetown University and Georgetown Law School (no LSAT)
Fordham College and Fordham School of Law
Drake University and Drake School of Law
Seton Hill University and Duquesne University or New Jersey Institute of Technology
Stephens College and University of Missouri–Columbia
Whittier College and Whittier Law School
Saint Vincent College and Duquesne University
University of San Francisco and University San Francisco School of Law
Albany College of Pharmacy
University of Arkansas
Catholic University
Creighton University with their School of Business
Franklin Pierce and Penn State (Eberly School of Science)
Hamline University - only legal studies ungrad majors
University of Idaho
Illinois Institute of Technology
John Marshall Law School (IL) and Roosevelt University (IL)
Loyola University Chicago
Loyola University New Orleans
Marquette University
University of Maryland with University System of Maryland Schools
James Madison College, College of Arts & Letters or Grand Valley State University Seidman College of Business and Michigan State University School of Law
Mississippi College and Mississippi College of Law
Nova Southeastern University
University of Nebraska
Pace University
Penn State Schreyer’s Honors College or Dickinson College and Penn State Dickinson School of Law
University of the Pacific
University of Pittsburgh
University of Richmond
Roger Williams
Univerity of South Dakota
St. John’s University and 35 HBCU’s associated w/United Negro College Fund and St. John’s University of Law
St. Thomas University (FL)
Stetson University
Texas Tech University
Tulane
University of Tulsa
Vermont
Washington & Lee University
Western New England and Western New England School of Law or St. Joseph’s College (Hartford, CT)
Widener University the 14 PA State and Widener University School of Law</p>

<p>Different Type of Six Year
Western New England College (biomedical engineering degree and law school)
The School of Law-Newark and the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey-New Jersey Medical School (for JD and MD in six years ONLY…not undergrad)
–LSAT and MCAT required–</p>

<p>Seven Year
Temple University</p>

<p>What are some different fields of law? (courtesy dadofsam)</p>

<p>Litigation/trial lawyers, especially criminal trial lawyers, are about the only field of law that most people are acquainted with, since most other fields of law lack the drama to be the subject of television shows, movies or plays. However, most lawyers don’t work in those fields.</p>

<p>“Corporate law” is a name generally given to working for large companies, either as an attorney employed by a large company, or in a law firm working for large company clients. It has many sub-areas.
Practically all fields of law have no connection to subjects taught in college, although in a number of areas of law material learned in college can be useful at least as background knowledge.</p>

<p>Some fields of law are family law (marriages, divorces, adoptions, etc.), bankruptcy law, real estate law, general business or contract law, environmental law, medical and other malpractice law, public health law, administrative law (law involving government agencies and how to deal with them), maritime law, space law, insurance law, estate planning (wills, for instance) - and there are others.
**
What is a job in law like? (courtesy unbelievablem)**</p>

<p>The actual practice of law involves a lot of mundane procedures and documents. It involves dealing with clients who are not always reasonable. It involves dealing with senior attorneys who direct your life (for how long depends on the type of practice you enter). It involves dealing with billing. It involves deadlines. It involves dealing with other attorneys - sometimes in adversarial situations, sometimes not - and many of these other lawyers will be people who thrive on confrontation, argument, and strong opinions.</p>

<p>What you found least appealing - the anxiety - may the aspect that is most typical of the practice of law. There is a lot of pressure. Whether it is imposed from the client, the partner, the court, the government agency, whatever, there is a lot of pressure. People who do well in the practice of law are often those who find that pressure invigorating, who see is as a challenge and thrive on it.</p>

<p>How Much Money Do Lawyers Make? (courtesy s1185)</p>

<p>[Empirical</a> Legal Studies: Distribution of 2006 Starting Salaries: Best Graphic Chart of the Year](<a href=“http://www.elsblog.org/the_empirical_legal_studi/2007/09/distribution-of.html]Empirical”>http://www.elsblog.org/the_empirical_legal_studi/2007/09/distribution-of.html)</p>

<p>What are the qualifications needed to obtain a job as a lawyer? (courtesy dadofsam)</p>

<p>When you apply for a position in law, whether it’s a summer associate spot or a full-time associate, you have certain qualifications.
If you have not worked much, have been mainly a student since kindergarten, you have only four or five areas of qualifications:

  1. law school grades,
  2. law school class standing,
  3. the law school itself (maybe),
  4. possible extra efforts such as being on law review, or another journal or a competitive moot court team and
  5. possible extraneous work such as in a legal clinic.</p>

<p>Lack of any of these, such as a so-so GPA, can mean an overall lack of a major category of your resume. So, especially as a student or recent graduate, your grades are very important. Later in life, your experience and, if you are private practice, your ability to generate business, becomes much more important than any of these.</p>

<p>Is it realistic to believe that going to law school will give me the knowledge to help with international human rights issues? (courtesy sallyawp)</p>

<p>It is realistic to believe that there are international human rights jobs which require a law degree and the knowledge acquired in law school. However, these jobs are exceedingly hard to come by–a lot of people go into law school wanting to do “international human rights work” so there’s a lot of competition. If you want to work for Amnesty or a similar organization, I’d look at their employment pages and see what qualifications are required for the jobs you’d like–the answer may surprise you, because it may not be a law degree! (oh, and just by the way, working for Amnesty is definitely NOT a great way to smooth your path to becoming a judge. you might want to look into what supreme and circuit court judges were doing prior to their nominations).</p>

<p>Is it a waste of money to get a law degree and not to be a big law lawyer? (courtesy sallyawp)</p>

<p>Well, yes, in the sense that there are shorter/cheaper educational programs that will prepare you for jobs that pay just as much as being a lawyer at a small firm or nonprofit. But people make decisions that “waste” money all the time: not everyone goes into the field that could maximize their earning potential. They have kids (HUGE waste of money or buy a fancy car or take up scuba diving. Why? Because they get some joy or status out of it that is worth more to them than having the money in their bank account. If, in your mind, non-firm job + the constraints of a lower salary > firm job + opportunities provided by a higher salary, then it may make sense to take a job elsewhere. Plus, it’s not an either-or thing…people switch among firms, in-house, government, non-profit jobs throughout their careers.</p>

<p>so if i took classes during summer school from a local community college separate from the university i will graduate from, i still have to send those transcripts in and those grades will be counted in the gpa?</p>

<p>if so, do all classes taken at a college during summers before you attended a university (say during junior year of high school) count as well?</p>

<p>Yes, yes, and yes.</p>

<p>just want to thank you embroglio for compiling alot of good info into one place.</p>

<p>What about an AP course taken in high school (in a high school building, not community college) but that counts as dual credit at a community college? Would that count towards the LSDAS GPA too?</p>

<p>FAQ citation score: sallyawp 5 bluedevilmike 2 dadofsam 2 im_blue 2 Bit of an upset I think, I would've chosen bluedevilmike as the clear frontrunner in FAQ answers and any law school question in general, but embroglio's study seems to show different. No worries mike, you're still #1 in my book. To answer your question sanjenferrer, I'm almost positive the AP class counts, assuming you passed the test of course and reported it to your college.</p>

<p>What exactly do public health lawyers do? Do they do the same as global health lawyers?</p>

<p>are the grades from the ap class or the scores on the ap exam calculated into the gpa?</p>

<p>Never the grades, maybe the scores depending on whether or not the scores are recorded on your university transcript. If they are recorded on your transcript, then the scores of 3=C=2.0, a 4=B=3.0, a 5=A=4.0. </p>

<p>However most universities report only the units earned, and not the scores on the transcript. In this case LSDAS does not calculate AP scores into its GPA but they do show up as unconverted credit hours.</p>

<p>I did not take the AP exam at the end. I did not use any AP credits to advance my standing in college. So the grades will not count but the credits will be reported (the grades themselves counted for dual high school/college credit even without exam scores)?</p>

<p>AP credit only affects the calculated GPA if your university assigns a letter grade. If they simply report the number of credits, APs don't matter. Even if they report the scores without imputing a grade, they still don't matter. Berkeley Senior's conversion (5-A, 4-B, and so on) is not supported by the LSAC guide.</p>

<p>This is from the LSAC pdf: <a href="http://www.lsat.org/pdfs/2008-2009/InformationBook08web.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.lsat.org/pdfs/2008-2009/InformationBook08web.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>Advanced Placement (AP) or College Level
Examination Programs (CLEP)
AP or CLEP courses are summarized and
included in the GPA if the undergraduate
school transcript shows grades and credits
for them. (See “Unconverted Credit Hours”
below for transcripts showing credits but
no grades.)</p>

<p>I assumed grades meant the scores themselves in the pdf and in the context of The Brian's question that grades meant the actual letter grade in the courses, as opposed to the AP exam score. You should call LSAC for a clarification to see what they mean by "grades." Most universities do not report the scores, but merely assign credits.</p>

<p>Sanjenferrer: Your situation is different from most because the grades themselves counted for college credit even without the scores. I don't know your entire situation but it seems that if the grades themselves (without the scores) counted as college credit, they may be included in the LSAC GPA if they are shown on the transcript. You should call LSAC to clarify. (215)968-1128</p>

<p>the ap scores or grades on my college transcript are not recorded and only the credits earned are shown. therefore, they should go under the "unconverted credit hours", correct?</p>

<p>however, on my same college transcript, the summer session grades I earned from a community college are also not graded and only the credits earned are shown. does this mean law schools will only count this under the "unconverted credit hours" as well?</p>

<p>^ The AP credits should be unconverted credit hours.</p>

<p>You have to send a transcript from the community college to LSDAS, so they will be counted.</p>

<p>Thanks for all the great info! Almost everything is covered in this post! Thanks!</p>

<p>Bump, and can we get this to stay at the top of the category. This is an excellent resource.</p>

<p>I started out at a cc and have a couple of really remedial classes on the transcripts that I barley made it through with c's in. Are they going to count this against me? Granted I was 18 at the time. Also I have like 20 units of cc PE classes that I got A’s in. But it seems kind of stupid to put to much emphasis of cc classes at all! Is it really all a numbers game for the GPA, they truly don’t care what classes you take or about your major? Because if that is true after I finish my core classes in one more quarter for my major. This sounds bad but I can spend the next three quarters taking easy classes just to get A’s and boost my 3.4 GPA to nearly a 4.00. Basically what I am asking, do the admissions committees care more if the classes are challenging and you earn a 3.4 GPA or if the classes are easy and you earn a 4.00 GPA. From what I have been reading they would be more likely to accept a student with higher grades with an easy major than one with a more challenging major or courses?</p>

<p>Yes. Most college freshmen are 18. They care a little bit about what classes you take, where you take them, and what major they are in, but not an awful lot -- i.e. it is unlikely to compensate for large GPA differences. If you have already finished five quarters of school, you are unlikely to be able to pull a 3.4 to a near-4.0 in three more quarters.</p>

<p>I am returning to school as an adult student (38 years old) with military (USMC) and work (15 years at a top Finance firm) experience. I hold the majority of licenses for investment planners (series 7, 6, 63, etc) but have no college experience. I worked into a regional position for my firm but have been told my lack of a degree prevents any further promotions. If I am going back to school I intend to change professions entirely and will pursue a law degree.
Here is the dilemma: The quickest way for me to get a degree is thru Western Governors University. It is designed for adults returning to school and each class is pass/fail as determined by either an examination or essay or combination. I believe I can get a degree in 1 year here versus 3-4 years in a traditional school but the grades do not convert to the standard 4.0 GPA scale. My practice LSAT scores are currently coming in around 170 so those should easily be top quartile by the time I test next year. Do you have any idea how the top schools will evaluate a BS from a fully accredited school (Northwest Commission on Colleges and Universities) that does not convert to the traditional GPA system?</p>

<p>steve- I don’t think anyone on these boards can give you an accurate answer. Your situation does sound unique.
I would suggest you contact Western Governors to find out how similar situations have been handled–contact LSAC and see if they can give you some insight into the situation and also contact an admission office at one or two law schools and see how they view it.
It seems plausible that UG grades might have less signifigance with your background and a solid LSAT score- but I don’t think anyone on these boards can give you a definitive answer. And I don’t think you want to waste 1 vs. 4 years getting an UG degree, if the Western Governors program is viable.
Best of luck to you.</p>