<p>Welcome to UBMusic and guitardad!</p>
<p>UBMusic: What can you share about UB's undergraduate music history and performance (particularly violin?) We have been looking for the right SUNY to add to my D's list....</p>
<p>Guitardad -- Glad you've joined us class of '08 parents for what promises to be an interesting year for our musical kids!</p>
<p>Orchestramom - We have a really interesting musicology/history program - different from some of the more Ivy league schools like Yale because we are extremely accepting of students that want to study either new music/popular music or more traditional history. Unfortunately Peter Schmeltz just moved to WashU, but we're getting a new faculty member from UCLA, she's young and spunky, sure to be a great addition - she'll probably be the one teaching the popular music courses. Michael Long is also a great teacher, his current focus is film music but is also very knowledgeable about Renaissance. Also James Currie is great, very dynamic teacher, keeps high expectations of his students, he's focused more on 19th century music. </p>
<p>As far as violin goes, Movses Pogossian is the resident violin instructor. I've seen him in performance a few times, he's really dynamic. You can read all his detailed info here <a href="http://www.music.buffalo.edu/faculty/pogossian/index.shtml%5B/url%5D">http://www.music.buffalo.edu/faculty/pogossian/index.shtml</a></p>
<p>I will tell you that rarely do grad students give lessons at UB. We have a small community so the students get individual attention from their teachers, definitely a bonus.</p>
<p>Regarding our orchestra, Christian Baldini is just taking over the direction. He was the director of the new music ensemble last year. I was at their performance, it was very good, but I haven't heard much about how he interacts with students. I can tell you he's younger, and pleasant to chat with.</p>
<p>As far as your D's major, she'd have to eventually choose between a BM or BA. The BM would be more performance based, and the BA would be a history/theory track. Just keep in mind that we try very hard to mix the two very well, so she'll never be lacking in any elements in one or the other. More info on degree tracks can be found here. <a href="http://www.music.buffalo.edu/degrees/index.shtml%5B/url%5D">http://www.music.buffalo.edu/degrees/index.shtml</a></p>
<p>Hope this answers your questions, if you have any more please feel free to email me at sbailey4 at buffalo.edu. </p>
<p>Good luck with your D's apps!</p>
<p>BUMusic,
thanks so much! We'd spent a little time at the website, and your information is really helpful. We're going to try to visit in early fall. O-mom</p>
<p>I have devoured lots of very helpful information from this site in the past few days - and am still finding my way around. This comes not a moment too soon. My son who will be a senior this year plans to major in music performance. He has done tons of great research and planning, but I am really glad to know there are parents to bounce around parent perspective communication as we venture into the year. What a needed support to the whole college process!</p>
<p>orchestramom- If you're looking at the SUNY's, don't forget to peek at Potsdam (Crane), Purchase, Fredonia, and Stony Brook. Each tends to have either a good broad based program like Purchase (conservatory type of program), Crane for music ed, Stony Brook for some specific strengths (chamber with Emerson). My son recently played with a few violinists from Fredonia at a festival and commented very positively about their musicianship.</p>
<p>Hi all. S is a rising junior who plays jazz drums. He's played since he was 6. I think he is currently interested in a music major/possibly a double major in another academic area at a liberal arts college. The conductor of our local city-wide youth jazz orchestra, where son is one of two drummers, thinks he could make a living playing music. His parents, ahem, are in awe of his ability, as we can barely carry a tune in the shower! He also has played for five years as a percussionist in the local city youth symphony, and plays for our very small high school jazz and regular bands. He has traveled internationally with the youth orchestra two summers, attended a jazz camp three or four summers, and is a good student (3.9 ish unweighted). Also plays soccer, mock trial. And I am so grateful for CC, because there are so many people much smarter than I who can help us figure out how to navigate the application process. We just launched his brother, happily, so we know the regular admissions route. I am very confused about where the best jazz programs are in non-conservatory schools. Another wrinkle is he has just begun learning music theory over the past year, as he only read rhythm, not notes. He is teaching himself to play the bass, and is taking some theory lessons this summer. Yikes. At any rate, thank you wise parents of musical children, for your active sharing of your knowledge!</p>
<p>Welcome SJTH!</p>
<p>Violadad -- thanks, we have looked at the SUNYs you suggest but, like Goldilocks' porridge, none are "just right." Coincidentally, my D had started researching SUNY Buffalo a few weeks ago, so I was really glad to get the extra insight when UBMusic joined this forum. </p>
<p>We are so lucky to have the collective resources of everyone sharing here!</p>
<p>Thenosam - Can you tell us more about your S? What instrument? Does he have any favorite schools yet? Is he looking to go conservatory or traditional college?</p>
<p>SJTH - I take it your S does not play any of the "keyboard" percussion instruments, such as bells, xylophone, etc? If he can fit it in his schedule, a few piano lessons would do wonders for his note-reading.</p>
<p>SJTH, I sent you a PM! Check the box on the top right of your screen!</p>
<p>My son plays the double bass. He is a senior. I think he is trying to narrow down his college list, but last I have heard is Rice, Curtis, CIM, Colburn, BU, UNT, and maybe Indiana. I hope he can narrow this down some...no audition scholarships, right???<br>
He is looking for a great music school/conservatory, but he doesn't want to owe a lot in the end. We will have three in college when he starts, and one more to go. It looks like grad school for all, too. Good luck to us! I'm not sure of his chances. He works very hard and loves to do it. I am welcoming any insight.</p>
<p>I like the list, thenosam. Only 7 schools - not so much for a performance major applying to tough schools. I am assuming from the list that he is a top notch player, and those are top schools. I don't know anything about Colburn. For a top player, I would expect BU and UNT to be a bit "safer" than the others (though no audition school can be truly safe). </p>
<p>You're right - no audition scholarships. Auditioning is expensive, especially if you are traveling with a big instrument - do double bass players have to take their own instruments? (I know, probably a stupid question. But I play piano, and nobody makes me bring my own. :) ) It is just one of those "swallow hard" situations - you do what you have to do.</p>
<p>CIM is pretty stingy with merit - they have a smaller endowment. Rice is generally listed on the "good value" lists, so I think they are pretty generous. (And closer to you - driving distance?) With several in school, unless you are independently wealthy, you should qualify for need-based aid. Except for CIM, I would expect most of those schools to offer full or partial need-based grants rather than loans. Of course, Curtis is free tuition. Apartment living in Philly can be expensive, but kids generally end up sharing, so it's manageable. Curtis will give need-based aid for living expenses for kids who qualify. The reality is that you just don't know till results come in in April (or sooner) what kind of financial aid you will get. How much need a school meets often depends on how bad they want you!</p>
<p>I notice no NYC schools on the list. Is he (or you) against NYC in general, or do they just not have the teachers he wants? The reason I ask is that the Curtis auditions are usually held on consecutive days with Juilliard, Manhattan, and (I think) Mannes. We took the train from Philly to NYC, and it was cheaper doing several auditions in one weekend than individual trips.</p>
<p>S2 didn't apply to any Boston schools, but there again, there may be consecutive auditions - I don't know. (Like with Boston Conservatory or NEC.) Only thinking this way to save money on travelling - certainly no bargain if he has no interest in attending!</p>
<p>
[quote]
I'm not sure of his chances.
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None of us ever is! Success depends on talent, work ethic, and alignment of the stars. </p>
<p>Although there are no guarantees, there are ways to have a clue. Are his teachers suggesting these schools? Is he winning competitions or top chairs in student orchestras? Has he visited any of these teachers/schools and gotten positive feedback? Does he seem to be outgrowing community resources?</p>
<p>thenosam- as binx said, it seems a well rounded list. Curtis and Colburn are really "reaches" for almost anybody, including those at the top of the performance food chain, but the free tuition makes it worth it if he can audition competitively.</p>
<p>Sometimes being a big fish in a smaller pond can really work to your advantage financially for audition based merit aid. Depending upon exactly what he's looking for in a program and instructor, it might make sense to look at places like Oberlin, maybe even Hartt. BassDad's D is bass performance at Oberlin and he's the resident expert. I mention Hartt as Robert Black is the bass professor and from our experience with son (BM viola '07) they were generous with talent aid.</p>
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<blockquote> <p>no audition scholarships, right>></p> </blockquote>
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<p>If you mean...the child must audition for scholarships, yes you are correct.</p>
<p>Re: auditions at the schools...sadly even in the same town, the auditions may not be on the same weekend. DS auditioned at BU at the beginning of Feb and NEC at the end. Neither day was negotiable...they were the only days for auditions on DS's instrument.</p>
<p>But yes...the NYC schools do have their auditions on consecutive days.</p>
<p>Thanks, Binx--we know this is a hole. He has a keyboard and dinks around with it a bit. Lessons would be a help, I know.</p>
<p>My son has played in the state orchestra as a sophomore-6th chair, junior-3rd chair. He has played in GDYO (Dallas) as co-principle. He hopes/plans to do both of these as a senior. He is at Tanglewood right now. I don't really know how they do their seating. He was last chair for the first concert, now he is principle for the second concert, and the previous principle is last. ?? I will get to go to the final concert - I can't wait!! We really miss him.
He set up a lesson last fall with Paul Ellison at Rice. He was encouraging. He also set up a lesson with Jeff Bradetich at UNT. He won a h.s. solo opportunity at UNT's bass day concert, and later, a masterclass with Dr. Bradetich during bass camp. He has had masterclasses with symphony members in Boston and Chicago while on trips with his school orchestra. His private teacher plays in the Ft. Worth symphony. These have all been encouraging. While getting good feedback, I know these schools/conservatories are very hard to get into. But, maybe not too many audiitions??? He has been working hard and using the music required list for a year. He seems to know what he is doing. I am optimistic, but the money is a reality to consider. In the end, whatever is open to him, he/we will have to consider our comfort level with financial gap and debt. As long as he keeps working hard, I want to encourage him to attempt all auditions, not just play it safe with a few.<br>
He referred all of his private students (while he is gone to Tanglewood) to a guy a few years older. He is a bass major on scholarship from Oberlin. I'm not sure why he doesn't talk much about Oberlin. Maybe he can talk to this guy when he gets back.
Binx, the information about CIM is helpful. It may not make a lot of sense for him to audition there, in his situation. I do wish all of the schools would go ahead and put the dates out. I teach school, so summer is the perfect time for me to look ahead at the crazy calendar and map out what, where, how...
I have found several ways to get free airline miles. We do plan to take his bass to auditions - as expensive as it is to consider a flight trunk (rent or whatever) and the big fees. He just recently hurt his hand playing for a day on a loaner bass because the strings were set up too high. I suppose it's not worth the factor of risk of a bad audition, sound, or injury.</p>
<p>BU is not a safety for double bassists. In my estimation, it is among the top few double bass programs in the country along with Curtis and Rice. Ed Barker is superb and James Orleans, Todd Seeber and Larry Wolfe are all excellent teachers. Colburn offers full rides to all college students and is extremely competitive. UNT, CIM and Indiana are very popular choices for double bass students because all have excellent faculty on that instrument. Even if he is among the best of the current crop of high school bassists (as the principal position at Tanglewood would suggest) he should realize that there is not a single safety on that list. Some people prefer to operate in that way, figuring that if they cannot make it into one of the best schools then they should consider a different field or take a gap year and try again. If he is of the mind that he wants to study bass somewhere, even if it is not one of the top schools, then he should start looking for a couple of safeties, particularly if he needs a lot of aid and does not get into Curtis or Colburn.</p>
<p>The Tanglewood bass section rotates seating. The top three auditioners each get to sit principal for one concert, last chair for one concert and somewhere in the middle third for one concert. I believe the top auditioner usually gets the last concert as principal, so thenosam's son was likely second or third in the pecking order.</p>
<p>Bassists generally do wind up carting along their instrument for important auditions. There is no such thing as a "standard" bass. No two are really quite the same and even two very good ones can be quite different. The string length can vary a bit, the note that sounds at the point where the fingerboard joins the body is different on different instruments, some are set up with the strings higher off the fingerboard, fingerboard width can vary somewhat, some instruments have extensions to allow the instrument to play down to C rather than E, some instruments even have five strings instead of four. All this means that it can take a while for the musician to get used to a particular instrument and they will be at their best in an audition using the instrument on which they have been practicing.</p>
<p>My daughter is a double bass major at Oberlin, who will be starting her third year there in a month or so. If you have specific questions about the program there, I will be happy to pass them along. PM me if you like. Oberlin's policy is to meet 100% of demonstrated need and with several in school at once, you could qualify for a large amount of aid there. They are known for providing lots in scholarships and grants and relatively low amounts in loans.</p>
<p>Whoa...!! I will PM you, BassDad. Good thoughts - thank you all!</p>
<p>Thenosam,
I really hate to be the one to break it to you, but audition dates for colleges are not posted very far ahead. If you were hoping to put your plan together this summer, or even this fall...</p>
<p>Being a somewhat compulsive organizer, I found this very difficult to comprehend, but when my D was auditioning for college, only a very few schools gave significant notice (3 months or more.) I recall that Curtis posted dates mid January for February auditions.</p>
<p>Actually, many schools (including Oberlin and CIM) have their 2008 audition dates posted on their websites now. While you might not know which date you've been assigned until later, it's helpful to see the possibilites.</p>
<p>You are right, Pam, I misspoke. You can usually find out the general range of audition dates for your instrument, but not necessarily which one will be yours.</p>