I definitely understand that the Criminal Justice System has played a part in the destruction of the African-American family and I have talked on CC how the war on drugs decimated my own community of Black men to the point that I only knew 3 kids at my Elementary School that had married biological parents in their household. But I have seen some things that also point to Black men (in general) having to do better. Including myself, their are 10 male grandchildren from my material grandparents. Out of the 10, none of us have ever been arrested (for more than 1 night anyway) and we age from 32-45 years old. Out of the 10, only 4 have ever been married despite all 10 of us having kids and several of us have kids that we are not taking care of or are not claiming. That is a problem. Only 3 out of us 10 had our Biological fathers in our home growing up. Before my generation and my kids generation, my family was never divided and those households (My Parents, Grandparents and Great Grandparents all had both biological parents in the household) with most being raised in the Jim Crow South. The statistic that has always gotten my attention is that 68% of African American households with children were married when MLK was assassinated in 1968, but the percentage was at 28% in 2019. The criminal justice system alone can not explain that big of a drop. My own recommendations are coming from what I have observed in my own family more because I definitely can not speak for the entire black community.
The question that begs to be asked is why? Is it discrimination or behavior or perhaps some of both? That seems to be a dangerous question to ask today but I donât see any chance of change until it is broached.
I understand the personal anecdotal examples may be a big influence. Sometimes, our personal experiences seem larger than any other evidence. However I ask that you step back and look at the bigger picture.
Itâs interesting you mentioned 1968, because your statement reminded me of this 2018 study from UMD-Baltimore: 1968: The Turning Point Year When U.S. Social Work Failed to Turn.
The TLDR version of the paper basically says that as the Civil Rights era legalized some more-equitable treatment of African-Americans in some aspects including the delivery of Social Services, 1968 was the beginning of a new (re)dedication to racism taking over how Social Services were administered and how the image of Social Services were presented to the US public. Think of politicians popularizing falsehoods like mass corruption/fraud or hordes of African-American âwelfare queens.â
This study covers 1968-2018 and is breathtaking in what it reveals. It reveals how the lingering effects of McCarthyism mixed with racism in and led to decades of worsening systemic racism in domestic Social Services across nearly every department. The referenced source material is also helpful in concluding this.
Your family may or may not have been affected by this, but this study says many African-American families were severely impacted by the changes that started in 1968. I could list more studies that come at this specific topic (single-parent AA households) and how events that seem less related on the surface actually had a large impact, but suffice it to say the proof is overwhelming.
Like a spiderâs web, every strand of systemic racism was designed to cripple African-Americans. The cumulative effect of this avalanche of systemic racism on African-American families is powerful. Every year, more books and studies are published but at this point, itâs like shooting fish in a barrel. The evidence is astounding and abundant.
Frederick Douglas saw it. Thatâs why he wrote those words you posted at the beginning of this thread. MLKJr saw it and spoke on it, marched against it. And the various movements today (BLM, etc) see it and speak out about it. And following that line from FD to MLK to BLM gets back to the original musings of this thread: why many African-Americans may not celebrate July4th because oppression caused by systemic-racism remains a significant detrimental force in our lives. Even if some of us are fortunate enough to not feel as personally affected by it, systemic racism dramatically affected our parents and grandparents more than it affects us today, which affected how they raised (or didnât raise) us, which affects how we raise our own children. These effects tremor through generations.
I agree personal responsibility always looms large. Yet, when the numbers are this far out of whack, and we have all this proof of historical (and present day) systemic racism, I do not think we should dismiss obvious causes to explain the discrepancy in these numbers. We should emphasize personal responsibility as we do with any personal goals, but we should also acknowledge the handicaps created by historical and ongoing systemic racism - combining both methods should yield the greatest successes.
Iâve posted links to books and studies before. It is obvious and has been proven repeatedly that there is no "behavioralâ reason for the disparity in racial statistics of Criminal Justice statistics. It is a result of systemic racism, both directly in the Criminal Justice arena and in America in general.
If you doubt that or have other questions begging to be answered and would like to read more about it, I would be happy to point you toward several books on the subject.
The data is abundant.
Why exactly would âcertain racesâ be âproneâ to commit âcertainâ crimes at a higher rate?
But note that the crime wave ( https://cen.acs.org/articles/92/i5/Crimes-Lead.html ) was only just beginning in the 1960s. The crime wave (which affected urban areas the worst, due to the highest levels of lead pollution there) led to political and policy reactions to get âtough on crimeâ (longer sentences, âwar on drugsâ, more aggressive or militarized policing, âthree strikesâ laws, etc.). While this was mostly generic (although some aspects did add racial unfairness themselves), it combined with pre-existing and continuing racial unfairness in criminal justice, policing, and how people call the police to greatly amplify the effects of such racial unfairness.
The crime wave peaked in 1991, and crime is much lower now than then. However, polling shows that the fear of crime is still very high â historical polls on crime ( Crime | Gallup Historical Trends ) found that, in nearly every year since 1991, a majority of people thought that crime was increasing, even though it was decreasing in most years.
I donât disagree with any of those finding and understand the impacts of systematic racism on African-Americans, but I also believe in attacking the issue from within âour own houseâ. Even if every single form of systematic racism was removed today, I am positive that a portion of our community would not be able to capitalize. What if we are never able to fully root out the vestiges of slavery/Jim Crow? Do we continue to be victims or do we continue to fight both the systematic racism and the internal âdemonsâ that hold down Black people?
I watch Black women (in general) holding up my extended family and those households in my old community and it is tough to watch. I believe that we have to take some accountability to fix our internal issues along with fixing systematic racism, because we might be waiting a long time for a systematic fix based on our prior history.
The really sad confirming aspect of this was a White Nationalist march in Philly a few days ago. They had approx 200 people there according to one report I saw. If there were that many willing to come out of their houses and expose their idiotic beliefs to all, imagine how many are still hiding, but feel similarly?
Itâs super sad, esp in 2021 when everyone around should have learned by now that biologically humans are humans. Except for a few medical issues, our skin color is meaningless.
How can so many cling to their untruths? Why the need to demean others thinking it somehow promotes themselves?
DILâs AA extended family lives in Philly (aunts, grandparents, cousins, etc). When they visited a couple weeks ago her uncle relayed some ânormalâ stories, one of which was hitting a deer with his car. The deference he felt the need to show to the police over something like that was sad. He might not have needed so much pending who he was dealing with, but didnât want to take any chances. I get it, but itâs sad. It would not have been the same if H or I had hit the deer.
I deal with mostly white kids at school due to our demographics, but I learned long ago that those without a good vision for their future were far more likely to end up in our police blotters, often for the rest of their lives. Then itâs common for kids to learn how to exist in this world from their parents. If the parents are often in the police blotter, chances are high the kids will be too.
Considering the opportunities minorities havenât had in the past, what exactly would society expect to happen? Itâs the same thing the unfortunate white students have going against them, but with added issues that they can be judged solely on skin color and have their opportunities dashed from that.
It takes a lot to get the âpoor birth lotteryâ white kids to be able to change their paths. Most donât. A few succeed. Why do so many think minority kids should be able to âjust do itâ - the opportunity is out there now(!) as if that should make it easy.
The opportunity isnât equally out there considering the white supremacist beliefs some still bring to the table, and the job of breaking through is tough to begin with. Having extra scholarships available and other such things is a start to trying to equalize life.
I truly appreciate the posts from those of you who actually âliveâ being black in America. It can be hard to get past our own opinions and truly hear what others are telling us. It seems to be human nature to sometimes think we know things better than those who actually experience those things. I have spent years trying to set my beliefs aside and listen ⊠and I need to keep working at it all the time. Your honest discussion is really interesting and educational.
This could not be more spot on. If people take nothing more from this conversation, I hope they consider this is constant the reality for blacks in America. 100% of the time. Whether good things are happening to you or bad. This pervasive feeling underlies every single interaction.
A serious if ignorant question-do black women have a similar fear in mixed-race situations, or is it primarily just black men who feel this way, due to a possible (mis) perception of threat on both sides?
Just so you understand, we all have to do this, or you can find yourself with disastorous results.
Ouch. That was a very âall lives matterâ-ish response. âJust so you understandâ makes it that much more condescending. EconPopâs posts have demonstrated absolutely no lack of understanding that you would need to remedy.
Surely youâre not claiming that a Black Americanâs need for vigilance is equivalent to the baseline level of prudence that all people should exercise.
Yes, one point has been conclusively proven: a thread like this is well-suited for SuperMod intervention!
I wish everyone would be a tad less sensitive these days-some posters (not OP) seem to take offense easily-we could all exercise a bit more grace around each other and not have a such short fuse. Communicating openly and respectfully, without withdrawing, is a worthwhile goal of this discussion, and for the most part seems achieved.
FWIW, after my very first post on this thread, a poster (again, NOT the OP) privately messaged me to call me racist and demand that I not respond to posts by URM. I responded that OP seemed willing to engage, that I thought communication was important, and that withdrawing was counterproductive. Not everyone wishes to continue a discussion after being accused of racism, but I think everyone should be willing to sincerely engage without worrying that a post will be misconstrued. We do not benefit when we are all on edge around each other, whether on CC or in person.
Transgender People Can Explain Why Women Don't Advance at Work | The New Republic contains this quote:
Men are commonly perceived as more of a threat than women. Such a gender-based perception of threat obviously gets amplified by racially-based perceptions of threat.