Every year in our school district, some kids are pushed to go to top schools. And pretty regularly, a few kids come home from those top schools and go on to graduate from the University of Southern Maine. And they do fine after they graduate.
I took him to Kenyon for a visit-my idea-because I wanted him to see a small, selective LAC. His reaction was, “I’m sure it’s a good college, but I just can’t see spending four years of my life there.” Agree that I might have him send an app to Case. The place he seemed to like best was Xavier, but I’m concerned that we can’t afford it, and that the programs are not generally as strong as those at Miami and Ohio State. He liked Miami, too, on his visit; we haven’t checked out Ohio State yet.
If he is really undecided, then what may be important criteria for a college are that:
A. It offers all of the possible majors that he may be interested in.
B. Those majors are not oversubscribed or highly competitive admission beyond getting into the college.
However, he should know that some majors (e.g. chemical engineering) do require starting the prerequisites from the first semester in order to stay on track to graduate in 8 semesters.
Let it go. Prestige and selectivity are not factors for my 3.9 GPA kid. Which is okay because finances are a factor. His search has focused on small, moderately selective LACs that offer merit and our in-state options. He is happy with his list and can see himself at each school. Which is what matters.
I’m wondering whether we should have at least one selective LAC on the list. But I honestly don’t think he is interested. He is apparently an extremely pragmatic, future English major. Maybe your S could consider a selective option or two along the other schools? 
Interesting fun fact. I attended an all-hands meeting at work today. Two of the very high-ranking corporate marketing managers who presented went to Miami of Ohio and made a point of mentioning it.
In your situation, you have a good justification for encouraging your son to at least consider selective private schools (as long as they have his intended major). It has nothing to do with prestige. For that EFC level, the net price may be significantly lower at a more selective college. It doesn’t need to be a T20 school, because many private T21-50 colleges also offer good need-based aid.
Run the online net price calculators. In some cases, a generous merit award will result in the lowest net. Or, the lower sticker price of an in-state public university, combined with either kind of aid, might do it. If you’re footing the bill, it isn’t unreasonable to expect your S to cooperate in a little low-pressure comparison shopping.
On the other hand … TOSU’s in-state sticker price isn’t much above your FAFSA EFC. It’s a good school that covers many majors. It (or another state u) may be your path of least resistance if your S really does not want to engage in this crazy process.
I think the point is not that a higher ranked school will help him succeed more later in life. It’s that there may be some option where he’d be happier over the next four years. And that might cost about the same or even a little less than your current five schools. (I’d be a little worried that Xavier, Cincy, and Dayton won’t be affordable.)
If he were a junior, I’d suggest casting the net a little wider. At this point, though, you really could have him take a look at applying to Case Western (which has a Jan. 15 deadline, by the way). To compare it with OSU:
OSU: #54 in US News, with 45,000 undergrads. Costs about $23K plus books and expenses. With a $20K EFC, you might not get much (or any) need-based aid, but there might be other scholarships. Should be affordable without unreasonable loans.
Case: #37 in US News, with 5,200 undergrads. (The ranking difference isn’t very meaningful–some would say it’s completely meaningless–but it could be a small factor.) Says it meets full need, so might be comparable to OSU in cost, depending on what they they think your need is.
I have no idea whether your son would be happier at OSU or Case. But it sounds like he doesn’t really know either. If he puts in an application, he might get a chance to compare them later.
See attached http://www.toptieradmissions.com/colleges-without-supplemental-essays/
No essay required at Ohio State or Case - both are great schools, with Case much smaller so better chance of not getting lost in the crowd.
Purdue is another great match option.
Wash U is also a no-supplemental school and definitely a reach for everyone, but its not too big and has one of the best business schools in the country.
Undergrad is less important than you may think for grad school application. For evidence of this, look at Harvard Law Schools list of where their students went to college.
Ohio State is listed, FWIW
http://hls.harvard.edu/dept/jdadmissions/apply-to-harvard-law-school/undergraduate-colleges/?redir=1
And just to add to that, it’s dead easy to go to business school. You need very little that’s special to go to business school. Score high on the GMAT and have decent work history and grades, – you’re in! Most business schools act as money-raisers for schools, especially executive MBA programs. Schools seem to be creating more and more of what I call “educational products”–certificates, executive programs, and the like, mainly as tuition cash cows. Many masters programs are tuition cash cows and don’t lead directly to Ph.D. programs. They’re a lot of debt for a degree that doesn’t necessarily advance your career. Yes, this includes Ivy universities and the like. What leads to a good Ph.D. program are high grades, high GREs and a research interest that’s well developed and fits the mentor professor who is evaluating the application. One “hidden” and dead cheap business school – fairly easiy to get into – is Baruch. It’s practically in the heart of Wall Street, recruiters for big firms go there all the time and internships on Wall street are common.
So basically your child sets himself up for these grad programs by getting good grades in some major. That’s it. Not so much the school, but good grades and developing a set of interests. It’s really really hard to develop a set of interests if you’re anxious about school, in a school that’s too stressful, and or hate your program.
Law school admissions are: 1) any major (theater, engineering, nursing, creative writing, Italian–anything); 2) high grades; 3) LSAT above 172 about. That should get you into a top 10 law school, which is what you need to actually practice law and pay off the debt.
I totally get what you are saying! My daughter with slightly higher GPA but slightly lower ACT is the same way. I realize it is just me that is hung up on this. I’ve been looking for that “in between” school with a bit more prestige to add into the mix. I’ve got to stop.
I know better than to get too into the rankings. My son went to Dayton. He had a job when he graduated, working alongside other new grads from Stanford, ND, UNC, Hopkins, etc. He did really well and made the same money as kids from higher ranked schools. It is all what you do with the degree. Of course kids from ND have more alumni connections than my son, but I am sure he will manage!
I will say that if you want a reach school to see where it plays out, I like the idea of ND and Michigan since they are not too far from home. Although an Ohio kid may not want to go to Ann Arbor, lol. Case is great too, for the right major.
With any of these schools, matches or reaches, I think that fit is the most important thing. See where he feels the most at home. Also look at the honors programs at each school. It adds a bit of prestige and challenge, but still lets him be where he is comfortable. There is something to be said about being in the top 25% rather than just squeaking in somewhere. Good luck!
^^^
if he’s interested in Xavier, a Catholic school, then maybe Notre Dame is worth a shot
I don’t see Michigan as within their budget.
Right, I thought Michigan was notorious for not meeting OOS need.
Agree that there are success stories at every school, but the reality is the % of students at the more selective schools that get a great first job is higher - whether its because of name recognition or alumni connections really doesn’t matter.
Ohio State is an excellent university. It’s near the top 50 universities as ranked by U.S. News (#52) and is in the top 20 public universities in the nation. It’s consistently ranked in the top 100 universities in the world, which is amazing considering that the world may have well over 25,000 institutions of higher education. It’s a top producer of research and a top recipient of federal research dollars. Most freshman are in the top 10% of their class; the overwhelming majority are in the top quarter; most score well above-average on the ACT. And with over 475,000 living alumni, Ohio State has a truly amazing alumni network and some very prominent former alumni who have won recognition across multiple fields - including CEOs and many other business leaders, many politicians and government leaders, lots of scientists and researchers, etc.
Miami University is considered a public Ivy. It’s well-recognized for its excellent academics and student support, and has been put on par with UT-Austin, UNC, Michigan, the University of Virginia and the College of William & Mary. Businessweek named Miami’s school of business within the top 25 undergraduate business programs in the country, and the top 10 for public schools.
He’s already got two fantastic options in his home state that are affordable and well-reputed. He’s very likely to get into both of them. And he’s got some great backup schools as well! My boss’s boss here at Microsoft went to the University of Cincinnati.
He could just be a smart kid who is done with the pressure and competition of high school and wants to go somewhere he knows he can succeed without all of that, plus have an opportunity to develop himself personally and focus on some other aspects of the college experience. There’s nothing wrong with that.
(I made the same choice when I was in high school - I deliberately chose colleges that were safeties for me, and was uninterested in going to a hypercompetitive atmosphere.)
Of course, it’s good to have options, so nothing wrong with encouraging him to take a look at Case Western (which may be more affordable than Xavier) or maybe Notre Dame (he’d have to hurry; their deadline is January 1), maybe Denison.
It sounds like he has picked a list of sensible options that are close to home and that might be affordable. If he doesn’t know what he wants to study, a large university with many options is probably his best bet. An honors program can make a large school smaller, best of both worlds. That’s what I did back in the day - I took my NMF award straight to my affordable local state flagship and it was a great experience. If Ohio State is affordable, it would be a great pick.
Case is a terrific school but be advised that demonstrated interest is important. Last year, many of my daughter’s friends applied with stats => than your sons and were accepted or waitlisted so if he does apply, he should not be complacent. It does offer some Ohio resident (or perhaps Cleveland metro area?) merit scholarships by separate application so do check out the scholarship information on their website.
A 3.76 UW is commendable but is not going to be exceptional at top 50 schools, much less top 20, where 3.8+, 33-36 ACT applicants are plentiful. Take a look at the admissions results threads here from the top schools. It is sobering how many excellent students get turned away. I think your son is to be commended for having such a rational, realistic approach to the college application process. I wish him and your family the best of luck in your search.
It sounds like your child has realistic options and is setting himself up for a successful college search. While I see nothing wrong with shooting for the stars it’s good to see a kid who has his feet firmly planted on the earth. He looks like a wise kid to me.
Let him drive the process. Our daughter has a 4.0 uw at a very demanding hs, 35 act, nmsf, and did not apply to one super selective college and I support her. She realized she wanted the diversity and feel of a large public state school with a great honors college to provide some more academic peers. Because of her stats she is being offered some very nice merit packages at schools she knows she will be happy at.
Sometimes, and in some geographic areas, the prestige of the school becomes a huge talking point for parents, school counselors, etc and kids feel pressure. It sounds like he has a clear picture of what type of thing he is comfortable with at this point so help support him in that and he has put together a good list of schools.
More selective schools also have a higher percentage of high stats, highly motivated/driven kids. And typically from full pay families which bring with them a certain level of benefits/privileges. So at least a part of that great first job is quality of inputs. You can argue how much. And people on this board have. Multiple times over the years. In multiple threads.
Eta: Often times, I see the prestige concept as being more important for the parents than the kid. Parents want the bumper sticker.
IMHO, Ohio State and Miami are the the best public in-state options, with Case the best private in state metioned. Am sure success stories come from everywhere, but when you have OP son’s academic profile / likelihood acceptance to Miami and Ohio State and given cost is a big factor I don’t think Cincinnati or Xavier are the best paths.
If he isn’t put off by size of larger schools, then there’s something to be said for a university where a child who doesn’t have a real plan can change majors multiple times without needing to transfer. His picks look like good choices. If he loves the area where you live and can see settling down there, then there’s also benefit to going to school in the region in terms of where he might get internship, summer jobs, etc and where companies in the area recruit - that might lead to job after graduation.