<p>Just chiming in to suggest some other schools that were on S’s list who was a solid B/B+ student - in PA - Elizabethtown, Misericordia, Scranton, Wilkes, Kings. In NY - Hartwick, Siena. In VT - Champlain. In MA - Western New England. In NJ - wanted him to look at Rowan, but wouldn’t because 2 people from his HS that he didn’t like went there. Was going to consider Rider and called to schedule a visit. I had never been spoken to so rudely by an admisions office. (She asked what date we wanted to visit. I gave her the date. She went off on me about how that was impossible because that was their accepted students’ day. How was I supposed to know?) So with many other great choices, that one came off the list. </p>
<p>Both of my kids ended up at Scranton. We couldn’t be happier. D graduated a few years ago and S is there now. Expensive, but good with merit and need based money. It is a Jesuit school, so there are 2 theology classes in the core, but religion is not forced on anyone. We are not catholic and my kids love the campus environment. It is a medium sized school at 4000 undergrads. Great science programs, well respected business program, many OT, PT, nursing, and education majors. Great track record for admission to law school and medical school. They just completed a beautiful new student center and sophomore dorm. There are many active clubs and intramural sports as well as DIII sports (women’s basketball made it to the elite 8 this year). There are also many service opportunities. Being in the city, there are many places to walk to such as coffee shops, pizza and other food places, the mall, movie theaters. Sno mountain is about a 10-15 minute drive (although S and friend have walked there). S rarely comes home on weekends and many kids stay on campus. The academics are rigorous. Faculty are helpful and supportive, although they do not hold your hand. The student must seek out the help. Scranton also has a supportive and passionate alumni network. Since we are from a semi-rural area, as we drove into the city, I never thought my D would like it there. But from the time she set foot on campus, she felt a vibe that never left. There are also many opportunites for stellar students as well, but since this is the B/B+ thread I will leave it at that. Scranton is definitely worth a visit for anyone seeking a similar school.</p>
<p>My friend’s daughter has a 3.2 GPA, no AP classes and 2 honors classes total. She was accepted at Endicott, Salve Regina, St Anselem, Bryant and University of Mary Washington. (She did not get into Stonehill and PC)</p>
<p>My son has a D in his English class for sophomore year and I wonder how that will affect his results. He was sick alot and hopefully the GC can get the schools to look beyond that. </p>
<p>I’m finding it difficult to predict any true safeties. The close we get to application time, the more stressed I become.</p>
<p>I suggest those looking for the big publics check out the Big 12 schools. Admissions are very formulated and decent test scores will compensate for a lower GPA. Schools like U of Kansas, Mizzou and U of Oklahoma are in great college towns, have strong academic programs and rah rah sports teams that compete for national championships. OOS costs are not outrageous and rolling admissions will give you peace of mind.</p>
<p>Take note that some schools will only look at unweighted GPAs, while others will consider weighted and yet others will do their own recalculation. The definition of a B+ student is not always clear.</p>
<p>warriorboy, for many families it is not about getting in as much as about how to pay for it. Many schools gap a huge amount for FA, and with a 3.2 if one gets into higher match schools, they may not be offered merit aid, or nearly enough merit aid. Frankly, if a school costs 43k, and a student is offered 7500 in merit aid, and financial aid gaps a lot, the school might be an admit deny for someone with an efc below 30k.</p>
<p>northeast mom nailed it. We are really worried about affording anything besides a public school, and even some OOS publics may be an issue. (I did the EFC calculator…ours is way too high to get any aid. We had a nice college plan which involved stock from my husband’s company, but he works for a “bailed out” company so that went down the tubes.) And my son really does want a big school. So I’m going to go on Naviance and research the “Big 12” fully. I’m ashamed to say that I don’t know what schools are actually part of the Big 12, but I do know that Michigan and Penn State are, and Michigan is a huge reach for my son (I’m only saying reach rather than impossible because he has two alum parents). I get differing opinions on whether Penn State is a match or not. </p>
<p>If anyone else has Naviance and can pull their range of acceptance for Maryland and Penn State, I would appreciate it. Oh, UMass and UConn too if that’s okay…</p>
<p>RR, we don’t have naviance info, but I can tell you that in my area (NJ) if you have a 3.1-3.3 and are applying to UCONN as a business major you probably won’t get in. I think that with UConn it will vary by the state you live in and the major you choose. Apparently they get a lot of students from our state.</p>
<p>Penn State-most students in our hs with lower B averages do not get into the main campus, but are admitted to one of their other campuses. Most kids in our hs do not matriculate to their other campuses and elect to go elsewhere.</p>
<p>As far as private school that is big on sports, many low B kids get into Syracuse. I do think that they apply with majors that are not the most popular (I know one went in as a computer science major). Again, it depends upon major. You probably will not get into Newhouse, but you might accepted with a less popular major.</p>
<p>I know a quite a few kids with low B averages who do get into UMASS, but not UMD. I have left standardized tests out of the equation, so that changes things a bit.</p>
<p>OOS publics, in particular, can be financially prohibitive to a B/B+ student with average test scores. Public universities and colleges are often – I said OFTEN, not ALWAYS – stingy with financial aid even for strong OOS candidates. I know quite a few parents whose kids are going to places like U of Michigan, William & Mary, Maryland, Pitt and Penn State who are paying a heck of a lot more for those schools than they would have if their kids had applied to LACs. The families know that but are of the camp that firmly believes that large research universities are “better” than LACs.</p>
<p>Penn State is EXPENSIVE if you’re from out of state… and you need to have pretty close to a 4.0 to be accepted into their main campus right off the bat… northeastmom nailed it… they admit you to a sattelite campus and after 2 years you can transfer…</p>
<p>NEmom – I think with UCONN, like at many universities, selectivity depends a lot on which School you are applying to. Syracuse, for example, is a likely admit in Arts & Sciences for a B/B+ kid with a 1650+ SAT, but that same kid would be hard-pressed to get into Newhouse. Most of the kids from this area who go to UCONN are going into traditional lib arts majors and are B+ students. I don’t know what their standardized test scores are, but based on the fact that the very top students here rarely crack 700 per section, they probably aren’t exceptional.</p>
<p>I agree with HV. OOS schools for someone with an EFC of 25k or less is not necessarily a good option. It might be very good option if your EFC is 30k or more. This all depends on the sticker price of the school, budget cuts in the state, and what the price of the school will be in year 2,3,4 and even 5.</p>
<p>I might offend my NY posters here, but now that SUNYS have gone up by nearly 3k per year for OOS, they are costing, I believe about 27k per year. Everyone still says that they are so inexpensive. I actually find that they are not. Yes, they still cost less than UCONN, UVM, Penn State, but they cost more than some OOS options in other states and are now more than our instate costs at Rutgers (a true flagship). Things do change, and SUNYS are not necessarily the financial bargain that once were. If your EFC is over 30k, then yes, they might be a financial bargain for your family. Individual circumstances do matter.</p>
<p>HV- Yes, about major and stats, that is exactly what I was trying to say. I believe that you are absolutely correct.</p>
<p>Northeast – you’re not offending this NY person. Possibly part of the problem is that all SUNYs charge the same. In the meantime, taxpayers are livid that the TOP sunys charge less than market to OOS and the state legislature is sympathetic. Also, the SUNYs are refusing to respond to FOIL requests as to average states of instate v. OOS accepted students, which is not endearing them to taxpayers/legislatures. Which means I would not count on the 3K increase being a once in a 4 year event.</p>
<p>kayf, You and I have talked about this quite a few times. I know that you’d like to have those OOS seats open for instate students anyway. I think that the price increase might keep more CT, PA, NJ away from SUNYS. That will leave more seats open for instate students, which I know you are in favor of, since you don’t feel that a kid from CT would offer geographic diversity anyway. Oh, I am not counting on the 3k increase as a one time event over the next 4 years. That is just another reason to stay away.</p>
<p>From our Scattergram (large public high school in NYC suburbs)
all SAT scores out of 1600
I’m giving our weighted GPA, but you need to know that nearly all courses are weighted by 1.05, and honors and AP are weighted by 1.1, making it tricky to guess what the unweighted GPA really is - I guess on the first couple, but you can do calcs for the rest!</p>
<p>**U. of Md.<a href=“I%20assume%20you%20want%20College%20Park%20Campus”>/B</a>
average GPA (weighted) 93.58 - = unweighted around 89 perhaps less if honors and AP included (not less than 86 in any event)
average SAT 1280
only a couple of rejections in 1280+ SAT range, one with a very low GPA
88-93 weighted GPA is about 50/50 chance (divide by 1.05 for unweighted - may be even less depending on AP/honors courses which would be divided by 1.1)</p>
<p>Penn State
Average GPA (weighted) 92.48 - see above for unweighting
Average SAT 1196
they accept about 3/4 of our applicants. College compare says 24 rejects, Scattergram only shows four (what’s up with that?) But only one waitlist above the average SAT no rejects, only one waitlist above 90 weighted GPA</p>
<p>U Mass
Average weighted GPA 92.18
Average SAT 1198
Wide range of SAT scores accepted (as low as 1000), in the 87-90 range of weighted GPA you have a 50/50 chance of being waitlisted, small chance of being rejected. Only one reject shown in the above average GPA.</p>
<p>U Conn
average weighted GPA 93.05
average SAT 1210
No rejects with SAT over 1220. No rejects with GPA over 93. If the SAT is over 1150 nearly everyone is accepted or waitlisted except those with GPA less than 87 and even then there’s about a 1 in 3 chance.</p>
<p>Warriorboy- I don’t know if your son could somehow retake the soph english class. I would start by calling a couple of admission offices at a few colleges to get their opinion. In my son’s D case we were given terrible and completely wrong advice by our high school counselor. She should have known better, she was fairly new to our school but not to school counseling. My son’s D was in Biology. The counselor told us that he did not need to retake the course since the 2nd semester grade was a B. The B would show the colleges he had mastered the material. I must have been sleeping on the job because I believed her. A D may be a passing grade for the high school but for some universities a passing grade to qualify as meeting an admissions standard is a C.
We are in Ca. When I went to calculate his eligibility for the UC’s I found he was a few points shy of the eligibility index. He ended up not applying. He did apply to 3 Cal States. I didn’t look at the eligibility course list since I figured he was fine. He was offered admissions to 2. The third Sonoma State was the school we thought he would probably end up at. Affordable, smaller in size and in a good location. I was shocked when he was denied. We contacted the college. To our shock they said he had not completed an entire yr of a life science with at least a C grade. His SAT scores were 100’s of points above their average, his GPA was above average but he did not meet the life science requirement. When I called the high school and spoke with the head counselor he said my son should have been advised to retake the course. Sonoma was within their rights to deny him admission. We did file and appeal which was denied. In reality the 2 Cal States that had admitted him did so in error or decided that all the other stats were good and were willing to give him a chance. Sonoma had more qualified applicants so had no need to give him a break.
I take some of the blame. I asked about retaking and took her answer without question. After yrs on CC I should have known better.</p>
<p>Here are some Naviance data from our Boston suburban high school (median unweighted GPAs, core courses only, based on 2004-2008 grads. Median SAT scores math/verbal combined)</p>
<p>University of Arizona: 2.78/1120
University of Colorado/Boulder: 3.085/1220
University of Connecticut: 3.32/1280
University of Florida: 3.08/1070
University of Georgia/Athens: 3.35/1300
University of Illinois/Urbana: 3.27/1375
University of Maryland/College Park: 3.35/1285
University of Missouri/Columbia: 3.247/1480
University of New Hampshire/Durham: 3.065/1160
University of Vermont: 3.3/1275
University of Wisconsin/Madison: 3.48/1305</p>
<p>Good to know mom60; Wow. Son’s C is in English, C+ right now, and his school will only let you repeat a D or less. A few barely B-‘s, balanced by a A+ in Bio (go figure…). I’m guessing all this CSU stuff is on that mentor page. I was kind of thinking sophmore year was a little too early. We are paying full price at a private for my D, but she really earned it. If son can prove himself on the cheap, I’d consider funding a transfer. Anybody know which CSU’'s have good men’s soccer?</p>
<p>Shrinkrap- the requirements are on the website. My older D did not apply to any Cal States. In my day I don’t remember the Cal States having such specific course requirements. So when my son’s turn came I just assumed with his SAT score he would have no trouble getting into some of the Cal States. I figured Sonoma was a sure bet. I messed up. I never checked the admissions course requirements. One thing in your son’s favor is that the CSU’s ignore + and - grades. So a B- has as much weight as a B+. I am pretty sure they will throw out the Religion grades. Not sure about the journalism. Even a private high school should be able to let you know what classes are CSU/UC approved courses. They also should know what classes the UC/CSU will give a weighted grade for. At our public school there are a few classes the high school considers honors that the UC’s do not give an extra point for.</p>
<p>My son is interested in mechanical engineering and I guess my bigger concern is graduation rate. I think he would do better in a smaller school. Any ideas? (Son is a soph. 3.0unw gpa if you count electives, just under 3.0 if you don’t, all honors, SATs will be on the low side-- verbal in the 500s, writing likely in the 400s, math high 600s could reach 700.)</p>
<p>UC’s only compute gpa from 9-11 grades for UC approved courses. I think CSU’s are the same but check the mentor. Key thing is to get a list from your school re: which of their classes are UC/CSU approved (religion won’t be for example) and which honors are UC/CSU approved. Our school gave the kids their UC gpa in jr. year so they knew what they had going in. My daughter had 3 gpa’s: UC, LAUSD and everyone else!</p>