<p>I had previously committed to Northwestern's McCormick School of Engineering & Applied Science, but I just made it off the waitlist for Columbia's Fu School so I need some advice! First, a bit about myself:</p>
<p>I am a total math nerd (science too of course), but can't see myself pursuing hard math, it would drive me nuts. I have always enjoyed getting my hands dirty and love being faced with problems and such, so I really think that engineering is the thing for me. I am also a professional live/session rock drummer in San Diego and need to be in a community where I can expand my musical horizons along with academic education (I can really see me applying my musical passion and creativity to engineering). Although both Chicago and New York obviously both have great music scenes, the idea of transporting my drums to shows in NYC scares me! I grew up in a suburb of San Diego, so the weather will suck either way, but I never fell in love with the big city atmosphere. But I prefer Columbia's actual isolated campus. </p>
<p>I would love to hear any thoughts you have, I haven't thought about it too much because I only heard from Columbia today. I'd like to focus mainly on the academics and differences between engineering programs - anything else is just personal and stuff I need to figure out myself haha. </p>
<p>Thanks so much in advance everyone!</p>
<p>P.S. I wouldn't consider myself an avid reader. I read a lot when I find a book/author I like, but not like most kids at Columbia!</p>
<p>Overall University reputation: Columbia, hands down.
Engineering Department: definitely Northwestern.</p>
<p>Do you want to be an engineer or do are you more interested in Consulting, Finance, and Business post-college?</p>
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<p>It depends on what type of engineering to some degree. But Columbia’s ranked #16 in engineering overall versus #20 for Northwestern by USNews. So they’re roughly the same. Those are the grad school rankings which are probably the best way to get a sense of the strength of the faculty and research in specific areas or departments.</p>
<p>^^Overall engineering ranking is stupid. Graduate school applicants look at department ranking, not this overall engineering. </p>
<p>
I take it you meant to say Northwestern’s campus since Columbia’s campus is in Manhattan.<br>
Northwestern engineering has a unique freshmen curriculum that’s very hands-on and design oriented. You work on real projects given by industry clients. It also integrates math, programming, mechanics, and physics and teaches you how to apply them to variety of problems/cases. So you get exposed to engineering right away (in most other schools, you’d take basic sciences like other premeds/science majors and there’s (virtually) no engineering in your first year and maybe even much of the second year).
[Engineering</a> First ® Program: McCormick School of Engineering at Northwestern](<a href=“http://www.mccormick.northwestern.edu/undergraduates/curriculum/engineering_first/]Engineering”>Undergraduate Study | Academics | Northwestern Engineering)</p>
<p>In addition, Northwestern has one of the best engineering co-op programs in the country.
[Current</a> students: McCormick Office of Career Development: McCormick School of Engineering, Northwestern University](<a href=“http://co-op.mccormick.northwestern.edu/current/index.html]Current”>http://co-op.mccormick.northwestern.edu/current/index.html)</p>
<p>If you are really set on engineering, listen to Sam Lee and go to NU.</p>
<p>^^By the way, in department ranking, I think Northwestern is ranked higher in every discipline except EE. </p>
<p>It’s not difficult to figure how “overall” engineering ranking seem to contradict department rankings for certain schools (e.g. couple schools with almost no top-15 departments are ranked in the top-15 overall):
- % faculty with NAE membership. This one can easily be manipulated by schools that include emeritus/adjunct/board members…etc in their count. Also NAE memberships tend to concentrate in certain specialties such as EE and not others like industrial or enviromental engineering. Since US News uses percentage, this penalize schools that are strong in others but not, say, EE.
- Research expenditure/faculty. This number can fluctuate quite a bit from one year to the next. Also, expenditure tends to be larger in, say, EE projects than, say, enviormental engineering ones. So along with #1, this creates double-whammy for schools that are not strong in EE.</p>
<p>Thanks everyone!</p>
<p>@Sam Lee - I actually did mean that I prefer Columbia’s campus. I like Evanston (considering its proximity to Chicago) more than NYC, but I prefer Columbia’s tranquil, isolated campus to Northwestern’s. Also, I know all about the Engineering First program, Co-op and the entire “whole-brained engineer” idea, I have talked to plenty of people about it and went to the admitted students days. I ****ing love it. Earlier it was between NU and Wesleyan, because I LOVED the Wes atmosphere, but I ultimately chose NU based on the academic options it gave me, doing a masters in 4-5 years or doing co-op. The quarter system is also attractive but I hear many people who choose it don’t necessarily love it. </p>
<p>Thanks again, please keep it coming! Specifically, which school do you think would set me up better to either a) be a practical engineer right out of undergrad or b) get into grad school (prob MIT, I’m waitlisted there as well)? I’m not sure that I’d want to get into the business side…I might eventually, but for now I want to get my hands dirty!</p>
<p>Columbia SEAS does not require you to be an avid reader at all. You have to fulfill a set of humanities requirements but they’re not necessarily reading intensive.</p>
<p>I think it would really silly to opt for either Northwestern or Columbia for “strength in engineering”, when both are very strong engineering schools, while not being MIT. At Columbia many of the top engineers opt to go into finance, law & consulting and happen to place very well for these fields.</p>
<p>This doesn’t matter too much but Columbia SEAS is slightly more selective than McCormick:</p>
<p>[Columbia</a> University - 2010](<a href=“http://profiles.asee.org/profiles/5036/screen/19?school_name=Columbia+University]Columbia”>http://profiles.asee.org/profiles/5036/screen/19?school_name=Columbia+University)
[Northwestern</a> University - 2010](<a href=“http://profiles.asee.org/profiles/4757/screen/19?school_name=Northwestern+University]Northwestern”>http://profiles.asee.org/profiles/4757/screen/19?school_name=Northwestern+University)</p>
<p>acceptance rate: 13.4% vs. 27.3%
55% yield vs. 29% yield
sat scores:<br>
2110-2330 vs. 2080-2240</p>
<p>Honestly, NU and CU are very different environments so choose based on fit.</p>
<p>Both will get you to your next step equally: whether its graduate school, an engineering job, or consulting/finance. So it really does come down to fit. I think it sounds, based on what I can gather from your posts, that you might enjoy a traditional college life more than an urban campus. In that case pick Northwestern.</p>
<p>
I definitely think Engineering First curriculum would prepare you better as a practical engineer. That’s the whole point of the curriculum.
- Columbia’s first/second year curriculum has been around for decades. It’s virtually the same (minor change) one your father’s generation or even your grandfater’s generation took. [Engineering</a> First ® History: McCormick School of Engineering at Northwestern](<a href=“Undergraduate Study | Academics | Northwestern Engineering”>Undergraduate Study | Academics | Northwestern Engineering) This page sums up its disadvantages pretty well. But I’d like to elaborate a bit more:
Your first year in traditional curriculum has virtually no engineering component, let alone any engineering design. It’s mostly the same series of courses chemistry/physics major or premed take and sort of the more intense version of AP classes in high schools.<br>
What it means is classes are not integrated in an organized manner to let you apply what you learn effectively to a case or a scenario. For example, you’d take and learn the abstract of linear algebra and even though you understand what’s going on in the class, it’s often difficult to see why you are learning it. By the time you see an engineering problem that can be solved with linear algebra, in say, Junior year, you could have already forgotten much of it to know how to apply or worse, the use of linear algebra doesn’t even register in your mind. Or take computer programming for example. Traditional engineering would ask you to take a semester of programming class, likely, in C++ in the first year. Like stopping any new languguge after just one semester, many students don’t remember what they learn by the time they are sophomores. By the time they graduate, it’s almost as if they haven’t taken it. Computer language is like human language in that it takes time and lots of practices to become proficient. In Engineering First, you learn concepts and then get introduced to cases/problems that let you apply to the new concept as well as prior concepts you learned. Go back to linear algebra, here’s an example of a case where you get to apply linear algebra in EA-1 (first course in the sequence). <a href=“http://ea1.mccormick.northwestern.edu/casestudies/ea1io.pdf[/url]”>http://ea1.mccormick.northwestern.edu/casestudies/ea1io.pdf</a> Note how in this case study, you’d also learn a bit about economics and sensitivity analysis along with MATLAB coding simultaneously. There are 6 cases in that class.
So concepts are reinforced in an organzied manner throughout the 4-quarter sequence. Application with MATLAB is interwined throughout 4 quarters; so you get to practice and become proficient in using it to solve any engineering problems. It becomes soemthing you can take with you to your engineering career.<br>
Students’ feedback has been very positive, even though the curriculum means a busier first-year. Professors see positive changes in how students approach problems or cases.
Finally, the two EDC courses add another dimension that traditional curriculum lacks. You also have the option to continue to pursue more courses on product design within the Institute if you like.<br>
[url=<a href=“http://www.segal.northwestern.edu/undergraduate/edc/]EDC[/url”>DESIGN INNOVATION - Segal Design Institute, Northwestern University]EDC[/url</a>]</p>
<p>Here’s an article on 2010 placement and services McCormick provides: [Most</a> of McCormick Class of 2010 Had Jobs at Graduation: McCormick School of Engineering at Northwestern](<a href=“http://www.mccormick.northwestern.edu/news/articles/article_745.html]Most”>http://www.mccormick.northwestern.edu/news/articles/article_745.html)</p>