<p>We are flying east to visit a university where S has already been accepted, to see if it will be a good fit. We haven't seen it yet, having decided to postpone a visit until it became a serious possibility. We will be in the vicinity for several days and will have plenty of time to explore both the campus and the city. </p>
<p>I think we have a pretty good sense of how to evaluate a campus - H is a prof and we have lived on and near universities and colleges for our entire adult lives. But I would love CCers suggestions of the less obvious things to note. </p>
<p>For example, I am not sure I would have thought to ask about what cell phone service works best there unless I saw that pointer on CC. I will also check out close by hotels other than the one we are staying at, to see what might be best/most convenient for orientation/parents weekends. And I know H will check out the class book lists at the bookstore, to get a good sense of what various classes read in the disciplines he knows, as a way to evaluate classes that goes beyond sitting in on one or two. </p>
<p>I think your H has a good idea (as a college prof I do the same thing!) but likely won't learn that much since everyone tends to use similar books. To me, the interesting question is whether the kids are reading the stuff, and how committed they are to study as opposed to everything else that happens at college. So usually I head to the library to see how well used it is on a typical day or evening, and I examine the services it offers including electronic services (does it have JSTOR, does it subscribe to the various other on-line journal services across the disciplines?). </p>
<p>Also, I have my 5 minute test that I apply to any college, all from the library. This test has become less valid with the advent of online information. But I still use it. Go to the main reading room of the library. Watch and gauge the noise level and whether this is a place where students study as opposed to just socializing and yucking it up. Then go to the head and check out the grafitti. If the grafitti is just the usual scatological "roses are red" variety, this college is low brow. If (at the other extreme) the grafitti borders on epic poetry, with successive visitors adding points of view or lines or whatever, then you have an intellectual campus. (If there is no grafitti, well this campus stifles authentic communication!)</p>
<p>Maybe this is obvious, I don't know. Along the lines of cell phone service, we looked around campus/town, and compared notes, about what would it be like to be a freshman with no car - where's the bank, drugstore, Walmart's, where, Heaven forbid, is the hospital (I didn't share that concern with the kid), hair salon. If a campus failed the "can walk to it" test, we started asking questions about how freshman got these services. Hitching a ride, and buying at the college-run campus store answers earned points off. The bare minimum was a bank and drugstore within walking distance.
I also did a variation of Mackinaw's library survey. I could never study in the library, so we looked for what kids were reading/doing as they were snacking or hanging out during the day all over campus - lots of kids with open books,especially in ones and twos, earned intellectual points</p>
<p>Look at the bulletin boards to see what sort of social and other events are being publicized. See what it feels like in the dining hall or halls (not just the quality of the food but how or if people interact). See how people are dressed--not as superficial as it sounds, since to some extent taste in clothing does reflect worldview (not talking about expense, but about overall look). Go to a class in an area that already interests you to see if it's even better than you expect. Go to an a cappella concert or a sports event to see if it is well or at least enthusiastically attended.</p>
<p>There is another way to use that bookstore visit. In most large lecture courses (esp. at introductory level), faculty will use a text -- and typically one of the top, widely used texts. But you can learn something if that text is supplemented in some way with additional books. (You can also check out whether the profs perhaps use a coursepak of supplemental readings.) Also, in many upper division courses there may not be any standard text, and there you may well see how creative or demanding the prof is being.</p>
<p>More generally, the less the reliance just on one text the more the prof is investing in the course and the greater the expectations of student effort. In a typical large intro course, for example, I might use just one text, and perhaps assign papers or other readings that the students would obtain on-line. Still, however, just one text. But if this were an honors course -- with the <em>same</em> course title -- I might assign that text plus 2 or 3 other books. At some colleges and universities you will find that what I described as the reading load for an honors course will be typical of all courses (speaking of humanities and social sciences here). And at some others, you will find that many faculty avoid using any main "text" but will only assign coursepacks or several books, even in intro courses. Those are perhaps the most demanding courses.</p>
<p>cangel gave some good advice. Think about being there without a car and check out the town as well.</p>
<p>For my son, he was specifically looking for the availability of wireless internet, not just everywhere on campus, but in the surrounding town as well. I think he fell in love with Athens, Ohio when we were sitting in a coffee shop and he got 5 or 6 different wireless networks at once.</p>
<p>Most of all, don't rush the visit (if this is a serious possibility, stay two nights so you have a FULL day and an evening on campus). Also try to find a way for your son to meet and talk to real students (away from the tour group and the adults). </p>
<p>Check the calendar of events when you arrive on campus (or before) - there's ALWAYS something going on - and go (or have your son go) participate in that event (dance, play, evening talk, whatever...).</p>
<p>Mack focuses on the library but at the college my son attends every academic building has a lounge or study where students congregate. Search them out too. Spend some time in the Union and observe the students. We once were entertained by an accomplished classical musician, who was immediately followed by a student playing show tunes. What a treat! </p>
<p>Most departments will sponsor seminars or colloquila. Find out what they offer and maybe even sit in on one. Study the departmental bulletin boards. They will often tell you what companies have scheduled recruiting visits, what fellowships are being offered for its grad students, what the department is offering its students outside the classroom. Our son's department sponsors a lunch seminar every other Wednesday and they provide the lunch!</p>
<p>Do not hesitate to wander about the academic buildings. Are the faculty in their offices? Are their doors open? Are the research labs in use? During visits to Case and Rochester, a faculty member greeted us and at Rochester gave us a cooks tour of the department facilities. </p>
<p>Check out the services offered in the Union. Is there a bank. a convenience store, an ATM. Are there cafes scattered about campus or coffee kiosks scattered about the campus? These have made life simpler for my son.</p>
<p>Check out the surrounding neighborhoods. Many students choose to live off campus at some point in time. Is the area safe? What internet service is offered?</p>
<p>Check out the student publications. The newspaper is on line but they probably also publish a humor and or cultural rag too. Son's college publishes something called Statler and Waldorf which is ironically entertaining.</p>
<p>Listen to the campus radio station. You may not like what they are playing but it may be "interesting". Look at the displays of student/ faculty work in the academic buildings. Is any undergrad work on display? </p>
<p>Visit the campus early(before 8:30) and late(after 7:30) and observe the goings on. </p>
<p>Take in a student play or concert. Attend a college athletic game. </p>
<p>Basically look in the college's nooks and crannies. This will be your child's home for 4 years!</p>
<p>oog - good points. It reminds me of the first time we went into the building which housed the major where my son would eventually decide he wanted to spend his next four years. We were just wandering and checking things out. Someone walked by, saw us, introduced himself, and gave us an on-the-spot tour of all the facilities. That says something about the people in the building.</p>
<p>The same thing happened when we visited MIT's Media Lab. What an incredible place. Someone noticed my son peering in through the glass doors of the Lifelong Kindergarden Laboratory (where Lego MindStorms were developed) and invited him in to show him all the neat things in there.</p>
<p>These things make a huge difference in how one feels about a place.</p>
<p>One thing to remember, and this is tough, is to let your child take the lead, with questions, etc. Maybe there is a way D can take a tour and you and H go off to explore other parts of the campus. Sometimes people will ask questions they really want to know about if their parents aren't right there. Anyway, that is how my D's work.</p>
<p>Second that one. Once you have made a list of questions you and the student wants answered, and together figured out a way you might get them answered, split up. Take separate tours, or separate sections of tours. Visit the library (and elsewhere) separately. If possible, eat separately. If parents are invited into classes, go to different classes from that of the student. Explore the very same questions, but separately; then get back together and compare notes. Yes, it means both of you will miss some. But while it is your job to offer more perspecitive, ultimately it is the student who has to spend 4 years there - preferably without you present!</p>
<p>This is kind of a weird one, but if time allows, find a place on campus where you feel completely comfortable. Just walk around and look for places that feel familiar.</p>
<p>DS found that he got great info by chatting with kids eating in the student unions. He struck up conversations with students everywhere we went. It was interesting for him to hear the students speak about their college. You mention that H and your family will be able to evaluate the colleges...but remember too, that this is your son's college trip. In the end, it should be his evaluation of the place that matters (although as a parent, I agree that you should have some input also). The things that matter to the students in terms of "fit" are sometimes very different than what matters to the parents.</p>
<p>Check the vehicular/pedestrian patterns. Is the campus safe for walking, especially at night? Are vehicles obeying traffic laws? Visit campus security and ask to see tallies of on-campus incidents. These questions may seem trivial, but you don't want the police waking you up at midnight to tell you that your child was killed on campus in a traffic accident.</p>
<p>Some of these ideas are too good to pass up, so here are some of them all in one place:</p>
<p>[ul]
[<em>] Check cell phone service to see which carrier/plan would be best.
[</em>] Check nearby hotels to see which would be best for move-in/parents day, etc
[<em>] Check library for services, student demeanor, etc.
[</em>] Check bathrooms to see what type of grafitti you find
[<em>] Check campus and town for student w/o car
[</em>] Check bulletin boards to see what kind of events are being publicized
[<em>] Attend an on-campus event
[</em>] Check out typical student dress
[<em>] Check bookstore for supplemental class material
[</em>] Check availability of wireless internet
[<em>] Take a full day and don't rush the visit
[</em>] Check out student lounges and study areas
[<em>] Have your student talk to other students
[</em>] Check department bulletin boards (jobs, internships, symposia, etc)
[<em>] Wander about the academic buildings: doors open? labs in use? professors in their offices?
[</em>] Check out services offered by the student union
[<em>] Read the student publications
[</em>] Check out the surrounding neighborhoods
[<em>] Listen to the campus radio station
[</em>] Let your student take the lead in exploring and asking questions
[<em>] Explore separately (tours, classes, etc)
[</em>] Ask how professors are addressed (Dr, Prof, first-name)
[<em>] Look for places on campus where you can feel comfortable
[</em>] Remember that what makes a good fit for your student may not be the same thing as you think makes a good fit.
[/ul]</p>
<p>I have a son graduating from college this year, and a daughter who is a freshman in college this year. My daughter and I took a trip visiting colleges during her Junior year spring break (my husband couldn't make it). We visited 4 campuses in a week--24 hours of total driving time. It was an incredible experience, and we learned so much. We spent a fair amount of time just getting a feeling for each campus. I took tons of notes about each campus...don't assume you will remember in a few months...take lots of photos...its hard to remember what each college looked like (especially dorm rooms). We watched for things like: is there a lot of trash laying around? (shows a certain amount of disrespect for the school). Are there a lot of smokers (my daughter was totally turned off by one school because everywhere she went there was a cloud of smoke.)
We observed a lecture at each the schools that we could arrange it...We were astounded at the lack of respect the students showed at some of the schools (several students walking in 20 minutes late for a lecture...students talking among themselves during the whole professor's lecture...garbage and beer bottles in the stairwells) also watch the general enthusiasm of the professor and his students--they don't have to be rowdy, but it should fit your student's learning style. After our trip, my daughter's first choice school had dropped to her last choice spot, and the school that I convinced her to visit (because it had a great program...and is on the way anyway) now was her first choice.
Watch out for other people's opinions of the schools...she didn't want to visit the school she now attends (and loves) because someone had told her they hated the campus..Meanwhile, this student ended up going to a school that my daughter absolutely hated after her own tour...so people's opinions differ, let your student figure out what fits him/her best. Don't let the tour ruin your total impression of the college...we had a terrible tour guide, but ended up loving the school.
Visit the library..are people studying there or just being social...are there areas to be social (or work on group projects). What is the general atmosphere...are the students walking together to classes and talking or are they alone? Ask questions to the students on campus...my daughter enjoys talking to prospective students because she was in that same situation herself. We did end up buying a Student ******* book for her top choice school just to see if we were missing anything...It seemed to be very accurate, and the negatives that they seemed to talk about were actually positives for her (studious environment, serious learning environment). Also, check how the different schools treat you...do they act like you are bothering them? Read the student newspaper and the posters on campus. One campus only seemed to express liberal views with no conservative views apparent.
You can learn alot on the college websites..search their websites for things you are interested in. My daughter learned alot about the depth of programs among various colleges. Sure, they offer a degree in a subject, but do they have the breadth of classes to support the degree, or are you forced to take the same classes as everyone else regardless of your interests? Find out what the professors are researching...are you keenly interested in some of this research? Search for the public safety log...generally lists all of the crimes on or near campus each month...can be enlightening--just because a campus is in a city doesn't mean it has to have to be dangerous. Is public transportation available or do you need a car? Are there alot of jobs available on campus? Do you need to be on work study in order to get one? Some colleges reserve their jobs for work study students. Hope this helps...</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Ask how professors are addressed>></p>
</blockquote>
<br>
<p>My S has taken one course with a prof who shows up in suits but invites students to call him by his first name, and with one prof whom students call Prof... but showed up in September in shorts and T shirt. Don't know what to make of that.</p>
<p>In many ways, we are old hands at this - we rarely go anywhere without some sort of campus visit, as H enjoys a busman's holiday as part of whatever else we are doing. And we went through it once before with older D. But as one of you pointed out, this is S's campus visit, not H's or D's.... I knew this group would have great ideas and that others would probably find them valuable too. </p>
<p>The suggestion about wireless internet is not one I would have thought of, and the graffiti analysis is great!</p>
<p>We will have ample time there and plan to let S basically do what he wants, armed with a list of "check out these things if you can." We will also check out stuff too, independently. S is a very friendly kid. On the last two campus visits, done with my H, he easily met many kids and spent only one night in the hotel, as he was invited to stay in the dorms with kids on the lacrosse team, and others he met. He exercised in the weight room, went to class, visited a frat, etc. - it seemed like he did everything but study! I hope this visit will be even better than those - doing it as an accepted HS student will surely feel different - more like a prospie weekend, except that he'll see the campus as it typically is, without all the stuff they do to impress the prospective students!</p>
<p>Thanks everyone, and keep those ideas coming! They are great!</p>
<p>I think eating in the main college cafeteria is very telling --- but don't just eat, have your kid break off from you and go up to order on their own. My daughter likes to eavesdrop on the conversations she hears while waiting on the food line -- she has learned some interesting things that way. And, don't be shy about asking if you can plunk down at a tableful of students to eat --- if they seem wary of strangers, my daughter takes that as a sign that people are not very outgoing. Even just watching how other kids in the cafeteria watch YOUR kid while they are wandering around can be telling.</p>