NPR College Admissions Story

Parents Forum
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<p>Why are people generalizing? Of course homeschooling will have a spectrum just like normal high schoolers. I know an acquaintance, who has never held a FT job for more than six months, has terrible social skills and simply, uses bankruptcy laws as an excuse to spend up their credit cards, is a not bright in the slightest. Has three preschool kids on the autism spectrum – one severely. Her goal? She’s gonna homeschool all three because she doesn’t like “the system”.</p>

<p>Sure, she’s an extreme example of a train wreck in the offing. But why is it surprising to see spectacular homeschool kids at the opposite end as well?</p>

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<p>The recent stats re homeschoolers success in college were, as I recall, a limited pool- they were, I believe, for kids accepted to certain colleges- not across the board.</p>

<p>Nonetheless, fact is, many homeschool families DO follow a currciulum. It may be Christian-based, with classes in theology or it can be any of a number of certified formats that DO include the same boring subjects as a public or private hs offers. The difference is, sometimes, that the home school kids aren’t restricted to a year of x. They could concievably breeze through it and move on to something more intriguing.</p>

<p>Many bright home kids DO take upper level on-line courses or comm coll courses. If anything, I would compare the level of some home kids’ learning skills to grad school, where personal motivation, organization and ability to seek out support are critical. The problem is where any “curriculum” veers off track. Mom and Dad have a huge responsibility here- and many are not qualified to mentor or teach- or, in some cases, judge the appropriateness. And, their recommendations don’t bear the weight of a trained, experienced educator, who has had much experience with a variety of kids and can write comparatively. How does Dad write, “one of the best I’ve ever taught?”</p>

<p>Scoring an 800…we’ve been through the arguments. Some kids test better than others, the standardized tests are imperfect, and there is an issue with how written portions are graded. I am always in awe of a kid who gets any high score, but my awe is limited to the context.</p>

<p>A rigorous classical education is great- that would be my husband’s goal, if he had control- but, it is not what makes college success. It is impressive, yes.</p>

<p>And, the kid still needs to show he is “well rounded” and able to face a competely different learning environment, where classes can be large, the pacing is different and access to mentoring is harder to achieve.</p>

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<p>^^overall, for bright & motivated students, I believe homeschooling offers more opportunities to shine in college admissions than otherwise. Also, in my fantasies, it seemed that at least the application has a chance to get closely read since it won’t fit the norm? (is that true, lookingforward? Do they go in a separate “smaller” pile?:))</p>

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<p>This is my observation, too, and at least some of these students will have unsolicited and outstanding recommendations from profs whose classes they have taken at local universities during the “school” year or during summer programs. Some of them have already done some cross-listed graduate courses. Some have done more than that. Successfully completed college coursework in the area of interest would seem a good support to a homeschool application.</p>

<p>I understand not all homeschoolers have that opportunity. All public school students don’t have all opportunities either.</p>

<p>Is it possible for a homeschooled student, who doesn’t have the opportunity for college course work to submit writing samples impressive enough to successfully grab the admissions officer’s attention… more on the order of a graduate school admissions essay statement of interest/purpose? one that would be sent to the appropriate department for evaluation?</p>

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<p>I’ve seen somewhere it’s lower than that for Harvard. That’s probably one of the reasons why lots of people applying at there. Next year’s acceptance rate could be 5% or lower. But, when I checked who got into Harvard, their average SAT M/V were 750/745 a few years back.</p>

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<p>That’s a fine boy, mathmom.</p>

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<p>LadyDianeski: For the record, a full tuition merit scholarship seems to me an extremely successful homeschooling end result. I believe all my homeschool friends would agree and see it as a reason for celebration. Your son’s application was obviously excellent. I am just thinking about this in general terms since you raised the issue.</p>

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<p>Did you use Well Trained Mind, just out of curiosity?</p>

<p>I think their education sounds wonderful – and all the more reason that you would think that an essay could be where children educated like this could really shine, be articulate and say something different from what your average public-school-educated child could say.</p>

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<p>Alh, IME, they didn’t get a special pile, but the fact they were home schooled was always noted by reviewers. When a homeschooler excelled, in all the ways the team needed him to, he always got special recognition, with that smidgen of extra emphasis onthe fact that they had done xyz outside the typical hs framework. </p>

<p>It can be quite impressive to read a home kid’s application. Many set their own schedules and use the free time to do great things. Some families use the flexibility to expose their kids to all sorts of fascinating experiences and efforts. In contrast, some come across as very limited by their family lifestyle preferences. It may start another argument, but it’s no secret that some home schooled kids are more sheltered than worldly. (This includes kids who only want to study.)</p>

<p>Any applicant is measured against the greater pool of kids applying from across the country and against the competiton in his region and high school. This is part of making a good mix. Some colleges include home school in their profiles of the recent admitted freshman class- incl % accepted.</p>

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<p>Btw, excellence in Latin- even just taking it 4 years through hs, was also impressive. Same for Russian and Chinese and etc. </p>

<p>But, kids are only known through their app packages. What they studied, an award, a great SAT, are only part of the picture. The rest of the picture comes from (here, we are cycling back) the activities, recommendations- and essays.</p>

<p>The wise parent puts his energy into helping the kid make wise decisions through hs- this includes all the components. Since he is applying to a college, with its own identity and needs, getting admitted is about more than what the applicant thinks of himself or what the parent thinks. </p>

<p>Also, (and this is a common thought on CC,) the wise parent helps kiddo find a number of schools he could be happy at, puts the effort into the research and visits, talks with him about the realities of getting accepted to a “dream school.” And, teaches him that, as in life, we don’t always get what we want most or feel we deserve most. Helping your child “be happy” wherever he ends up, is an important parental job.</p>

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<p>lookingforward: thanks for sharing! and taking the time to describe behind the scenes.</p>

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<p>All the homeschool families I know understand this will have to be dealt with in the application. I guess maybe there is a greater burden on the homeschooled applicant to demonstrate that they will be able contribute socially to the college… but essentially all successful applicants, homeschooled or not, have to demonstrate this? or not? Will a student from a small Christian Academy have the same obstacle to overcome?</p>

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<p>agree!! this could be a thread title</p>

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I would certainly think so–and it might even be more problematic, depending on what the school’s website looks like!</p>

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<p>Honestly, I’m not sure that “worldly” is all it’s cracked up to be, or that being worldly should be considered a selling point for college admissions, nor that sheltered should be the kiss of death. Part of the reason we spend money to send our kids to private school is to shelter them – from drugs, gangs, etc. I think part of the reason people aspire to do well financially is so that they CAN shelter their kids. </p>

<p>And some elements of being worldly – experimenting with drugs and sex come to mind – actually show an absence of character and an inability to delay gratification, neither of which would necessarily suggest that one is likely to succeed academically. </p>

<p>It also seems disingenous that adcoms are turning backflips to recruit someone who is a Masai who grew upon a reservation in Kenya and has never left Africa – which hardly suggests worldliness – yet would ding an American kid who has been similarly sheltered. Unless of course there were a double standard at work . .</p>

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<p>*A rigorous classical education is great- that would be my husband’s goal, if he had control- but, it is not what makes college success. *</p>

<p>?? Why not? (Sincere question.)</p>

<p>Alh: I completely agree – we are thrilled with the outcome (near full ride at UA). </p>

<p>I confess that I am just a little bit PO’d at our in-state schools, though, especially App State (which practically begged DS to attend but apparently didn’t want him enough to shell out any dinero) and Asheville (where DS was not deemed worthy to even apply for a scholarship worth as little as $1,000). Both schools admitted DS to their honors programs; at both, DS was significantly above 75th percentile. But, at both, when it came to merit aid…well, Gaspard the Miser and Ebenezer Scrooge (combined and cubed) could scarcely have been more parsimonious.</p>

<p>It’s OK. All’s well that ends well. And I still love living here in beautiful NC, despite the stinginess of some of our higher-ed institutions. :D</p>

<p>Di</p>

<p>P.S. Pizza Girl – no, we used Laura Berquist’s Designing Your Own Classical Curriculum as a springboard, but DH went beyond it and put together his own classical curriculum. :)</p>

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<p>Momzie – Amen!!! Agree 100%. :)</p>

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<p>The reality seems to be at many state schools that regardless of how fine an applicant is, the money simply isn’t there.</p>

<p>When states are defunding their public institutions, when economic factors cause endowments to decline, when staff and courses are cut, when tuition and fees rise faster than inflation, you have to bet that public universities can’t give out huge scholarships.</p>

<p>Perhaps they used to be able to. Maybe not so much, anymore.</p>

<p>It’s always been pretty rare for an applicant to get a full ride at our state universities in California based on merit. </p>

<p>In fact, I know of nobody who has ever gotten one in my state based on academic qualifications alone. I know of kids with excellent aid packages that had need and merit, but nothing close to a full ride.</p>

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<p>re. sheltering students</p>

<p>During a dinner, I once sat next to graduate student who took the opportunity to tell me about her experience as a homeschooled student arriving on a large California college campus and being completely unprepared for coping with the environment in which she found herself. Years later she was still very upset with her parents for putting her in that position. It made quite an impression on me.</p>

<p>The reason I post it here is because that student was trying to get that message out to as wide an audience as possible. And it did seem to me she had a valid complaint.</p>

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<p>Sheltering is sheltering. Homeschooling is something else. The homeschooled kids I’ve known have been anything but sheltered, and in fact they’ve spent more time in the outside world than they’d have been able to if they were in institutional school for so many hours, days, weeks, months, years of their young lives.</p>

<p>So the girl at your dinner may well have had a beef with her parents for having sheltered her. My own kids have thanked me many times for letting them grow with so much more freedom than they would have had as traditional students. Of course, they don’t need to thank me; I just got us started homeschooling, whether or not to continue was always their choice.</p>

<p>So, I’m not dismissing what the girl at dinner told you about her experience; I’m just saying that it’s the sheltering that is the problem, not simply getting one’s education outside of the traditional institutional setting. It’s the same with people criticizing homeschooling because there are those who do it that are very religious and dogmatic. Maybe the complaint should be lodged against their religious practices instead? But no, that would be incendiary, right? So blame it on homeschooling. We were always involved with counter-cultural, free-spirited, hippie-throwback homeschooling communities – :wink: – that were anything but dogmatic or conservative. I’m sure there are people who have a problem with that, too, because something about it seems like the wrong way to raise kids (no chores? no homework? no shoes?), but if they do, the problem isn’t homeschooling. It’s parenting choices. Homeschooling looks different from family to family. In fact it can look SO different that it’s hard to believe two homeschooling families have in common a single thing.</p>

<p>My homeschooled kids were both in classes at college before they ever even applied to be “real” college students. When they first stepped foot on their campus as matriculated freshmen, they were much more accustomed to it then their fellow freshmen who had been “sheltered” in high school. To them it was nothing new at all. One was 14 when she first took a class at a college, the other 16.</p>

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<p>It seems to me that homeschooling is somewhere between homecooking and home dentistry, in terms of the consequences if the practitioner turns out not to be that good at providing the service.</p>

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<p>^^'rentof2: I agree with everything you wrote above. Sheltering is the issue. It could also be an issue with a private/religious school student. Or not. </p>

<p>I absolutely understand differences in homeschooling styles. :slight_smile: </p>

<p>But probably parents, who advocate sheltering, should take that into account in helping their kids choose colleges</p>

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<p>I agree, alh. It does seem odd that the parents of the grad student you talked to didn’t direct her to a smaller school for starters!</p>