NPR: College Costs Are Daunting, Even For The 'Comfortable'

Parent Cafe
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I don’t think griping on a message board or even in real life makes one a bad person. I think it just gives others something to look down upon. We all have things to gripe about from time to time and the point of this article was that sometimes even “comfortable” families have difficulties, surprises and gripes. Makes us all human.</p>

<p>I don’t think the system is terrible either. Nothing can be everything to everybody. It’s mostly ok, mostly fair, but too expensive for reasons both good and bad. I am beyond grateful that people like us could get two of our three kids through college (if anyone would like to pray for someone, my son would be a good candidate) but sometimes the fact that we haven’t vacationed in 15 years wears, not because I envy my wretched niece’s fabulous vacations or those of the peole down the street, but because we get tired, too. Who doesn’t? I would like to find one person who doesn’t occasionally wish for a break or more something special. When I find that person, I will find someone who has already had that break, whether they choose to admit it or not.</p>

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<p>Blossom,
I reread those posts and didn’t see poor bashing or envy either. It is a fact that paying nothing for college is more affordable than paying full price. That is not controversial to me.</p>

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<p>Completely agree. That’s why all the bashing of public-sector workers makes me so furious. All these people who never wanted to be a teacher or a firefighter or a lineman for the utility company because they saw more upside in other professions now feel free to bash those who chose the unpleasant/difficult/career-limiting jobs initially (and even worse, advocate for taking away benefits that were part of their original employment contract). Grrrr.</p>

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<p>I believe this(#32) may have been the statement that started the whole thing. And as Blossom stated, this was in response to the chain from 29 to 31.</p>

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<p>Context matters. That was about the financial aid problem.</p>

<p>In other words: The needy do not have this affordability problem.</p>

<p>So, if that started it, then it was misinterpreted. In fact, the response to it is agreement. Really, how can anyone disagree that trying to afford something is harder if you have to pay for it. This is getting silly. imho.</p>

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<p>Oh, good grief. </p>

<p>Of course there are consequences for choices. Not everyone has the same ability to make choices. </p>

<p>It is entirely possible that poor people have to spend most or all of their income on necessities – shelter, food, basic clothing. They don’t have the ability to save large sums for college because they don’t have “excess” income. Their children are also likely to be in schools which may not prepare them as well. They may also be working two or three jobs, so they can’t spend as much time “helicopter” parenting to be sure that Johnny understands his math. And they may be poor because they never had educational opportunities and they don’t have the knowledge to help Johnny with his math. That doesn’t mean that the poor parents are unable to influence Johnny to work hard and learn, perhaps by saying, “It’s miserable being poor. Work hard so you don’t have to.” Refusing aid to kids in these circumstances may mean that the kids either go to CC and hope to get a job so that they can finance their own educations fully, or it may be that the next generation will be poor as well. People are not necessarily poor because they are lazy. You can work a lot of hours at minimum wage and not grow any wealth, and if it’s necessary to work those hours to provide (even for yourself, without getting into discussions about whether poor people should have more children than they can support), you don’t have time to get a better education and therefore a better job.</p>

<p>People with more income do make choices about how to save it or spend it. They could live like the poor people and save a fortune. They could live somewhat better and save quite a bit. They could life up to or beyond their means and save nothing. </p>

<p>By the way, in some professions, there is an expectation that you must participate in certain activities in order to move up the ladder financially. If you’re an engineer, it is possible that no one cares where you live or how you dress as long as you do great work. If you’re in sales, and most are, including accountants and lawyers, who must be “rainmakers” to make more money, you’d better be out in your community, dressed appropriately, going to events that cost money, or you never meet anyone to sell your services to. So, no, not everyone can “choose not to spend money.” You can be as frugal as your circumstances permit.</p>

<p>College costs a lot. It can be shocking to anyone, no matter what their economic level. People who saved a lot may find that the flagship U is what you can afford. We may have hoped that saving from when our children were small would fund more choices. For our family, we saved enough to afford state U and that’s okay with me. </p>

<p>And I do think, as someone else said, that there are certain prestige schools that only the wealthy, those willing to go into a lot of debt, or the less wealthy but extraordinarily qualified will get to attend.</p>

<p>If everyone got to go to them, they wouldn’t be elite. I don’t live in an elite world. Am I jealous sometimes? Yes. Am I justified in being jealous? Probably not.</p>

<p>I think where we get into trouble is when we start judging everyone else.</p>

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<p>Except for a tiny handful of poor students at meet-full-need schools, the poor DO have to pay for it. With far fewer resources.</p>

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<p>It was also in the context of the UC’s which fully fund families up to 80K. </p>

<p>Again, context matters.</p>

<p>Maybe, CA is an outlier here but I know more than a handful of fully-funded kids personally and none of them are poor. At least, they don’t think they are poor. They have homes, cars, vacations, and food. My kids go to the movies with them. I’m not making things up about imaginary poor people. And, I’m resentful of no-one. Does that help?</p>

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<p>As state schools meeting full need goes, it actually is. I don’t think even 5 states do it.</p>

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<p>"“Right, but it’s much worse for the “comfortable” than the needy. People forget this for some reason.”</p>

<p>“Don’t accuse me of setting up straw man arguments- this is a direct quote from earlier in this thread, and as I’ve pointed out, I think it’s irritating to insist that poor people have it made. In what world is it worse for the “comfortable” than the needy?”</p>

<p>I think you totally misread this statement that seems to be where the offending premise is. You are reading this as someone saying life overall is worse for the comfortable than the needy. It seems obvious to me that the statement was referring to tuition payments being more difficult for those who have to pay for it. As actingmt said, “Really, how can anyone disagree that trying to afford something is harder if you have to pay for it.”</p>

<p>Nothing in the posts that you quoted appear to be saying that life is easier for the poor. I think you merely misread this (certainly according to the poster who wrote it), and perhaps seen things from other threads that you’re thinking of.</p>

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<p>Who would have imagined that things could get this costly?
Of course, people have to make choices, but I once imagined that $200K/year would easily support a comfortable lifestyle with so much left over that college costs would be a non-issue. This is no longer the case.</p>

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<p>Deskpotato, if someone had told me at 30 that I would be making 6 figures, counting my pennies, worrying about tuition, and wondering about retirement, I wouldn’t have believed them. </p>

<p>Who would have imagined?</p>

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<p>Yay! back on topic…</p>

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<p>It would be nice if getting an acceptance letter from a college meant you got to go there. It is less than ideal to have to wait for the FA letter too. Very few can afford the sticker price of college these days. It is what it is.</p>

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<p>And yet 55% of the students at Duke are full pays. At WashU (“WUSTL”) it’s 60%, at Georgetown 64%. Others are nearly as high: 58% at Brown, 58% at USC, 56% at Penn, 54% at Northwestern, 54% at Emory, 52% at Vanderbilt, 50% at Dartmouth, 48% at Columbia. It may be the case that among the population generally, very few people can afford the sticker price of college. Yet elite colleges are chock-a-block with people who apparently can, or at least are choosing to do so.</p>

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<p>There are a million + graduates each year from high schools. </p>

<p>If we assume 30,000 seats at some of the elite schools and assume about 60% full pays across board, that is 18,000 students.</p>

<p>Top 1.8% in a million people - easily converts back to the income curve across a population. :p</p>

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<p>Seeing the breakdown that bclinonk and texaspg posted helps me realize these expensive elite schools will always find parents who are willing and able to pay full price. I am coming to the conclusion that the reason why these schools seem out of my price range is simply because they are. This is despite the fact that people tell me financial aid will bring the cost down or at my income bracket I should be able to pay the cost without a problem. Fortunately, D1 is an introvert and wants to attend the largest and warmest university possible. These elite schools aren’t even on her radar. As a parent, I will always wonder “what if?”</p>

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<p>" It may be the case that among the population generally, very few people can afford the sticker price of college. Yet elite colleges are chock-a-block with people who apparently can, or at least are choosing to do so. "</p>

<p>I agree.</p>

<p>“ELITE” = “VERY FEW”</p>

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<p>The costs are substantially higher as a percent of income in general, but private colleges were always full of full pay kids. It’s a recent phenom and probably due to the concept of merit as tuition discounting that private colleges even became a accepted alternative. If a private college wants to make itself affordable to the equivalent of the in-state, then who is going to look a gift horse in the mouth? Conversely, if we couldn’t afford it, we couldn’t afford it and end of discussion with the kids and for each kid it did take a college or two or three off the initial list. Since when did a private education become a “right?” And yes, of course the costs are shocking, even for the “comfortable.” That is not really an argument. I find it far more disturbing that the cost of public education has risen so far but that falls at the feet of the taxpayers and the institution administration.</p>

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<p>Also, my comment is that nobody should be too overconfident about receiving lots of merit aid at the desirable small privates. Many of them are notorious for giving little money. In many areas of the country, a large majority of the population has a family EFC which is too high to qualify for need-based aid, even though they are far from living on “easy street” in the real world. Plan for your worst-case scenario, and have financial safety schools that your kids are happy applying to. </p>