<p>Found on Yahoo Finance- <a href="https://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/college-costs-unaffordable-for-students-174357548.html">https://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/college-costs-unaffordable-for-students-174357548.html</a></p>
<p>This is very sad and true for so many young people and their parents who are trying to make college work. </p>
<p><a href="https://www.facebook.com/nyudebtstories">https://www.facebook.com/nyudebtstories</a></p>
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<p>That says it all. What that young woman chose to do, and what her family allowed her to do, was irresponsible and foolish. It’s hard to have much sympathy.</p>
<p>From the article – “Lucy Parks, 18, enrolled at New York University in 2012 armed with a $60,000 college fund — the fruit of decades worth of her parents’ diligent saving — and a $30,000 annual scholarship from the school itself.” </p>
<p>I would wager that is better financial position than a lot of folks. To her credit, she appears smart enough to have made the decision not to take on debt she couldn’t afford after going through her college fund and renewing her education elsewhere. Sounds fairly responsible to me. </p>
<p>“That says it all. What that young woman chose to do, and what her family allowed her to do, was irresponsible and foolish. It’s hard to have much sympathy.”</p>
<p>And no sympathy for the 100+ kids on the facebook page? <a href=“NYU Debt Stories”>https://www.facebook.com/nyudebtstories</a> Glad you are doing so well. </p>
<p>Yeah, that’s crazy. In other countries, people see young people as a resource to be developed for the good of the whole country. Here they’re just another profit center. </p>
<p><a href=“Obama answers Tumblr questions on college loans”>Obama answers Tumblr questions on college loans;
<p>You guys are talking about one of the most expensive private schools in one of the most expensive cities in the nation and one of the least likely to end with a pay-off majors possible. I mean no offense but a little economic sense is not too much to expect from anyone. It really isn’t. Would we be sympathetic if she bought a mansion when she could only afford a condo? I doubt it. Just sayin’.</p>
<p>@nightowl2, are you addressing @alwaysamom? I’m thinking yes.</p>
<p>Her comment isn’t intended to be offensive - it’s practical and honest. Actingmt above says it all. NYU is indeed one of the most expensive private schools in the most expensive city in the US. And NYU is notorious for not offering a boat load of aid that isn’t need-based. So that 60K war chest she had? it was factored into the math of the aid this student received. All of this is very well known and clearly this is not something that just drama majors need to consider.</p>
<p>Actingdad, makes a good point above. However his daughter, as an example, had the luxury of choosing a fantastic program at a (way) less expensive school. Perspective could have been different though if her (then) top choice school had come through as an option (in the vicinity of cost of NYU) and she had picked it over completely fantastic cheaper school. Then like so many of us, he would be in the same position of paying a fortune for the least-likely to end with a pay off majors possible and would either try to justify it, or just say… it’s what I did for love. </p>
<p>I understand it’s a practical and honest opinion. I also believe some empathy is warranted. The costs associated with a college education is a national problem not just restricted to NYU, and for our BFA-MTs attending a less expensive community college, then transferring, is not an option. How many young people have to give up their dream to go to college because of finances? Too many. I have been hearing more and more about students dropping out. I, for one, am worried about this generation’s future. </p>
<p>There’s no question the rising cost of college is a problem. NYU creative writing girl with a 60-thousand dollar budget and plans to earn the rest while in school is a really bad example, though. </p>
<p>I agree with you @nightowl2, but if you read these threads (both this one and the theatre thread), many talented kids get a TON of aid at really legitimate schools all over the country. This is the theatre/MT world… but extrapolate that to other majors all over the place. I have a senior son who graduated last week. He’s a science guy likely to be something else before he is finished. He is blessed to have attended a great HS with college bound seniors, many of whom got BOAT LOADS of merit aid though they are from families that won’t blink at tuition to attend schools all over the country that seem to recruit good students regardless of their ability to pay. I can only conclude that if you are a highly capable student (or even a less capable one but one with a great list of schools), you can go to college on the cheap. If you decide to pick a known expensive school you cannot afford that doesn’t care about merit… buyer beware.</p>
<p>Point being, if money is a “thing” and you are a good student, you will have a smorgasbord of schools that will make it financially easy for you to attend. NYU will never ever be among them so there is no reason to just kick it around for sport as if they are baiting and switching. That’s so blatantly known and anyone who makes the mistake of thinking you can go there on the cheap better recheck their award letters. It’s not something that is best served by an after the fact facebook page that just won’t change the reality of the math. YES… dreadfully expensive. So is living in New York City any time after you get whatever degree from much less expensive school. Ironically… minimum wage is less than $8/hour there. How can that be? Meanwhile my city just passed a $15/hour minimum. Sigh. If only that actually applied to actors.</p>
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<p>Leaving, yes, but the more responsible decison would have been to choose a school whose annual costs were not $60,000+. Whether her position was better than others isn’t in question, but it still wasn’t a wise decision.</p>
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<p>nightowl, it’s hard to have sympathy for kids in this position when it was completely avoidable. My comment was directly related to attending NYU. Every kid who gets into NYU would easily have less expensive options. This isn’t a general comment on college costs, it’s particular to the story about NYU. My D attended NYU and graduated seven years ago. They were one of the most expensive then, and even more expensive now. Everyone knows that going in and yet, there are still students and families that ignore the real issues of costs and debt. It isn’t as though you arrive at the decision to apply, let alone attend, without knowing the price tag.</p>
<p>College costs are an issue. I know that probably more than most, having five Ds and also being able to compare the ridiculous U.S. costs vs. what it costs here in Canada. I have long said here on CC that kids should not be going into a lot of debt, especially if they plan for a career in the arts. I’m very aware of too many kids and families ignoring that warning and having to face the consequences upon graduation. The linked article and the girl who blew through her college fund and dropped out is not the example anyone would want as the face of a reasonable discussion of what should be done about the cost of a college education.</p>
<p>When people say NYU is one of the most expensive schools, they are right if they are talking about the price tag with no “discounts.” However, let’s just take this girl in the article’s situation, she supposedly got $30,000/year scholarship from NYU. That brought the price tag down to $30,000/year (and even less considering she moved to Bushwick which costs a lot less than living in an NYU dorm). Perhaps there are cheaper college options, but a $30,000/year price tag for a private college is not that high. My own kid also went to NYU and received a $20,000/year scholarship (and some smaller scholarships from NYU in senior year on top of that). While people comment that we sent our daughter to one of the most expensive options, I don’t see it that way because with the large scholarship, the total price tag was less than many other colleges she got into. So, I prefer to look at the bottom line, not the price tag. </p>
<p>All that aside, in terms of the debt, as a parent, I would never let my kid take on that level of debt no matter the major. Just looking at that girl’s figures, NYU cost her a maximum of $30,000/year (again, less with moving to Bushwick). Her college fund could contribute $15,000/year. So, that leaves coming up with $15,000/year. I don’t want to judge her parents, but it would seem to me that parents might be able to take out some loans to pay for some of that $15,000/year…let’s say half. If up until now they were able to save a nice college fund for this child, they may be able to now swing the $7500/year loan, a total of a $30,000 loan over the four years of college. That would leave the daughter to take out loans totally $30,000 for four years, which is still quite a bit, but not outrageous, if she lowers the cost of housing by living in Bushwick, works a part time job…and thus borrows less than $30,000 total for college. The NYU dorms are expensive and a share in a Bushwick apartment would be less than half the cost of the monthly dorm fee. That alone could save her about $8000/year. Say she can earn $4000/year working about 10 hours a week (doable in college, and that’s not even counting summer earnings!). Add $8000/year in housing savings and $4000/year in part time work and this girl has to borrow far less than $30,000 total for college (IF her parents are willing to borrow $30,000 as well …again, as a parent, I would not leave all the college loans for my kid to handle). Actually, even if her parents are unwilling to borrow any money for college, and she would then need to personally fund $60,000 total for the four years of college, and she saves $8000/year in housing fees and earns $4000/year, she has to only borrow a total of $12,000 for college, which is an amount many students borrow and can handle upon graduation if they get a job.</p>
<p>I don’t think this girl in the story is a good example. It doesn’t sound like they planned out how to pay for the four years. She went through the money in the first two years with no plan how to afford the school after that (I gave a possible plan above). It seems short sighted and also unnecessary that she should have to drop out of college because she could not afford the final two years. This could have been avoided…either by attending an even cheaper school than the discounted price she got from NYU, or planning a way to afford NYU for all four years. Now, they sort of wasted the money as she has no degree. </p>
<p>I have a lot of college loans to repay for my two girls (one went to four years of grad school) and both won a lot of scholarships and fellowships and got need based aid too. Not everyone has all the cash on hand to fund college all at one time. I do not advocate students themselves taking on large school loan debt just starting their careers. But then again, I am of the mind set that parents provide an education and would not leave all the loans for my kid to repay. </p>
<p>Also, while the girl in the article used up her college fund for the first two years of NYU, she, nor her parents, have yet to borrow any money. She could apply for transfer to a school with good need based (or merit based) aid that is a low cost school, and get some aid and then borrow money to fund the balance, thus obtaining a college degree, a better plan than her just dropping out of college.</p>
<p>“How many young people have to give up their dream to go to college because of finances? Too many.”</p>
<p>@halflokum is correct about the boatloads of money available to high-achieving students. If she got 30K fro NYU it’s a pretty safe bet she could have had her pick of plenty other schools with creative writing majors. Even my MT kid had such a school on her list for that reason up until the near end of the process. It had a theater major but not a BFA although there is talk about adding a BFA in the future. At any rate, it’s going to be a tough sell that society needs more BFA’s in musical theater. And, yeah sometimes young people have to give up their dreams to go to dream schools when economic reality rears it’s ugly head. The one drop-out locally who I know for sure dropped out because of money didn’t get much sympathy even from his friends around here. The consensus seemed to be that there were plenty of cheaper schools he could have attended. </p>
<p>My son has friends who are six figures in student debt as well as those who not only have zero such debt but are getting support from parents still so that they are living a six figure annual income type life. Though he is a theater person, who has zero student debt, but little financial support from family as he is now in his mid 20s, he lives a low income life, but manages to scrape by With a loan payment, it would not be possible. He gets behind in bills as it is and has some very dry times. Which for a young person right out of college, is not unusual. </p>
<p>It’s a situation that is a problem, not just for theater and other artistic fields, but any where a good paying job is not forthcoming. If you cannot find a job that pays a living wage and some, you are in trouble if you have student loans that need to be repaid. </p>
<p>NYU is particularly a problem school in this regard, because they are NOT generous in financial and merit money. Well and good, if your student can get the discount and it becomes affordable, but that is often not the case. It’s a large enough school that it gets a large number of students who are drawn in with the name recognition, location, lustre and feel it’s worth the huge premium it often costs to go there. Well and good if one gets a job that makes the loans taken out to pay for it repayable, but if not, man-o-man, the amounts can be crushing with interest to boot. Even small amounts of loans with some success in finding a job can make for a very hard life, if one stays in NYC as the COL there is high and nothing makes one feel poorer than being in the midst of plenty without being able to partake I see this bitterness in so many of my son’s friends, both in the financial industry business and in the arts. My son suffers a bit from this envy as well. It’s a bitter pill to swallow when you see so many living in opulence while you are hitting the streets hard to make a spare dime, and there is no where you see this contrast so strikingly so often as one does in NYC. My other son who was NOT in the arts went through the same thing, and again, he had zero debts. </p>
<p>But you can’t talk most of these “stars in the eyes” students and parents out of this path. I’ve tried and failed miserably with some friends who looked at the student loans as investments. I’ve yet to see one that worked out with great financial success, and several that are in financial ruin over the last 15 years. </p>
<p>And I’m looking right at one of my own who is embarking on that path fro grad school–won’t listen to reason.</p>
<p>@cptofthehouse my daughter goes to college in NYC and plans to stay there after she graduates and she is very concerned about handling living expenses even without any student loans due. Most of her friends will not have that problem as they receive what appears to be unlimited financial support from their parents. But that’s a whole other subject!</p>
<p>I realize people need to plan for all possibilities, but just to keep some hope alive…my D remained in NYC after graduating NYU five years ago, and she has supported herself in the arts since her graduation day, as we don’t financially support our kids once they have their final degrees and they knew that ahead of time. While there are kids whose parents still pay for their living expenses post college degree, my D has many friends who are supporting themselves like she is doing. Some of those friends, like her boyfriend (also a Tisch grad working in theater) also had some student loans to pay. The other day I was with one of my D’s friends who graduated the BFA in MT program at UMichigan and he has been on Broadway and used his salary that year to pay off all of his college loans and get them out of the way. So, for every story you know of kids who are not making it or who can’t pay their college loans, I know a bunch of kids who are making it (in the arts, no less), supporting themselves, and paying off college loans. </p>
<p>@soozievt your daughter, and others we know, are fortunate to have marketable skills like playing piano. To be available for auditions, all my daughter sees is retail sales and waitressing in her future. I do hope after graduation there will be something in theater for her!</p>
<p>My daughter who also goes to college in NYC is getting some practice this summer. She stayed in the city and is in a show in the area and also auditioning for other work but is also working 2 restaurant jobs and is barely able to keep afloat. We gave her a small kick start to help her get on her feet in June while she was desperately applying everywhere for work and looking for housing all of which is hard to do in the middle of finals but that’s it. Choices and tradeoffs had to be made including living in a room with no AC because that was all she could afford. It can be done but it sure isn’t easy. The lucky ones are the ones already living in apartments with full year leases that their parents are paying for which as SoozieVT pointed out can often be cheaper than university housing. My daughter is not one of the lucky ones. It will be interesting to see whether or not she can pull it off. </p>