Parents: Advice Needed Desperately!

Parent Cafe
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<p>
[quote]
What I've noticed is that my son takes a lot of his cues from me

[/quote]

Yeah, I've noticed the same thing .... in reverse. If I get too excited, my D decides she doesn't really like that school. :) I'm anticipating her first (and only) rejection this weekend from a reach school (just a gut feeling), and thinking about how to react. If I shrug it off, or say we couldn't afford it anyway, or disparage it in some way, I think it will become more important to her. Or she will be hurt that I didn't recognize how important it was to her. I think I will probably say something like, "I'm sorry. I know that was your favorite." She will move on; why should I deny her disappointment?</p>

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<p>binx,
"She will move on; why should I deny her disappointment?"</p>

<p>Very astute observation. This is a case where you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. I also have a D who reacts opposite to me (which is why I keep saying I'd love a grandchild ;))</p>

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<p>If you just look at the scattergrams at our school you really don't get the full picture. My son has better grades than many and higher scores than most of previous Ivy admits, but many of them did science research and he refused. The big question mark was how would his work experience stack up against that. They probably had more school ECs, my son's biggest EC is messing around on the computer on his own. Basically that counts for very little though he's taught himself an amazing amount. I figured his odds at his top schools were about 1 in 4. (Considerably better than the 1 in 10 for most of these schools, but still it's considerably less than 50/50.) Since he didn't get into 2 of those top 4 or 5 schools and waitlisted at one, now I'm sort of wondering if that means I should have encourage him to apply to even more reaches, but the fact is he's into three schools where he'll be very happy - I don't know that he'd be better off at one of the Ivy's.</p>

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<p>OldinJersey,
I would not want to take away your dream of Princeton, or anyone else's dream for their child. I am just saying, take a look at how that was worded: </p>

<p>"adigal - you'll never, ever take away my dream that DD1 could have gotten into Princeton."</p>

<p>You obviously recognize that it was YOUR dream, and you allowed your daughter to make her own decision. I think many kids are not given that gift by their parents, to be able to make some of these decisions themselves. I am guilty of this, also; I fight this urge daily, when I go and look up some absolute top school that I know, even if my son did happen to get in, would be wrong for him.</p>

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<p>Maybe it's easier if you aren't in such a hyper environment. After reading these boards I'm grateful that we live in a state where the flagship university is so highly regarded, and where there is a long tradition of people who have other options staying in state.</p>

<p>I think it helped to be surrounded by people who think that going to the University is a big deal, so they tend to celebrate ALL college admissions. My D. did apply to two "Ivies" and we talked a lot about the lottery factor and that at her level, getting in is a more or less random event. She understands that both of the kids in her class who were admitted to hyperselective schools had significant hooks--one a recruited athlete whose grades and scores were NOT any lower than average for that school, and one kid whose family name graces one of the buildings at the school he applied to. I think that made it easier to see that not being accepted does not make her a lesser student than these two.</p>

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<p>adigal - oh yes I did understand it was MY dream. I was just trying to say you're not the only mom out there fighting to do the right thing in the face of your own tendencies. (g)</p>

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<p>Focusing in the OP posting, I feel that sometimes parents try to live in their children what they couldn?t live themselves. Some parents are not only pushing their kids to be Ivy leaguers but brainwashing their kids about entitlement to get into top schools below the Ivies, if these kids get rejected or waitlisted, they will be the worst sufferers in the class, they will be dealing with denial and sadness. We have to open the doors for ours kids letting them to make their own decisions for the future.</p>

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<p>Old But Wise,
I like your thread opener. Re: your screenname: I'm sure you are the latter. As for the former, remember not to let the objective rankings of others bring you down, LOL...</p>

<p>I'm very curious: did you find this syndrome re: top LAC's also? </p>

<p>Our experience sending one to Oberlin and the other to Amherst was that we felt proud of the names (pity us) but had gone the long journey re: rightness of fit which was our emphasis within our household all along.</p>

<p>Nobody in their highschool except the GC's and a few rare teachers even heard of their colleges. And because the school used unweighted rankings and stood the top-ten ranked students up at assemblies, paraded them around town and in the newspaper, rank #9 "double-800 Harvard" got to stand up, but not my kid rank #11
single-800 Amherst College... Oh, well!</p>

<p>That confused and dampened my kids' enthusiasms somewhat, since we'd been supportive of these and other "unheard of" LAC's (safeties, matches and reaches) from home, due to rightness of fit. </p>

<p>I told them to get used to the lesser name recognition on Main Street, but that academics in the fields of higher education, and some honest peers at Ivies would have heard of their schools. Some might even admit to an apples-oranges good value re: their LAC educations. </p>

<p>WIth these humbling realizations, they did not offend others. They began to wonder if our pleasure for their news was misplaced in terms of the larger world. Then they got to the actual colleges, at which point some of their humility eroded, I'm sorry to say (well, this happened at Amherst anyway; Oberlin remains forever humble).</p>

<p>OP, I'm curious if this is just an Ivy thing, or do the LAC's need to be brought up or down a peg also in terms of April 1 week kindness towards others.</p>

<p>You raise an important point for all students at this season.</p>

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<p>Cressmom: Thanks for getting this post back on track.</p>

<p>In reviewing the posts in this thread, it's disappointing to see how parents get off topic, focusing on their own issues instead of those being faced by today's pressured adolescents. Worse yet is when the threads got sidetracked by posters who had to make sure that if a certain individual attended an Ivy, everyone on CC had to be made aware of it.</p>

<p>Quite frankly (and unfortunately) it doesn't surprise me to see this type of thing occur on College Confidential.</p>

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<p>My main piece of advice would be NOT to post-mortem a rejection or waitlist to death (or beyond). Once the applications are done and sent in, it's out of our kids' hands. I am NOT going to tell my kid, "If only you'd gotten an A instead if a B in XXX, you would have been accepted!" (or if only he'd caught that typo, used a different word to describe something, etc.)</p>

<p>At a certain point, we <em>all</em> have to let go and say "good enough." It pains me to see all these kids on CC saying "If only..." when the reality is that sometimes admissions has nothing to do with the applicant personally. That said, I agree with the other folks who have said it's OK to grieve. In the real world, we don't always get that promotion, etc., and sometimes that's for the best.</p>

<p>One of my kids was recently waitlisted to a program and we got a taste of what college admissions will be like. One thing that struck me was that my kid was far less upset than I might have expected. The other thing was how much I wanted that acceptance for him. It was a good sign to back off. Things work out for a reason.</p>

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<p>Paying3: First of all, thanks for your kind words. If you've read many of my posts, you'll see that I'm not the most popular person on CC. Most people on here don't like me or what I have to say. I've been called "Old but Troll", "Sour Grapes" etc. I accept that because I know that I go against the grain on CC, ruffle a lot of feathers, and hit too close to home with many readers on CC.</p>

<p>My views are based on (1) Thirty years of experience in college counseling &
(2) Being the strongest student advocate on the planet. During my entire career, my goals were to make sure that my graduating students left high school feeling good about themselves and having a positive and happy outlook on life. One of the happiest graduates I have ever had is a young man who drives a beer truck, plays cards on Wednesday nights, and is in a summer softball league. He has a wonderful wife and two beautiful children. Some of the most unhappy grads I have had were the students who, in high school, were voted "Most Likely to Succeed"...students who seemed to "have it all." On CC, I try to keep things in perspective.</p>

<p>Anyways, to answer your question.....Yes, LAC's should be treated in the same way as the Ivies. Those students applying to the "top" LAC's tend to view them in the same way as those students who are applying to HPY, etc.
Rejection from LAC's can be a devastating blow.</p>

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<p>Honestly, I just don't think the "so and so is famous and they didn't go to Harvard" rings true. The bum at the end of the street and most of the guys and gals in jail didn't go to Harvard either. The reality is, there are people for whom where they go to school (or going to school at all) makes no difference-- and then there are people for whom the 'right' school makes a difference. The question is...how do you make the 3rd choice or the less prestigious school the 'right school' in the eyes of a child who has been innoculated with thinking otherwise for 5 years or more.</p>

<p>Well, you don't. The kid is not an idiot or they would not have been applying to those schools to begin with. THey are not going to wake up the next morning and say, "You bet, I am going to be just as happy and successful going to 'random college' as I would be if I had been accepted to 'prestigious university." </p>

<p>Sorry, but if you got this far with your child and the message that they have gotten is Ivy or Bust than YOU have blown it. No one here can make you feel any better for it. YOU made a mistake as a parent. It is time to FESS UP!!!!</p>

<p>You tell your child this. "I made a mistake as your parent. Everyone makes mistakes and this was a big one. I think I forgot all along in this process to tell you that I have enough confidence in who you are to know that there are many, many schools which would help you grow into a fantastic adult. I made this mistake and I am sorry."</p>

<p>Then you give your child a hug, you ask for their forgiveness.</p>

<p>They didn't make the mistake, you did. Any suggestion otherwise is a further dishonesty.</p>

<p>MANY of us have children whom we could have played the 'IVY OR BUST' card with. MANY of us could have approached this as a process to enhance our own sense of self. MANY of us could have tried to live through their child instead of letting the child have the life. BUT...MANY of US did not. </p>

<p>So, if you did and it didn't work out- be the adult, be the parent, take the blame and then ask for forgiveness. And then, forget about placating with silly blah blah, take the time to honestly look at the options and try to love at least one of them.</p>

<p>Sorry to be harsh, but I hate the thought of all these kids feeling like THEY did something wrong.</p>

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<p>I just came back from speaking with a friend's child on the college subject. She is waiting for letters and so stressed that she is about to fall apart. Her parents just recently told her money matters and she will probably not attend her first choice. I gave her the old "Bloom where you are planted," talk and she knows that her 2nd choice is a great school. We also talked about transferring if you don't like it. She is scared and anxious about leaving home, making new friends, the whole thing. This week and the next few must be horrible for many kids. Their first real taste of disappointment and the adult world. I read a few threads on admissions here and I just want to hug some of the kids and tell them that is not the end of the world for them.</p>

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<p>cmbmom-- you make some very good points for us to remember the fear and anxiety many of our kids are experiencing not only about rejections, but also about leaving home and making new friends...
and the first taste of the adult world, as you said</p>

<p>thx for the reminder to be more sensitive about this aspect besides just being caught up in waiting for "the letters"</p>

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<p>For all of you out there who have sent me private messages regarding this thread.....thank you for your support. I enjoy hearing from you, as it is good to know that there are a number of us who do not fit the typical CC mold.</p>

<p>Please forgive the fact that I am unable to respond to your PM's, but I do enjoy receiving them and welcome them.</p>

<p>Thanks.</p>

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<p>Mine was turned away from a top school and didn't mind at all once the other acceptances rolled in. Surely anyone applying to an Ivy realizes they are all reaches in terms of sheer numbers. With that approach, they should be able to realize it's not a failure but an event that they can deal with maturely. Anyone who has the stats to apply to an Ivy should have or learn to have the maturity to not take it personally. As a parent, I know it's hard, but I've watched mine handle it extremely well. Our attitude was to say Look at the great schools you got into. How fortunate you are to have a selection to choose from.</p>

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<p>OBW, I started a thread last year about this time called "A word to the rejected" and I'll probably put up a revised version this year. The thread, if you're interested, is at <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=167911%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=167911&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Why do people keep focusing and using the words "top" "elite" "selective"...</p>

<p>Kids who get rejected from "lesser" schools are just as disappointed, and often even more so</p>

<p>Imagine you don't get into what others percieve as a "safety"</p>

<p>If you are rejected from an Ivy, there is a built in numbers game</p>

<p>Yet it seems people think it would be rougher for the Ivy applicants to handle than just "regular" kids</p>

<p>That is snobbery at the utmost</p>

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<p>citygirlsmom, that is an excellent point, but I thought the OP was asking specifically about Ivies. My preferences are the big state U's and LACs over any of the Ivies. Big State U's are often very selective, and some of the small LACs with limited space are, too.</p>

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<p>I can't edit my post above. I want to add maybe we should stop using the word "rejected" to talk about denials, and use "not admitted" instead.</p>