<p>Best National Universities
1. Princeton University (NJ)
2. Harvard University (MA)
3. Yale University (CT)
4. Stanford University (CA)
5. California Institute of Technology
University of Pennsylvania
7. Massachusetts Inst. Of Technology
8. Duke University (NC)
9. Columbia University (NY)
University of Chicago
11. Dartmouth College (NH)
12. Cornell University (NY)
Washington University in St. Louis
14. Brown University (RI)
Johns Hopkins University (MD)
Northwestern University (IL)
17. Emory University (GA)
Rice University (TX)
19. University of Notre Dame (IN)
Vanderbilt University (TN)
21. University of California – Berkeley
22. Carnegie Mellon University (PA)
23. Georgetown University (DC)
University of Virginia
25. University of California – Los Angeles
University of Michigan – Ann Arbor</p>
<p>“very nice. the 2007 rankings were a joke.”</p>
<p>Are you serious? The rankings, at least for top 25, are practically identical. Don’t tell me the rankings were a joke for a mere, inconsequential change in Penn’s rank from 7 to 5.</p>
<p>Penn > MIT according to 2008 rankings. Penn is great-- but name me one metric that actually matters (not stuff like alumni donations) Penn beats MIT in. I think if anything, it takes validity out of the ranking. And keep in mind, these are using the 2006 #'s, Penn had higher yield in '06. Drop in asian applicants this year. We’ll see.</p>
<p>Yes way… MIT is very strong in certain areas and is harder to get into (fewer seats) but Penn is a bigger, more comprehensive university across the board. In certain areas (undergrad business) Penn clearly has MIT beat.</p>
<p>If you are talking about hard science only, then MIT and Cal Tech would not only be above Penn but above H Y and P and S. Using the methods that they use to rank the others, Penn is in the right place, right behind the other top Ivies. It’s also correct that Penn has pulled ahead of the lower Ivies - Col., Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell - those places have stagnated and Penn has moved ahead in many areas.</p>
<p>Sorry— I just want to respond to Percy Skivins post “It’s also correct that Penn has pulled ahead of the lower Ivies - Col., Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell - those places have stagnated and Penn has moved ahead in many areas.”</p>
<p>Please refer to the median SAT scores. Penn has the lowest of the top 10.
With the exception of UChicago, it also has either the least or second-least selective. No, the real reason why Penn pulls ahead is due to factors such as “alumni donations” + Wharton. However, one thing Penn does do well is choosing people that will likely matriculate (yield protection), as all colleges should. This undoubtedly creates a happier student body among other things. But Penn should be cautious now that Lee Stetson is leaving & Philly is going to hell in a handbasket. </p>
<p>But regardless, I don’t think anyone believes that Penn > MIT, and at least in terms of prestige (admit rates, median scores, research), Columbia, Dartmouth > Penn. </p>
<p>Admit%for “Ives + ‘Lower Ivies’”</p>
<p>Yale University (CT) 9%
Harvard University (MA) 9%
Princeton University (NJ) 10%
Columbia University (NY) 12%
Brown University (RI) 14%
Dartmouth College (NH) 16%
University of Pennsylvania 18%
Cornell University (NY) 25% </p>
<p>At least you guys beat out Cornell (same goes for median SAT scores). </p>
<p>*this was not meant to bash Penn, it’s a great school, just responding to the last poster’s assertion that Penn unequivocally> Columbia, Dartmouth, Brown just because of USNews.</p>
<p>As I’ve pointed out in other threads, Penn being ranked above MIT in US News isn’t exactly a new phenomenon this year, as some people’s reactions would seem to imply. In fact, this is the THIRD time in the last few years that Penn has been ranked above MIT (also in the 2005 and 2006 rankings), and twice before that Penn was tied with MIT (in the 2002 and 2003 rankings):</p>
Actually, Penn’s yield increased in '07, but yield isn’t considered by US News in determining rank. And where did you see that the number of Asian applicants dropped this year? Any place official? I would find that extremely surprising given that Penn’s applicant pool grew by 11%, or over 2,000 applicants, from 2006 to 2007.</p>
In terms of research, this is incorrect. For example, in the 2006 Annual Report of the Center for Measuring University Performance, Penn is in the highest tier with Columbia, and several tiers above Dartmouth. Furthermore, Penn’s total research budget is SIGNIFICANTLY higher than Colubmia’s. And when it comes to ranking universities for research, the rule is pretty simple-- follow the money (see page 8):</p>
<p>Also, Columbia’s median scores are a total of 5 points higher than Penn’s–not very significant in general, and certainly not when one considers that Penn has a much larger student body that, e.g., includes a nursing school.</p>
<p>Actually, in terms of US News rankings, it’s consistently been anywhere from the 4th to the 7th best school over the past ELEVEN years. But outside of the rankings, it certainly has been improving, and for a lot longer than 11 years.</p>
<p>Yale University (CT) 9%
Harvard University (MA) 9%
Princeton University (NJ) 10%
Columbia University (NY) 12%
Brown University (RI) 14%
Dartmouth College (NH) 16%
University of Pennsylvania 18%
Cornell University (NY) 25% "</p>
<p>Wharton’s admit rate is up there (down there?) with H, Y and P in the single digits.</p>
<p>If the USNWR rankings were based solely on admit rate, you’d be right, but there’s much more to them than that. Just saw an article today talking about how some schools (not Ivies) try to manip. admit rate by sending out partly pre-filled apps by email, waive app. fees, etc. Unfortunately admit rate is only 1.5% of the total weight so even moving it a lot doesn’t move the ranking much.</p>
(same goes for median SAT scores). </p>