<p>Hi</p>
<p>I've been accepted into both of these great schools and am really confused about where I should go. I would like to study economics, but don't want to base my decision solely based on my major, as that could potentially change. Any opinions?</p>
<p>Visit both and see which one feels more like the right "fit" for you. Even if you visited before, you should visit again now that you've been admitted, which gives you a different perspective and focus knowing that you might actually spend 4 years there.</p>
<p>One of my good friends is at UChicago and hates it. Penn would be a lot more fun with a more active on campus social life, better proximity to downtown (though I will say that Chicago as a city is better than Philly). Strength of major department shouldn't play a huge role when picking a college, especially when both schools are near the top in that field (Chicago being top 3 and Penn top 10 or 15) because you might switch majors and no one really cares about department strength for liberal arts majors for undergrad.</p>
<p>Aside from those things I would consider proximity to home. It is nice to be able to go home when you need to, and it's nice to be close to home so the plane ticket wont bust your wallet for fall break, spring break, and easter/passover. If you are from the Midwest I would strongly consider going to Chicago and if you are from the east coast I would strongly consider going to Penn.</p>
<p>^ On the other hand, it's nice to be able to experience a different part of the country.</p>
<p>And another geographic advantage of Penn: it's only 145 miles from DC and 100 miles from NYC, and only a few blocks from the train station where you can hop on a train to either.</p>
<p>Re academics, Chicago is generally regarded as one of the top 3 or 4 programs in the nation (along with MIT, Stanford and Harvard). Penn is generally placed in the next grouping, i.e., ranked 5-8. Although rankings make a difference for graduate work, as an undergrad any top 10 program will provide a great educational experience.</p>
<p>Overall, in the arts and sciences each school is solidly top 10 or so in almost all major areas. Chicago has been more involved in the conservative intellectual debates which have shaped Federal policy and conservative thinking over the past 25-30 years. Penn is more of a liberal school.</p>
<p>One plus for Penn is its One University policy. You are able to take classes from almost any school at the University (e.g., Wharton, Engineering, Design, Annenberg, etc.) - the entire university is at your disposal. Academically, that provides a HUGE plus for someone as intellectually curious as yourself.</p>
<p>Either way, you have two stellar choices. Best of luck</p>
<p>red&blue, where is there a list that regards schools in regard to their academic programs? One with UChicago in the top 10? Just curious, post link if there is one.</p>
<p>I wouldn't say University of Chicago has a top 10 Academic Program in all areas, however it is renowned for it's academic Economics program. </p>
<p>UPenn and UChicago are two vastly different schools. Keep in mind the varying social environments when you make your choice. Penn is a more Social, Greek-oriented, and pre-professional environment with a strong work hard, play hard mentality. UChicago has a more academic community and less of a party scene.</p>
<p>Of course this does not apply to the entire population of the school, just the school's reputation.</p>
<p>justbumming, I believe red&blue is referring to rankings of graduate programs, such as the highly respected NRC ranking of Ph.D. programs:</p>
<p>NRC</a> Rankings in Each of 41 Areas</p>
<p>and the US News ranking of graduate programs:</p>
<p>among others.</p>
<p>The NRC ranking, which is the most comprehensive and probably the most respected, is terribly out of date (1995), but is scheduled to be updated this coming Fall.</p>
<p>Great choices, but very different for undergrad. I went to both and agree with a previous post suggesting you visit. If you were going to grad school, the differences wouldn't be as great, at least not in the same way, and then things like the department's reputation/ranking would be more important. If you can, spend at least a couple of days at each school and talk to as many undergrads as you can. See what they like and what they don't like. If you're the kind of person who likes to go into the city, see how easy or difficult that will be. Hyde Park isn't all that close to downtown Chicago, but you can walk to Center City in Philly from Penn. Both cities have lots to offer, just as both schools do. But again, they're really quite different, with Penn being more social and "fun" in a typical college way and Chicago more intellectual and academic. That's not to say, though, that Chicago can't be fun. It's just a different kind of fun--one that, in fact, is actually more fun to some people (life of the mind). Good luck!</p>
<p>
Indeed, this is true of both schools. Despite Penn's "preprofessional" reputation, it does have a strong contingent of academic/research-oriented types (after all, it is one of the top research universities in the country). And, because of its larger undergraduate student body, the size of that contingent is not insubstantial.</p>
<p>45 Percenter, those are nice resources, but I'm not sure that's what red&blue was referring to since this an undergraduate question.</p>
<p>justbumming, based on other posts by red&blue, I believe that these kinds of graduate rankings are indeed to what he/she was referring. Other than the individual opinions expressed in the controversial Gourman Report, I don't believe that there are any significant rankings of liberal arts departments on the undergraduate level. The graduate rankings are generally used as a proxy for undergraduate ranking.</p>
<p>Of course, I don't speak for red&blue and, hopefully, he/she will stop back by to correct me if I'm wrong. :)</p>
<p>45, you are correct. Most of my views on academic rankings are based on things such as the NRC rankings, the Center of Meas. Univ. Perf., etc. These rankings focus on grad level education. </p>
<p>That said, I don't see a distinction between grad and undergrad rankings in this area. It's the same faculty for any department - economics, history, art, electrical engineering, etc. </p>
<p>I know of no school that has a separate staff for PhDs and for undergrads. The schools share resources. In fact, many universities allow undergrads to take grad courses (Penn is one of the most advanced in this regard)....which further reinforces the value of the faculty (in entirety).</p>
<p>Unfortunately, the NRC rankings (which have been biased towards larger schools in the past) are delayed again until this fall. Updated rankings are only available via US News. </p>
<p>And that, and older NRC rankings, have UofC firmly in the top 5 overall in the humanities and social sciences, and slightly ahead of Penn. Penn's professional programs (e.g., Wharton, nursing) give Penn an overall edge in my view.</p>
<p>which ranking is more reasonable</p>
<p>jds3, based on your posts in another thread, I believe your son is interested in business and engineering. There are rankings of undergraduate business programs, such as the ones by US News and World Report:</p>
<p>[USNews.com:</a> America's Best Colleges 2008: Best Undergraduate Business Programs<a href="this%20web%20site%20only%20shows%20the%20top%204%20schools,%20unless%20you%20pay%20for%20the%20premium%20service">/url</a></p>
<p>and Business Week:</p>
<p>[url=<a href="http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/rankings/%5DBusiness">http://www.businessweek.com/bschools/rankings/]Business</a> School Rankings and Profiles: EMBA, Executive Education, MBA, Part-time MBA, Distance MBA](<a href="http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/topprogs_brief.php%5DUSNews.com:">http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/topprogs_brief.php)</p>
<p>Wharton is always ranked the #1 undergraduate business program in the country, and is really in a class by itself.</p>
<p>Additionally, US News ranks undergraduate engineering programs:</p>
<p>[url=<a href="http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/topprogs_withphd_brief.php%5DUSNews.com:">http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/usnews/edu/college/rankings/brief/topprogs_withphd_brief.php]USNews.com:</a> America's Best Colleges 2008: Best Undergraduate Engineering Programs<a href="again,%20the%20site%20only%20shows%20the%20top%203%20unless%20you%20pay%20for%20the%20premium%20service">/url</a></p>
<p>In terms of individual liberal arts graduate program rankings, the NRC rankings are generally among the most respected but, as red&blue and I both pointed out, they're now pretty stale (from 1995) until their scheduled update this coming Fall (hopefully--the update has been postponed several times now). The US News rankings of graduate programs are helpful to get a general idea of where various programs rank, although some may dispute the exact rankings various schools are given.</p>
<p>Ok, gotcha! Thanks red&blue and 45 Percenter.</p>
<p>I got this site from my friend and I found out it is really helpful. So many great people here willing to help out.
Thank you very much</p>
<p>I was in the College office getting some class issue sorted out and I ran into a kid who was a transfer to Penn from UChicago.</p>
<p>I'd wager that there are more kids transferring from UChicago to Penn than the other way around...</p>