<p>What makes you think the average person would know Cornell, rather than Penn?</p>
<p>Dream on, dream on.</p>
<p>Experience...duh. </p>
<p>And I think Cornell is just a better school, who values learning over rankings...Unfortunately, I can't say the same thing for Penn. Sad but true. You guys need to get your heads out of the clouds and realize that your US News ranking, doesn't make you a better school. We can very easily boost our ranking, if we so choose. Fortunately, we have less superficial goals to achieve, like fulfilling our land grant mission, recruiting students from inner city schools and providing a good, valuable education. </p>
<p>Sorry....you guys just sit around and worry about your ranking. </p>
<p>Cornell's reputation is hardly the worst. Top Ivy Engineering...yea, ok. </p>
<p>@Slim2None - I think the concept of decentralized university escapes you.</p>
<p>I really -love- your biased attacks.</p>
<p>You offer nothing except silly "observations" about people at Penn ;)</p>
<p>I love how you side-step the entirety of my post.</p>
<p>I don't make any biased attacks, the content of my posts is rooted in fact. Penn, does play the ranking game. Penn doesn't have a good reputation outside of Pennsylvania. Cornell DOES pursue inclusion (Any Person, any study...does that ring a bell?). We CAN increase our ranking very easily via a class size reduction or decrease in acceptance. AND, we are the one of the top Engineering, AAP, Hotel, English etc. in the ivy league. AND, Cornell, is reputed globally, especially in Asia. Aside from Whartonites, where do your famous Alumni come from? huh? Face it, Wharton is Penn....that's it. Stop being so insecure. Accept that you guys are second-rate and move on. Its ok. Who cares if your acceptance rate is two percent lower than ours, at least we're learning ****.</p>
<p>where are your responses? anyone? ...wow, I thought you lot were smart...</p>
<p>Cornell2011, are you upset because you were rejected from Penn? Whether true or not, Penn HAS a better reputation than Cornell. The fact that you find the need to vociferously defend Cornell on the Penn thread seems ample proof of your bitterness.
And by the way, I went to Cornell for a year. The hotel school is terrible. The hotelies were well-known to be the dumbest kids on campus.</p>
<p>I just read over your last post. You're ranting.
"Accept that you guys are second rate."
I mean, really. The 1st, 2nd and 3rd ranked kids in my class went Penn, Penn, and Harvard, in the order. It has reached that level. Cornell will never do so, because it has a state agricultural college with an acceptance rate of 30%. I'm sorry I had to put it that way.</p>
<p>Please take your demagoguery and leave this thread free of your ad hominem attacks.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>You realize that nyt did this poll as every major polling group does and it has around the same margin of error (3-5%) You are simply a moron...Cornell has always always had the reputation of being the worst ivy, now and 25 years ago. I do know what people think and there is no question on this fact--in Pennsylvania, in NYC, in FL or anywhere else. Penn has a superb reputation, which rankings, employment numbers, academic instituitions and people in the outside world all validate. In the scope of reputation this is how it goes:</p>
<p>HYP
Columbia and Penn
Dartmouth and Brown
Cornell (yes--last)</p>
<p>Tell me how Cornell can easily boost its rankings, when SAT scores and acceptance rates are a very small proportion of the total ranking system. I seriously doubt most people internationally regard Cornell as better than Penn considering most international people only really know Harvard, Stanford, Yaleand Princeton. Also we live in America so who cares what they think anyway---its here that we care about. Your post is nonsensical--you lose in statistical data, you lose in employment data, you lose in intelligent data and you lose overrall.</p>
<p>I think we should send this thread to US News, maybe Cornell's rankings will go up next year. Seriously...who cares...I think all the anger about Cornell's low rankings and prestige should be directed towards US News rather than Penn students.</p>
<p>You high school kids really need to stop arguing about which school is more prestigious. It really makes 0 difference in the real world and while you are at school. Both schools are equally good on the whole. Each has its strengths and its weaknesses (if you can say that schools this strong are weak at anything). If you go to one or the other to the Arts and Sciences school the opportunities and education are basically equal. You can't compare programs only Cornell offers (many of which aren't offered by any other Ivy or top 30 school) to programs only Penn offers. Cornell engineering is stronger as a whole, but Penn has some top flight programs in Bioengineering, nano science (though Cornell's is also very strong), and other fields.</p>
<p>
You are retarded. Many Penn grads get amazing jobs out of school and many Cornell grads get amazing jobs out of school. I'm also glad to see that Cornell's AEM program is better than Wharton in getting people into finance. That would mean, despite what any Wall Street recruiter will tell you, that Cornell AEM and Harvard are at the top of the heap. I, and many people on Wall Street who I've talked to, were always under the impression that Harvard, Wharton, and Princeton were at the top of the heap, but guess we were all wrong. Thank god a college freshman has shown me the light.</p>
<p>cornell2011, I am not on Wall Street. I'm in the class of 2011 like you. I never said anything bad about Cornell. Most of my points were that Penn and Cornell are on the whole equal. One school might be stronger in area X, but the other is stronger in area Y. It really makes no difference unless you want to go into a specialized field like hotel management, nursing, etc.</p>
<p>Also, you're crazy if you don't think that Harvard and Princeton do very well with placing students into banks or into consulting firms. These are arguably the two best/most prestigious colleges in the country and are very well recruited for top jobs in lucrative fields for recent college grads. Harvard does just as well, or maybe better than Wharton, the top undergraduate business school, in placing people into the business world while not having an undergraduate business school.</p>
<p>Also, Penn SAS is very strong. While it isn't a clear #1 in any field (like UChicago to Econ or Yale to English) it does have top 10 and top 20 programs in many areas like Music, Anthropology, Sociology, Economics, Biology, Chemistry, Math, and Psychology according to USNews and other sources. Penn's bread and butter is professional schools with a top 3 business school, top 5 med school, top 10 law school, top vet school, top nursing school, etc. However, calling SAS a joke is like calling Cornell the safety Ivy.</p>
<p>i think you all need to chill fantastically</p>
<p>i turned down cornell engineering for penn bioengineering, but cornell was my second choice</p>
<p>and my brother is going to cornell for engineering</p>
<p>i might very well apply to cornell to law school</p>
<p>both schools are great, and neither is worthy of bashing.</p>
<p>So a reduction in class size is all Cornell has to do to boost up rankings? That's a very weird suggestion. So if Dartmouth just all the sudden decides to accept only 10 people a year and have an acceptance rate of virtually 0%, it'd be #1? Wouldn't recruiting better faculty and students as well as an increase in endowment do more to the rankings than to flat out make less room for students. Wouldn't that take Cornell out of its safety Ivy status?</p>
<p>There are numerous studies done, which unfortunately I can't point to at this moment (I'm sorry, I usually like to have evidence to back up my claims, but I don't have the time to find them right now). Anyways, the most influential factor for Cornell, is the fact that its class size is larger than its peer institutions. Now, this doesn't excludes changes to endowment and better professors, but I will say that Cornell arguably has some of the best professors in the Ivy league (namely due to its Engineering, Hotel, AAP) schools. Additionally, cornell's endowment is large compared to Brown and Dartmouth I believe, but the per student endowment takes a hit due to class size. Also, if Cornell were to reduce its class size, its acceptance rate would massively go down, and its average class size would also be less. This would mean that Cornell would be able to place more professors in a more diverse set of fields. Additionally, I think having a smaller class size, would also increase the average SAT scores, which currently take a hit. Now, I know that the Hotelies typically have the lowest average SAT score, which drags down our entire average, but the effect of that can be mitigated. </p>
<p>Now, I want to say, that I started off with the notions of no school is better than another, but then I saw the Cornell bashing that was taking place, and that undeniably ****ed me off. I also, don't agree with the question of placement for Harvard and Princeton over Cornell, because one of the primary factors for Cornell's business rank, is the fact that it places so many people in such good jobs. Additionally, Cornell engineers get jobs one Wall Street as well, among other places.</p>
<p>cornell2011--You need to ****ing relax, dude. Look how riled up you're getting...it's a message board.</p>
<p>^^I'm not going to argue with you if you refuse to believe that Harvard and Princeton are as good, if not better, than Cornell in terms of placement into lucrative business fields out of college. The business school rankings for job placement aren't the best because Harvard, Stanford, Columbia, Dartmouth, Yale, and Duke do not extend their graduate business programs to undergrads like Cornell and Penn. Those schools have excellent placement, but it will never be compared to Cornell AEM because there are no formal business programs. </p>
<p>Your argument basically says that people who get banking jobs out of college are business majors and engineers. I guarantee non AEM and non engineers at Cornell get those jobs too. With that being true, that also means liberal arts and pure science majors from other top schools like Harvard and Princeton also get those great jobs too. You can look around the Career/Internship forum and look at posts by recent grads of these schools who have jobs in business fields like slipper123 and gellino.</p>
<p>My argument says that the only quantifiable measure of placement is for Cornell and Wharton. Therefore any claims about Harvard and Princeton's placement are unwarranted and only based on anecdotal evidence which is problematic for the argument's persuasiveness. This brings into question even the credibility of your anecdotes. That means, as of now, I'm right and you're wrong.</p>
<p>i love these ivy league ****ing matches</p>
<p>^I'm not a member of vault and I doubt that you are too. However, if you go to the employment prospects survey for Harvard on Harvard</a> University Admission: Vault Harvard College Undergrad Surveys you see articles like this "In finance, there really is no better recruiting process than at Harvard. The school takes this very." and Best college for employment prospects in the country. Wharton follows at a close #2." </p>
<p>Your argument is basically avoiding the widely held belief that Harvard is one of the best, if not the best, schools for placing people into jobs right out of college. You could also go to the websites of many top banks, consulting firms, and other lucrative businesses and see what their target schools are. Cornell will be on many of the lists. Harvard and Wharton will be on very close to all of them.</p>
<p>Again, give me actual facts. As far as I know, we send kids to every one of the top Ibanks in the nation, every year. So, I don't understand what your post is getting you. Additionally, I again don't understand blanket statements about Harvard being the best for out of college employment prospects. Additionally, does Vault make any delineation between the types of jobs that Harvard grads get....probably not. Also, realize that those are again statements of opinion not fact. I'd like to see statistical evidence of better job placement of one versus the other. I think you'll find that in a world where a Cornell grad is competing against a Harvard grad, you'll be essentially the same, an the interview process is what will differentiate. Now in specific instances, such as Engineering firms, we'll mostly win out.</p>
<p>Edit: I just read more into vault, and I just realized that your evidence isn't really evidence at all, its just a bunch of Harvard grads giving themselves a handjob. Seriously, it again doesn't prove anything beyond the fact that Harvard students think highly of themselves. This can be attributed to things aside from fact. Sorry man, you're really bad at making arguments...really bad. Additionally, your argument that because something is widely believed that its true is absolutely stupid. For example, most people think that a tomato is a vegetable, does that make it true. Again, a fallicious argument.</p>
<p>Jeez... I hate it when threads like this come up. CC is meant to help kids learn about the college admissions process and is not meant for this bull****. Both schools are great, depending on what you're looking for. I'm an engineer, so I turned down Penn for Cornell. I am sure a Business or an economics major would certainly turn down Cornell down for Penn. No rational argument can be made establishing which school is better than the other. Both schools are about equally good, and who the hell cares about a school's name WHEN YOU'RE IN THE IVY LEAGUE?</p>
<p>Let's all just be civilized and agree to let this pointless thread die.</p>
<p>Cornell2011, I thought you were done here? Or are you so insecure about Cornell that you have to go into other schools' forums (God knows the last time I was in any other college's forum) and defend it tooth and nail? C'mon, Cornell as good as Harvard for getting into banking? Dude, I'm interning in banking and actually know a lot of people doing the same (or working full-time) -- can you say that? You're a ****ing rising sophomore -- and there is absolutely no way that Cornell's recruiting prospects are as good as Harvard's.</p>