Presidential Nomination Chances

Colleges and Universities A-Z Air Force Academy - Colorado Springs
1

<p>I was talking to my Thermodynamics professor this semester about applying to the USAFA and USMA, because he is a graduate of, and former teacher at USMA. </p>

<p>He was saying how hard it was to get an appointment under the Presidential nomination because of the large pool of applicants. Is it really THAT difficult? I have a presidential nomination to USAFA, and a congressional competitive and presidential nomination to USMA … but USAFA is my first choice. Is there still a good shot at USAFA even if I just have the presidential nomination???</p>

2

<p>I find it hard to believe that the source of your nomination has any effect on your chances of appointment. Once you have a nomination (from ANY source) it's the strength of your file that matters. The nomination merely gives the academy the legal authorization to offer you an appointment (based on the strength of your file). Good Luck.</p>

3

<p>In a way that is true, but as you can see from Tyleroar, he got a principal nomination from a senator ... so he is in as long as he is qualified. He doesn't have to "compete" with other nominees. </p>

<p>"I find it hard to believe that the source of your nomination has any effect on your chances of appointment."</p>

<p>Oh boy does it... let me explain...</p>

<p>Lets say you get a competitive nomination from Representative "smith" for academy "A". You are now competiting for an appointment with 9 or so other competitive nominees under "smith"'s nomination. However, if you only receive a presidential nomination for academy "A" you are competing for one of 100 or so slots offered to presidential nominations. A LOT of people get presidential nominations, so your chances are probably less than 1/10, as is the case with "smith"'s nomination. Now for argument's sake, let's say you are from Wyoming ... with a population of around 500,000 ... and you apply to your Senators for a nomination. Chances are, you will get a nomination, because of the low population. If you get a principal, you are in, as long as you meet the BARE MINIMUM for acceptance. Chances are also that there are other candidates from let's say ... California, who are more qualified but don't get in because of the number of noms offered in Cali as opposed to Wyoming. </p>

<p>As you can see, your chances differ depending on the type and source of nomination. The nomination process isn't just a thing where you get one and then they throw into a pool of applicants with noms ... it doesn't work that way.</p>

<p>I believe the nomination process, as you can probably tell from my post, is an outdated system that should be abolished for a purely competitive appointment process. The system now allows for people to get accepted who are less qualifed than others, all because of the basis on State residency. The Coast Guard Academy does it ... why don't the others? But I digress, that is a totally different point. </p>

<p>The point is, the nomination source DOES matter, and also the type of nomination ... principal, competitive, etc. And if you just look at the numbers, it makes sense that getting into the academy under a presidential nomination is harder than getting in under a Congressman's principal nomination or even his/her's competitive nomination.</p>

<p>I guess I just answered my own question though ...</p>

4

<p>Good analysis. How many appointments actually get made out of the presidential pool?</p>

5

<p>Having just sat through both Senatorial and Congressional interviews in the last week it is really "in your face" what the competition is like. It is hard to get your hopes up when you sit with and talk to such qualified candidates. In NY all are submitted equally (at least for the 2 interviews my son has done) and the academy chooses. He received a Congressional nomination yesterday and based on the stats having that and a qualified letter puts you in the best place you can be at if you don't have a LOA. Now it's just wait and update your file as appropriate. I agree that the system doesn't seem totally up to date but if your goal is a career in the military I guess you need to learn to accept what you cannot control.</p>

<p>What was really reassuring is that inspite of all the news to the contrary...this country has a large population of very intelligent, motivated and involved yound men and women that will make a difference in whatever their career path is!</p>

6

<p>There are unlimited nominations under the presidential category, but only 100 appointments.</p>

7

<p>Don't know about USAFA but over the last 3 years at USNA, the average number of presidential nominations was 468 while the average number of appointments was 89.</p>

8

<p>Hmm ... those are actually pretty good odds. We'll just wait and see :)</p>

9

<p>...particularly given that I'm sure a number of those nominated failed to qualify medically or physically. Good luck.</p>

10

<p>Also, most presidential nominations are not used by ppl who have them but also have congressional nominations. The academy will use your congressional, while preserving the presidential for someone lese.</p>

11

<p>Then why don't they wait until the congressional nominations are in before appointing from the Presidential pool?</p>

12

<p>Good analysis all around, folks! I can see that I can be gone for awhile and the informed participants here do a great job. The USAFA (and USMA and USNA, I'm sure) admissions folks do a lot of hard work to construct the class they want--one that best represents the US, conforms with federal law on appointments, meets minority targets, maintains overall quality, etc. MANY kids have multiple nominations, which gives the board significant flexibility. They may take a kid on a Presidential early to lock them in, then they can use his/her congressional slot later for someone who's very competitive, but didn't have all their stuff in by October.</p>

<p>There are other considerations, too... For about 1800 appointments offered each year (resulting in a class of about 1300 for BCT--a VERY high Yield by national standards), MANY are what are called "qualified alternates." Senators and congressmen have about 700 openings each year (based on (435+100)*5 slots each divided by 4 class years) to fill. The Pres has 100, then there are about 150-200 from the Prep School and other prep scholarships. That leaves about 600-800 each year that are either direct appointment (athletic recruits mostly) and "qualified alternates." </p>

<p>The Qualified Alternate pool is where the very competitive states and congressional districts make out VERY well. Let's say you're from a very competitive area--for example, Fairfax County, Virginia. A Rep. there gets 10 noms for his/her one slot. One (either the principal nominee or the Academy selection) must be taken, if qualified, by USAFA. The other 9 then must compete either based on their other nomination(s) or as QAs. All of the QAs from around the country are tossed into the hopper and USAFA makes their picks to fill out the class. It's not uncoming in places like Fairfax for 6 or 7 (sometimes all 9) of the QAs from a congressional district or from a senator's list to get an appointment, especially in areas where you need to have 1400 SATs and multiple athletic letters just to be considered for an interview!!!</p>

13

<p>I've been doing this blog for a couple weeks, and will try to keep it updated pretty frequently..</p>

<p><a href="http://usnab.blogspot.com%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://usnab.blogspot.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

14

<p>"The bottom line is that if you aren't an athelete, don't have an admiral in your pocket, and you're not a legacy its basically a crap-shoot to see who gets in. " ~ From USNA07's blog</p>

<p>Somebody sounds a little bitter ... I wonder why?</p>

<p>"When I applied for the class of '06, I didn't make it. I was referred to the US Naval Academy Foundation Program for a year of prep-school. My parents forked over $25,000 for me to go to the Mercersburg Academy." ~ Also from USNA07's blog </p>

<p>Oooooh ... I guess that explains it. </p>

<p>I've known plenty of people who weren't anything that you described, but who got in because of those "creditils" (spelling isn't one of them, eh?) you say everyone has. lol. I've known 3 people who weren't athletes, but had great EC's and great grades who got in.</p>

15

<p>I also read the "blog" and unless you are 21, it is pretty risky to brag (in print for the world to see) about your drinking experiences. It is cause for separation.</p>

<p>I am sorry you are so bitter because you had to wait an extra year, and are envious of others whom you deem to be inferior to yourself getting appointments right out of high school. The attitude of superiority (arrogance) is not a characteristic of a great military leader; it will not endear you to your subordinates.</p>

<p>There are many who have received appointments based on their accomplishments and character, not because of a legacy or political "pull". Please do not paint all midshipmen with the same broad brushstroke. I am sorry that your experiences have left you so jaded. I do suspect that they are the exception, not the norm.</p>

<p>Best wishes for a happy holiday and a happier USNA tour than what you have had to date.
CM</p>

16

<p>Let's drop the discussion of this blog. The link's posted. The info posted from that blog indicates its quality. Go there if you want, but we WILL NOT waste the USAFA discussion board bandwidth on this one...</p>

<p>(Administrator's exception: As most of you know by now, I'm personally VERY positive about athletics being a MANDATORY part of any service academy candidate's preparation. History and personal experience, as well as a boatload of statistics back me up on this--show up at an SA without significant athletic experience or ability and the chances are HIGH (not certain, but high) that you'll struggle). Comments about political/military connections aren't worth addressing.</p>