<p>minimom2: My guess is he will mull it over and come to a decision on his own before May 1st. Right now he is probably feeling incredible pressure to make a decision but he has several more weeks to decide. S1 had several scholarships to W&M, we threw a used car into the deal since we had done prepaid tuition, but he still felt more connected to Princeton. He is now a senior there, working hard on his thesis (this is a big, but not all-important consideration), did not care about eating clubs so went independent where he could cook for himself in campus apartments or join a meal co-op. He has no regrets but did comment once after a visit to his many friends at WM that he was glad he didn’t go there because they did not feel as challenged as they would have liked. That being said, these were extremely bright kids from a nationally know HS. He is challenged at Princeton, but not at all overwhelmed. Socially, he has done what he would have at WM, found friends with common interests, gotten involved in what interests him, and really not been concerned with what the stereotype of the school is.
D1 is a freshman at WM (my alma mater) and loves it. She too, does her own thing socially, will never go greek, but has found many friends. She works hard, but her grades are great and she has a nice balance of work and fun.
They are both pretty, insular campuses with more conservative students than most schools. Sports is not big at either. Both attract great faculty, both have great class size, etc. I’m sure you know all of this. The major advantage I see with Princeton is its proximity to NYC and Philly via the dinky and njtransit and the frustrating fact that so many people have no inkling of WM’s existence.
I would reassure him that it is his decision to make, that you will answer any questions or concerns he might have, and that you will support him no matter what. He really can’t go wrong. If he needs to miss school to visit them both again, either at accepted student days or just on overnights, try to plan visits so he can get one last feel for each school now that he knows they are a reality.</p>
<p>Nothing is as sad as a student who is planning on transferring. You cant be a freshman twice. Transferring as a back up plan is a terrible idea.</p>
<p>My husband taught at both Princeton and William and Mary. He did not think the academic quality or artistic talent of the students was significantly different, though at Princeton more of them came from the NYC area and from prep schools, and at W & M more of them were local. </p>
<p>Princeton’s proximity to NYC might be a huge plus for an art student, depending on what your kid is interested in. W & M, on the other hand, is not all that far from DC and also close to Richmond, which has a small but lively art scene and a nice museum.</p>
<p>I don’t think he should start at W & M and transfer to Princeton, even if that’s possible. The sense of class cohesion at Princeton is pretty strong and is reinforced by the underclass residential college system and the very extensive freshman orientation. Somebody who showed up in his sophomore year would be odd man out.</p>
<p>“We visited all the schools before applications were in and some even after they were in, so I do not think it’s a matter of him not liking one school over the other.”</p>
<p>?? It doesn’t sound like your son is fond of Princeton as a college choice.</p>
<p>However, it’s your dime and you are older and wiser, so I would (despite the party line here to let him choose and bite the bullet when he chooses the less prestigious W & M) make him go to Princeton and after a year, re-evaluate the decision.</p>
<p>It is really a wonderful problem to have and I cannot imagine that either choice would be wrong.</p>
<p>Love the “Skippy” comment. W&M will allow more flexibility and it will be easier to double major (no senior thesis).</p>
<p>And the joke is…Do you know why Jefferson started UVA? His kids couldn’t get in to W&M.</p>
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<p>would you really force your kid to go somewhere they didn’t want to go? This doesn’t seem to jive with the rest of your post, so hopefully I am misinterpreting… but if I am not, this is my response: If you were my parent, that would be the end of our relationship. No phone calls, no help when you get older, and I wouldn’t go to your funeral (if someone planned one, because I wouldn’t).</p>
<p>OP’s kid needs to weigh the decision carefully. Look at pros and cons of both. There is still plenty of time, and should revisit both schools. If he ends up choosing W&M, I hope you can give it a chance to win your heart, OP. It’s a great place.</p>
<p>“If you were my parent, that would be the end of our relationship. No phone calls, no help when you get older, and I wouldn’t go to your funeral (if someone planned one, because I wouldn’t).”</p>
<p>Umm, okay, sounds like something from a Gossip Girl script, but I do understand the OP’s perspective, I really do. I am actually a horrible and old fashioned parent who would not have a problem, if I felt strongly about it, to tell the child that he should attend Princeton for a year and then re-evaluate. W&M is not going anywhere and would welcome him as a transfer IF he was horribly unhappy at Princeton.
I do not know why the OP would like her child to go to Princeton, but it isn’t some form of child abuse to recommend to your child that he attend one school over another; the worst that would happen is it might become an ongoing family joke about “…the time mom made me go to Princeton…”</p>
<p>Now, mind you, I would let my kid choose, all things being equal in terms of academic majors needed and such, because they do not seem like radically different places to my provincial mind. But I DO understand the OP’s mindset. </p>
<p>PS Funerals can be pre-planned :-)</p>
<p>:-)</p>
<p>Yeah, my mean old mom *forced *me to go to Princeton. That really would be a family joke. I think if you read what the OP has said, she’s not trying to force her son to go to Princeton; rather, she thinks he may be making a bad decision, and is trying to handle the situation diplomatically.</p>
<p>One other suggestion: is there a respected adult he could talk it over with who isn’t invested in any particular result? Somebody who is not a family member–like a family friend, a Scout leader, somebody like that?</p>
<p>Visited W&M with D yesterday and were very impressed. D is admitted to Dartmouth and Williams as well but as of now seems to prefer W&M. We met with the director of the honors program for a 45 minute private meeting and asked him what he saw as a key difference between W&M and my D’s other schools. A point he raised was that he felt that academics and social life were more integrated at W&M. He suggested we explore whether at the other schools its study, study, study every waking minute Monday thru Thursday and then party non-stop the entire weekend. I’m probably not explaining this adequately but we did think he made a valid point and we will be considering this.</p>
<p>There’s plenty of partying at W&M.</p>
<p>Is there a girlfreind involved?</p>
<p>Sometimes kids do silly things at this age for love…see: Romeo & Julliette.</p>
<p>Not that going to WM would be as stupid as some things kids do for love, since it is a really stellar academic institution with a fantastic history. Good luck to both you and your son.</p>
<p>I discussed this with our DD and wanted her own opinion as a student.</p>
<p>Here is the synopsis…
“I would resent you for the rest of my life!”</p>
<p>That is my DD’s opinion and neither her or I have a vested interested, but I hope you stop for a minute or two from being a parent and be them. W&M is not the CC college down the road, it is HIGHLY RESPECTED. Kids here in VA that get into UVA and W&M are having issues deciding (UVA is only behind BERKELEY for Public). </p>
<p>To state that Princeton is close to Philly for museums is absolutely ridiculous! Princeton is at least 1 hr away by car or train. Trust me my family lives off of exit 7A/8/8A…if you don’t what that means then you don’t know Jersey. I went to college in Philly. I can tell you that if he drove from Princeton he would take 195 to 1 to 76/676 to get there. If Art is his major and you use the museums as a reason than UPenn would have been a better option or American/Gtown(Smithsonian). </p>
<p>No parent wants to hear or read that their opinion is off the mark, but the real question is…Are you going to hold the tuition check over his head until he sees your point?</p>
<p>IMHO you love and adore him, you want the best for him and you believe it is Princeton. He is saying it isn’t Princeton. At some point we as parents, must allow them to leave the nest. You raised a great child TRUST HIM.</p>
<p>As mom to one college student, and number 2 in the wings, I have very strong ideas of where I HOPE(D) my kids would go to school. That being said, I left everything dealing with college selection to D1. She picked schools to visit, I drove. She prepared on her own for SAT/ACT. Only rule, be done by 11/1 and handed her the credit card. Never saw an app or essay. Result? I have the happiest, most motivated student a parent could ever want. Where you go to college is not as important as what you do with that
time. I know nothing about Princeton, I do know about W&M, a Virginia jewel. A student will thrive, mature and grow where they are happy. Choose a school with that in mind. You can still claim the Princeton acceptance for parental bragging rights.</p>
<p>I have the answer. He should go to Chapel Hill. I have 3 degrees from William and Mary and loved every minute there, but UNC Chapel Hill had been my dream school but it was OOS and too expensive. </p>
<p>If you want him to go to Princeton, tell him he’s more likely to get better grades there. </p>
<p>I think he just wants to feel it is his decision and I’ll bet he chooses Princeton in the long run, but he has to feel as though he came to that decision on his own. </p>
<p>My advice is to back off even more. When he does his pro/con list, be as engaged about W&M as you are about Princeton. If you try to steer him, he will know it and go the other way.</p>
<p>Both are outstanding liberal arts colleges. He sounds like a wonderful young man who will flourish in either school. The decision should be his because…
why did you allow him to apply to W&M in the first place if you were against him going should he be accepted at another school?</p>
<p>This is a conversation you should have had before he started applying to schools. I think it is somewhat unfair to give your kid the green light to apply to schools without telling him that, if he gets into Princeton, that’s what you will pay for and that’s where he is going.</p>
<p>Our daughter applied to 8 schools. Some are ranked much higher than others. We reviewed the list before she applied. We threw out 2 off the list. We told her we were unwilling to pay for them because we considered the academics poor and she needed to get back to the drawing board. She got into 7 schools. We have told her we are at peace with whatever school she chooses. We know that the quality of her academic experience in completely in her hands.</p>
<p>I think that you should probably lay low for a little bit. It doesn’t sound like your son dislikes Princeton, or is intimidated by it, or even that he strongly prefers W&M. What I’m hearing is a high school student who feel sort of boxed into a decision (because everyone expects it) rather than being allowed to come to it on his own.</p>
<p>Can you go to one of the admit visits at Princeton–April 15-17 or April 22-24? He might be swayed by those. Also, has he joined the facebook page for admitted students? Sometimes speaking with fellow admitted students can help you reach a decision.</p>
<p>As a Princeton alumni and the mother of a graduating senior (who just turned in her thesis–yay!), I think that the Princeton undergraduate experience is amazing, offering incredible academic opportunities and a low-key, happy, intelligent student body. I also think that the Princeton Art History department is one of the strongest in the country (according to the Gourman undergraduate rankings it’s #3) and I’m fairly certain it’s stronger than the W&M art history department. If your son could be swayed by logic, you would probably win, but I think it’s one of those times that you have to step back a little.</p>
<p>“why did you allow him to apply to W&M in the first place if you were against him going should he be accepted at another school?”</p>
<p>Come on – you know why. It would be dereliction of duty for a parent to insist that the child apply only to reach schools. Everybody needs matches and safeties. You might as well ask why the student applied to Princeton if he liked W&M better. If he got into Princeton, he was pretty much going to get into W&M too.</p>
<p>There’s nothing evil about a parent having a strong preference for one school over another if the child gets in everywhere. The only question is how, and and how much, to express that preference to the child.</p>
<p>bulletandpima: WOW - why are you so angry with me?? Yes, as a matter of fact, I do know the distance from Princeton to Philly and NYC. And I do know the Princeton area - he won’t need a car because the ‘dinky train’ station is right next to the campus. Yes it does take time but he traveled to and from both of these cities while visiting - it is very easy and lots of kids do it. As for the comparisons to other schools - that argument is invalid/moot! He did not apply to them - these are the schools he applied to and, I might add, he choose all the schools on his own. I did not give any suggestions about where he should or should not apply. My main argument as always been = just because everyone jumps to the conclusion he is going to Princeton that is not a reason to NOT go - that is the only thing he has said about the whole thing. He has not given me a reason to go or NOT go to Wm&Mary either. I have never said “GO TO Princeton OR Wm&Mary or else no money or I won’t love you or whatever”. Perhaps my opening post was not stated as clearly as it could have been - the only reason given to not go to Princeton was ‘everyone thinks I’m going’. And if you read my last post - I AM leaving it up to him, an incredibly smart and wonderful kid who makes decisions on his own all the time with clarity and insight. It just so happens that I did not see any clarity or insight - just overly concerned about what his peers thought. I also do not need ‘bragging rights’ - I know what a wonderful, smart, talented person he is - he has never been one to ‘toot his own horn’ or wanted any one else to do it for him. Also I do know about VA schools too - daughter goes to UVA, husband went to Tech, brother went to Wm&M and friends of family go to JMU. So please calm down, lighten up - read my last/earlier post again - I’m leaving the decision up to him and am truly at the point where I’m sorry I started the post.</p>
<p>midatlmom - sincere thank you for your post. I have been laying low and would not dream of confronting him with any negative feelings toward either school. Just want to make sure he has good reasons to attend W&M or Princeton.</p>
<p>minimom - as I said, I’ll bet Princeton wins out, but, as an alum, I hope W&M gets him! </p>
<p>I have a friend who chose Duke over Princeton and another who chose UVA over Princeton. They each assumed they would choose Princeton but were both completely turned off by Princeton when they visited. That can happen with any school.</p>