<p>Is there any rule of thumb to estimate how much a student's PSAT scores will improve from 10th to 11th grade? </p>
<p>Is 7 points per section a realistic hope if the kid preps seriously?</p>
<p>has he taken any practice tests? I think that kind of jump is significant but could be possible if he didn't prep at all sophomore and now has more knowledge under his belt and more familiarity with the format. Besides the practice test in the booklet they distribute at school, you are able to buy additional past tests from the collegeboard, about a week's lead time for delivery based on the anecdotes in the parents of '10 thread.</p>
<p>Good luck</p>
<p>There are other posts that cover this -- soph to jr PSATS, seventh-grade to 11th-grade SATs. I don't any of them ever arrives at a firm number. Depends on how much the kids study, etc. As they say YMMV.</p>
<p>I do have a friend whose son went down a point!</p>
<p>Thanks for the replies. </p>
<p>Son went into the soph test cold. He is currently doing practice tests leading up to next month. I did, in fact, buy some from the collegeboard. </p>
<p>I just found this on collegeboard.com. <a href="http://www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/counselors/psat/percentiles-mean-scores.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/counselors/psat/percentiles-mean-scores.pdf</a></p>
<p>If I guesstimate son staying in the same percentile this year that he was in last year, then it looks like his scores could go as follows...</p>
<p>CR 65--> 70
M 59 --> 63/64
W 57 --> 64/65</p>
<p>That would be a 181 to 197/199 increase. So close, yet so far from "Commended." :)</p>
<p>Stay tuned. In a few months I'll let you know how it turns out.</p>
<p>I'm not sure of any rule, but for me I went in cold both times and scored approximately 10-15 better on each section the second time I took it Junior year. The reason for this improvement, in my opinion, comes from a familiarity with the format as well as simply a year's more knowledge. I had good teachers in 10th grade who taught me SAT vocab and good PSAT algebra skills so that definitely helped.<br>
I'd say 7, or even more, points of improvement in each section is definitely possible. If his current teachers aren't doing SAT vocab or math practice, studying on his own could bring his scores up in those sections. Studying will help, but I think improvement really does come naturally with a year more of learning.</p>
<p>I dont know about this. I think It really depends on not only your prep but your state of mind during the test.</p>
<p>I did not prep for my first PSAT (soph) or SAT (soph) last year and my scores were</p>
<p>PSAT (October)
Reading-73
Math-61
Writing-57</p>
<p>SAT (June)
Reading-720
Math-660
Writing-680</p>
<p>My reading went down while writing jumped 110 points even with a terrible essay. I think it's a lot to do with how you go into the test. When I Took the PSAT I was nervous and tense (not to mention without a calculator). When I took my SAT I was confident (cocky about reading =/) and tended to go with my gut more than on the PSAT.</p>
<p>This 1910 to 2060 improvement came with no more prep than taking 2 practice tests about a month before the SAT. With hardcore prep and the right mindset I think anything is possible!</p>
<p>DB, that's a neat way of looking at it, by comparing percentiles. I did that for my son, and he'd be so close yet so far from NMSF (2-3 points). Yes, in a few months they'll all see how they do. Good luck!</p>
<p>^ I'm not sure you can simply compare percentiles because the samples are very different. The sophomores taking the test are a significantly smaller group, and I'd guess somewhat more skewed toward academic high achievers---after all, these are for the most part people who are looking ahead and taking a non-required test as practice in preparation for the "real" one a year away. If that's right, then a high percentile ranking (say in the top 5%) in that smaller, presumably higher-achieving sophomore group may be a more significant accomplishment than scoring in the top 5% of the much larger and more mixed group that will take the test as juniors. Maybe. </p>
<p>Anyway, just doing a straight comparison between the two groups, it looks like the mean score for juniors is about 4 points per section higher than for sophomores, so a goal of a 7 point improvement per section doesn't seem unrealistic.</p>
<p>I improved a lot from sophomore to junior, because in the beginning of my soph year I was just starting advanced geometry. I improved greatly from PSAT to SAT too. I didn't prep for the PSAT, but I did prep for the SAT. </p>
<p>CR 59-63-720
M 46-51-590
W 57-59-630</p>
<p>Anyone can improve with practice. It just takes getting familiar with the test.</p>
<p>I improved from 190 to 217 from 10th to 11th grades, so yes, improvement is definitely plausible.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I'm not sure you can simply compare percentiles because the samples are very different. The sophomores taking the test are a significantly smaller group, and I'd guess somewhat more skewed toward academic high achievers---after all, these are for the most part people who are looking ahead and taking a non-required test as practice in preparation for the "real" one a year away.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>bc, I have absolutely no doubt that you are far more knowledgeable than I am about all college things. So what I'm about to say is probably the exception, not the rule. </p>
<p>At Son's school, the 10th grade PSAT is mandatory and free. All sophomores are required to take it. It's the 11th grade PSAT that is optional and positioned for kids with college aspirations and NMS potential. For Son, the 10th grade sample is big; the 11th grade sample is small. </p>
<p>I bet your quote is generally accurate for the vast majority of test takers. But it's not for all. :)</p>
<p>Improvement is possible, but only if you work at it. My friend took it as a soph and got a 220 (definitely NMSF), but then took it again junior year without studying and got a 200 (barely commended). Of course he never studies for anything and does ridiculously well most times, but not this time. So my advice is study practice tests</p>
<p>I guess that's the problem with the psats....the scores can vary so much that your odds of improving are limited drastically, no matter how much "prep" you would do. </p>
<p>my soph psat score was a 185...and on my other hand, my jr/national merit score was 219. i did take SAT classes over the summer, and i guess that could have helped? but honestly, i have no idea how one would specifically prep for the psats</p>
<p>I think improvement of 7 pts. per section can easily happen with prep. My S improved about 6 pts. per section from Soph. to Junior (and eventually went on to NMF) Peterson's used to put out a PSAT prep. book-not sure if they have a very current one though. I think just the experience with the test helps also-Junior year being the second time taking it for lots of kids-but I would still prep. :-)</p>
<p>I went up 20 points from soph to jr year- so I guess 7 points a section would be realistic with lots of studying.</p>
<p>More sophomores than juniors take the PSAT nationwide, which surprised me, because in my state until recently very few sophomores took the PSAT.</p>
<p>^ tokenadult, do you have figures on this? I was looking at the stats in the link in post #4 above above which showed about 1.033 million juniors and 786,000 sophomores took the PSAT, but it turns out those data were for 2003:</p>
<p>But in a more recent year, 2005, College Board shows the gap narrowing considerable, with 715,000 sophomores and 770,000 juniors taking the PSAT:</p>
<p>This is surprising and a little baffling. It suggests that there aren't more sophomores taking the PSAT; instead fewer juniors are taking it. Why would that be?</p>
<p>Here it could be because the school pays for all sophomores, and freshmen taking Algebra II or higher, to take the PSAT, but doesn't pay for juniors to take it. Doesn't make sense to me, but that's how they do it.</p>
<p>And maybe more juniors are focusing on the ACT and not taking the PSAT second time in junior year. But I agree, the trend is baffling.</p>
<p>Hi, bclintonk, thanks for asking the specific follow-up question. I miswrote and appreciate the chance to correct what I wrote. The correct statement is "Most PSAT test-takers are students younger than juniors," and the statement can be verified by looking at </p>
<p>
<p>In 2007, 53 percent of PSAT/NMSQT test-takers were sophomores or younger students.
</p>
<p>About</a> the Test</p>
<p>Do not prep for the PSATs! It is a practice test! A practice test! If you don't prep you should go up around 10 points, like I did. I got 80 CR sophmore year, which went down to 75 junior year, but my math and writing went way up. In any case, it doesn't matter.</p>