The quality of education is driven by (1) resources (professors and facilities) and access to those resources by undergrads and (2) maybe even more importantly the quality of classmates. For most state universities, there can be wide variation in the quality of (1) and (2) by major/sub school. The other factor to consider is the honor college/program of these flagships. Not all honor programs are created equal, but if the honor college(s) has critical resources devoted to it and keeps those students together, often you create a best of all worlds situation. In that case, an honors college in an otherwise âmediocreâ flagship may provide a superior education/experience than a general program in a more prestigious flagship.
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But a mediocre state flagship (just using the threadâs terminology) might not provide robust options for Plan B or C if the student doesnât get into med school- a not insignificant percentage of solid med school applicants get into zero med schools every year. So then the question is- what is Plan B?
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This needs to be explored for sure, but there are plenty of other major options at all flagship universities.
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It isnât a question of major-those decisions were made earlier. By the time the student at mediocre u is rejected by med school, they may have a harder time finding a job as their undergrad prep is considered substandard. A possibility for pre-meds to consider.
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@roycroftmom the premed student should have a Plan B from the very first day they start college. I do believe this plan B can be found at just about every flagship university in this country.
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Of course Plan B is at every flagship U in the country. But after the fact- the bio major who went to âmediocre state Uâ because itâs much easier (or so everyone says) to be a 4.0 student and get a committee letter-- even when itâs not-- these are the kids who DONâT have plan B. And it may take two rounds of med school applications and rejections to come to the realization that physician isnât the career path- then what?
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Iâm not sure there are that many âmediocreâ flagship universities. Some are highly ranked in certain programs but not others. Also, how much does a ârankingâ determined by a for profit news magazine mean.
If you look at the SEC and ACC southern schools, applications were up significantly this year over previous years. As a result, kids who would have considered these schools safety schools as recently as last year are getting deferred, denied or waitlisted. And these are kids with over 4.0 GPAâs and 1400 SATâs.
I believe LSU released their admit profile and there were close to 50,000 applications for 7,000 spots, so there are plenty of kids who might have thought it âmediocre â but were rejected. Schools that had 60-70% admit rates a year ago, are now way more selective.
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Apparently no school is average any more. LSU is a fine school that serves its population well. It is affordable and accessible to its state population, with low cost, a 73% admissions rates, and modest SAT scores of 1090-1300. That does not make it elite. Not among flagships, nor among private universities.
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You are conflating yield and acceptance rates. There are 7,000 spots, but the vast majority of accepted students do not enroll at LSU.
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Is it really so outrageous to say a school that shows up in the middle of the pack in some magazine ratings can also be a fine school that serves its population well?
Who said it was âelite?â
For some it seems there are only two categories; âeliteâ or âmediocre.â That isnât a meaningful or helpful scale for most college bound students.
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It is when the relevant discussion from which this arose is a choice between a world-class elite university (MIT) and a relatively modest one (LSU, ranked 176th currently). One can bicker about the exact term to be used ( mediocre, average, basic?) Or the cutoff used ( top 100 colleges? Top 50? Top 150?) But at some point it is reasonable to recognize a qualitative difference between number 1 and number 176.
University of Alaska, Fairbanks, does not make the top 300 school ranking. U of Maine accepts 96% of its applicants. Both may be fine for their mission but fairly described as mediocre.
I can think of a number of career paths available to people with pre-med backgrounds who donât get into med school: physical therapy, nursing, public health, science teaching, psychology, environmental policy (with bio or chem backgrounds), science research ⊠I know several people who tried and failed to get into med school the first time around, got a Masterâs in an adjacent field (one of the sciences, or public health or similar), tried again, and got in. The majors pre-med students typically choose have a lot of available career paths. There is no pre-med major that locks you in.
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If you mean biology, note that it graduates a lot of students every year. Competition for health professional school admissions and biology-related jobs is rather high, so biology graduates do not have the greatest job and pay prospects (contrary to popular belief that all STEM majors have good job and pay prospects).
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Not surprised that you equate lack of admissions selectivity with mediocrity, but for some schools (especially public schools) the goal of higher education is not limited to teaching only the overachievers.
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I donât believe that STEM automatically leads to great job prospects (Iâm a history professor, and the STEM fetish drives me nuts) - just saying that there are many ways you can go with that degree preparation, as I indicated in my response. Itâs not med school or bust.
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Or rather âeliteâ or ânotâ 
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Got it. I agree that itâs attracting students today whoâd have never considered it a few years ago. And itâs not all money either. We know some folks whose kids with UofWashington offers chose it because itâs not âwokeâ and because they think Seattle has become a third world location now. Those are my spouseâs friends. Not my type personally. When theyâre over, I make sure to dial my charmometer down to 5 so theyâll leave sooner. You donât want to see me at 11.
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I googled âopposite of eliteâ for some clarity on whether elite vs mediocre was an accurate dichotomy. This answer, though lol
There are 50 states. Maine and Alaska rank in the bottom bucket of state flagship universities, based upon a variety of criteria which you can dispute. Or we can act as if they are all peer universities to MIT and the qualitative differences are irrelevant.
No one at MIT, Alaska or Maine thinks that they are peers.
They are not peer universities nor do they aim to be. Their educational mission is entirely different. I think the sticking point is whether that mission automatically (and objectively) makes them inferior or âmediocre.â
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