<p>Obviously a huge factor in me trying to decide whether I should apply to WP is whether I could adapt to its drastically different lifestyle and obligations. I think I could handle the physical regimen, the classwork, the lack of females, the military training and would even enjoy the minimum of 5 years of military service it entails. </p>
<p>However some people describe WP to me as a place where they enforce minor and trivial details such as: older students having a virtual tyranny over the younger ones, room checks to the degree where your clothes hangers have to be equidistant from one another, having to wear uniform even when you're traveling home from WP, dress inspections where you are reprimanded if a button is out of line, and someone even told me they make you chew a certain number of times when eating food.</p>
<p>How much of this is true and how much of it do you have to put up with on a daily or weekly basis at WP?</p>
<p>Nalcon, you can look at it as being hassled over trivia, but the military doesn't see it that way and for good reason. They are trying to teach you that attention to detail is important.
Someday, graduates will be responsible for equipment and people in situations where lives are on the line. A minor detail overlooked could result in a failed mission and dead troops. They want to find out NOW if you are the kind of person who can get it right down to the last detail. Better to train you and test you on hangar widths and buttons than to wait until crisis time.
It can be annoying, but developing the habit of being hyper-careful and precise is a good thing. 20 plus year after the fact, I can still hear my company commander shouting "Attention to detail" in my nightmares.</p>
<p>Well... Most of that is true, at least in part. You don't have to wear a uniform when going home, though. Your room has to be in AMI every morning, which means it has to be REALLY clean and nothing can be out. And yes, your clothes hanging up have to be both canted in one direction and an equal distance apart. Yes, the upperclassmen have tyranny over the underclassmen (and it's not virtual, it's real).</p>
<p>It's much worse in Beast. You'll get in trouble for small strings hanging off your uniform, you're only allowed 3 chews. Beast is all about the small things. It gets somewhat better during the Academic year, and a lot better when you're an upperclassman.</p>
<p>hahah, just read Spidermom's post and had to edit mine. Yes, "Attention to detail," and the fact that by missing a button on a pocket you "Just killed your Platoon". Though it might seem trivial and some of it is ridiculous, there is an underlying purpose. After having experienced a little over half a year as a Plebe, I've come to a conclusion: Plebe year is there to teach you about the Duty portion of "Duty, Honor, Country". You learn to do your duty, no matter how much you hate it or don't want to, and this is extremely important.</p>
<p>If you're worried about something as little as that, then you might as well not come. Sorry to be blunt, but it's just the truth. The whole military is big on attention to detail. You WILL get yelled at, you WILL get corrected, and you WILL be talked to condescendingly. Big deal. You'll get used to it. Besides, you won't really see them as other students, at least not during Beast. Once you're an upperclassmen, you'll get chewed out by Officers and NCOs rather than other Cadets (though that happens too). </p>
<p>I'm serious--this is the least of your worries.</p>
<p>thats why I said i was wondering whether I could "adapt" to its environment, I realize I would have to change. I want to make an informed decision so I want as much information as possible, sorry if you now think I shouldnt bother.</p>
<p>On the contrary, I believe these kind of things are the only ones I would have trouble getting used to.</p>
<p>I'm just trying to tell you exactly how it is. And it's great that you might think that "these kind of things are the only ones [you] would have to get used to", but wow. If that's honestly what you think, you're gonna be in for a big shock. You would adapt. Everyone does, except the really big trouble makers.</p>
<p>And yes, the details are a HUGE part of Cadet life. I don't resent you for trying to make an informed decision, but I also think it'd be wise to trust someone who's actually already living it out. You're working on second-hand knowledge, I'm working on first-hand experience. Just trying to offer a little friendly advice about Cadet life. You want to ignore it, that's fine. Not like I get paid for my time on the forum or anything.</p>
<p>Its kind of hard not to ignore a statement that basically says if you're worried about cadet life then you shouldn't bother coming.</p>
<p>Also, you put that phrase in quotation marks but you left out a very important word, I said these kind of things are the only ones I think I would have trouble(notice this word) getting used to, I didn't say I wouldn't have to adapt.</p>
<p>I'm glad that's hard to ignore, because it's the truth. Oh, and by the way--reread my post and you'll notice the "And it's great that you might THINK".</p>
<p>And you know what? You can think what you want. More power to you. You'll be missing the thinking on your own bit when you get to Beast. And on that note, I don't have the time, energy, or will to argue with a Candidate about what West Point is like. I spend my own time, which is severely limited to begin with, trying to help you guys out. If that's the kind of attitude you're going to be bringing to the Academy, be prepared to get hazed. The upperclassmen don't like rebels or self-righteousness. I'm one of the most easy-going kids in my Company, but your comments are quite impressive. That's too bad if you don't like the advice. Have a nice night.</p>
<p>Can't add much beyond what marines4me has said - except some observations about my son (who's in marines4me's plebe class) My son is a slob - after he's home for a weekend, it's taken my wife a few hours to clean up his room (he has the whole attic). He hasn't complained at all about keeping his room neat at WP - in fact, he sent me 10 digital photos of his room just prior to his last Saturday a.m. inspection - including a photo of the report reading "great job". After time at home he's become very, very efficient at what to bring back. You'll be surprised at how little there is to keep neat since you won't have much in the way of civilian clothing. Since you have to haul your own garbage, you'll be surprised at how efficient you become at not generating waste.</p>
<p>My son's major option besides WP were UCLA, UT, Wisconsin - he was all set for UCLA (5 miles from the beach, 58 percent female, warm weather and not a lot of clothing) and then he spent a night at West Point - called us from the highway afterwards telling us he was going to WP. SO - if you get in, go spend a night. </p>
<p>My son's attitude during Beast - and even now - was that as long as no one could touch him, he could handle the "abuse". It's just a mindset. Now from my own experience - it's no worse than having to put up with the bull***** in the corporate world if you don't like your boss, or your clients who are paying your bills, or your wife/husband when they're on the warpath about something. Sometimes you just put up with things - at least for a short time. That's life. </p>
<p>Last, my son's done well academically and athletically and has received a number of spirit passes and weekend passes. He's been able to go visit friends at colleges all over the Northeast. So, even during Plebe year, it's not like going to prison. Marines4me might say something different, though.</p>
<p>Basically, I think marines4me is saying what most people would agree on: if you're worried about even the slightest details of cadet life, then maybe West Point isn't for you. If you want to serve in the military after college and realize that you will be criticized every single day for what seems to be the most trivial things (so you can become the best officer after college), then go for it. marines4me has firsthand experience on what it takes to succeed at West Point. marines4me: I really appreciate your advice.</p>
<p>No BigGreen, I'd agree. It also just depends on your Company's culture. Mine is pretty harsh. And you CAN handle the abuse. After awhile though, it does kind of start to wear on you. All of it is bearable, though. And I'd say that it IS very similar to the corporate world, at least once you're an upperclassmen (and sometimes as a lower classmen as well). You makes enemies, just like anywhere else. I'm a decent Cadet--I have a 3.23 (soon to be a 3.5), an A militarily and physically. This will put me pretty far near the top of my class. Spirit passes are awesome if you live in a very big city or somewhere near a big city.</p>
<p>Oh, and about the whole neatness thing--I become a TOTAL slob when I go home too. It's the only time you can finally letdown and just relax.</p>
<p>Not a problem TMac--sorry if I seemed a little angry in the above post, but it's frustrating when I'm working hard and going through all of this and then be disagreed with. I'm seriously only trying to help people out here. I want to be able to tell you guys things that I didn't know before I came in order to help you make a better decision.</p>
<p>As the aog website states, if you never feel like quitting while your at wp, then wp has not done its job properly. Many candidates know that wp is not going to be an easy ride, making it a tough decision to make. I am positive that noone is completely sure if they want to devote 12 yrs of their life when they are 17 years old. I am worried about the trials of cadet life and am trying my best to prepare for them. I am unsure about going to wp but does that mean I should just forget about it? No, it would be stupid of me to blindly go to wp and have not a care in the world. I think worry is a good thing in this process. It allows you to question yourself and can either make your devotion stronger or allows you to discover it is not the place for you. </p>
<p>BTW: we value your input here m4m. Its certainly not easy to advise us candidates on the rigors of wp. Oh I've been meaning to ask you if you still wanna go marines?</p>
<p>Dont worry about it, the upperclassman have control over you but really its not that bad. Sometimes you'll think "what the hell, if I were anyplace else this guy would have no authority over me," but you get used to it. Generally, if you just do your job relatively well nobody will really bother you. I'm in a reasonably chill company, but throughout the Corps by this point most everyone is out for themselves as far as their GPAs go. Nobody's going to let their grades tank because they want to act big screwing with plebes; anyone who does won't last in the Army too long. The hangers being equidistant isn't a big deal, its like second nature, dont sweat the small stuff. Just consider this: guys who have seen pretty heavy combat in Iraq and Afghanistan are coming here and are going through the same stuff you are. They have quite a perspective on everything. If they can handle some college kid yelling at them about something so trivial as their gig line being off without snapping, you shouldn't have a problem keeping your head about you when being corrected. Honestly, I think it should be a little harder here; not like 1950s or 1960s sadism (read "The Long Gray Line," this place was rediculous and some may argue counterproductive) but a little bit harder. Prepare for the worst, but don't think its impossible, and DON'T SWEAT SMALL STUFF. Good luck.</p>
<p>And no JQ, I don't want to go Marines. Being here has taught me the value of a big budget, and the Marines most certainly don't have one. Plus, more options are open to me being female in the Army.</p>
<p>Yeah - no matter how bad it gets here, they can't hit you. ;)</p>
<p>During Beast, every mistake you make is magnified, but it's really nothing to worry about. It will definitely seem horrible during the summer, and they will insult and degrade you, but at the same time we're all going to end up in the same place in a few years. Yes, they'll be harsh, but it's all for a purpose, and as long as you recognize that you should be fine. :)</p>
<p>In addition, it's really not that hard keeping the rooms clean. It's getting them clean and properly situated that is somewhat annoying, but that generally takes place the first week of the semester.</p>
<p>If you're even remotely interested in attending, which it appears that you are, by all means find out as much as you can before deciding. I met some people who had no idea what they were getting into, or why they were here, and those are the people who quit over the summer. But if you just stay positive, and stay dedicated, then you're good to go.</p>