<p>I agree with gdwilner 100 percent here</p>
<p>And by the way, I have a question;</p>
<p>I have to ask:</p>
<p>Is "accepting Jesus Christ as one's Savior" the only way a person can get to heaven?</p>
<p>Or in other words, are all NON-CHRISTIANS doomed in HELL?</p>
<p>I don't think anyone can answer that.</p>
<p>How is it that someone can repeatedly put forward the same ********? How is this bs remotely convincing? And what's with the bad attitudes?</p>
<p>well baller, I think any scripturally sound Christian will tell you that they cannot answer that question. We choose to accept Jesus, but that doesn't mean we know what God has planned for those who don't. It's really none of our business to speculate like that, judgments can be reserved for the ultimate Judge. hope that makes sense =)</p>
<p>Liberty, yes, it does, and thank you. Just wanted to reassure myself about that, because there were other Christians who I spoke with and they said that it was the only way.</p>
<p>I was like why don't you try to convince the atheist and not another believer from another faith in the Lord, he was arrogant.</p>
<p>Only God know your heart!</p>
<p>yeah... well just remember, Christianity, like any religion or school of thought, is going to have different groups of people who believe different things. Some will stress the fact that Jesus is the only way to the Father, while others will believe something totally different.</p>
<p>In fact, I've even heard a theory put forth by a Reverend (don't remember the name, sorry) which basically holds that since God is so forgiving, He will eventually accept everyone into heaven, even Satan.</p>
<p>It's interesting, but yes you're correct... Only God knows our hearts.</p>
<p>Islam says that only Muslims too will go to heaven, for those who "associate God with others' (e.g. Jesus Christ) are guilty of idoltary.</p>
<p>But that is not true--for all believers go to heaven.</p>
<p>And Satan sucks--I don't think he'll go to heaven.</p>
<p>haha w0rd to the Satan comment. just curious... what's your religion, baller?</p>
<p>what happens to all the good people who lived before jesus lived. Guess they're all doomed too. Sucks for them they had bad timing.</p>
<p>nope. salvation was still based on faith before Jesus.</p>
<p>Islam says that only Muslims too will go to heaven, for those who "associate God with others' (e.g. Jesus Christ) are guilty of idoltary.</p>
<p>Islam says people who believe in only one God, his Prophets(peace be upon them), and the Day of Judgement will go to heaven. And "associating God with others" means holding the status of some like Jesus Christ AS God or the Son of God. Then that is polytheism and wrong.</p>
<p>Personally, I think that whether or not someone believes in an invisible man living in the sky with no evidence whatsoever is a pretty dumb criterion for judging whether to send them to heaven or hell. This kind of arbitrary judgment is irrational, unjust, and a sign of insecurity. If God judges people based on which invisible man they pray to, then I am a much better person than he is.</p>
<p>Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and beliefs.</p>
<p>Why does God have to be an "invisible man"? He can be an all-powerful force which unites and compels the whole universe to function as it does.</p>
<p>It's interesting that many biologists are atheists while the great physicists (Bohr, Einstein, Newton), who pondered the universe on the greatest of levels, all concluded that there has to be a God.</p>
<p>Collegefreak87, you might want to do your research before making such statements. Einstein, for instance, did not believe in a sole creator living in the sky. He simply ascribed the word 'god' to that transcendental feeling he got when he awed the beauty and wonder of nature and the physical world.</p>
<p>Knightmare, that's false. He believed that God represents the sum of the physical laws in the universe, to oversimplify. It would not be incorrect to say that he believed in a sole creator, or even the same creator alluded to by Christians and Jews (like Spinoza, he believed the Bible was more allegorical than tradition holds). </p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
well baller, I think any scripturally sound Christian will tell you that they cannot answer that question. We choose to accept Jesus, but that doesn't mean we know what God has planned for those who don't. It's really none of our business to speculate like that, judgments can be reserved for the ultimate Judge. hope that makes sense =)
[/QUOTE]
Again, untrue.</p>
<p>While it is sinful for us to judge people, even based on their claims, we should judge ideas, and even be righteous in ideas related to God:</p>
<p>Psalm 94</p>
<pre><code>1 O LORD, the God who avenges,
O God who avenges, shine forth
3 How long will the wicked, O LORD,
how long will the wicked be jubilant?
8 Take heed, you senseless ones among the people;
you fools, when will you become wise?
15 Judgment will again be founded on righteousness,
and all the upright in heart will follow it.
16 Who will rise up for me against the wicked?
Who will take a stand for me against evildoers?
21 They band together against the righteous
and condemn the innocent to death.
22 But the LORD has become my fortress,
and my God the rock in whom I take refuge.
</code></pre>
<p>(some verses excluded without distorting the meaning, which is repeated many times throughout the Bible)</p>
<p>As for such judgment:</p>
<p>Mark 16
16Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.</p>
<p>John 3
1Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a member of the Jewish ruling council.2He came to Jesus at night and said, "Rabbi, we know you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the miraculous signs you are doing if God were not with him."
3In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
4"How can a man be born when he is old?" Nicodemus asked. "Surely he cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb to be born!"
5Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit.
6Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.
7You should not be surprised at my saying, 'You must be born again.' 8The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit."
9"How can this be?" Nicodemus asked.
10"You are Israel's teacher," said Jesus, "and do you not understand these things?
11I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony.
12I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?
13No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaventhe Son of Man.
14Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,
15that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son. 19This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."</p>
<p>John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him."</p>
<p>baller4lyfe:
[quote]
GD, I still can't bear the fact that you think Howard Stern crafted the Earth, or that Samantha Mumba said 'yes', and the universe was.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>The above statements, along with your references to Oprah creating the universe are utterly bizarre. He has not claimed that any human created the universe, and your efforts to mock him are pathetic. "um, you don't believe in my god, so I'm going to claim that you think oprah created the universe!!"</p>
<p>The quotes in this thread about how humans deserve to suffer and are all sinners reaffirm my rejection of my christian heritage. Sin and the concept of hell are human-made constructs, designed as fear tactics used by certain religions. My concept of god is of energy and life-force. We are all "god" and we are all interconnected. Everyone is free to believe whatever she/he wants, but when you turn patronizing and talk about how "if you don't worship my god you are in darkness/going to hell/sinner/etc" then I will not hesitate in refuting your beliefs, just as you refute mine. (this last paragraph is meant in general and not aimed at any certain person)</p>
<p>
[quote]
what happens to all the good people who lived before jesus lived. Guess they're all doomed too. Sucks for them they had bad timing.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>LOL</p>
<p>latez alligatez!</p>
<p>"All I have seen teaches
me to trust the Creator for all I have not seen' - Ralph Waldo Emerson</p>
<p>Rock on, Morgaine</p>
<p>I basically agree, but to a lesser degree of certainty. I see religion as pretty much another cultural tradition, developed to fulfill a need of some sort. And as society becomes more developed, organised religion will fall more or less out of favor, as people become able to create their own ways to fulfill their spiritual needs. </p>
<p>I'm also uncomfortable with assertations of absolute religious truth; as soon as people A start judgeing people B by A's moral standards, I'd cry foul play. If only those silly western religions could leave each other alone...</p>
<p>Videogamer, as I have argued, that kind of a criterion for salvation is just horrible. Whether or not I have blind faith in your God has absolutely no bearing on how good a person I am, or whether I would deserve salvation, and regardless, if God existed, I wouldn't want him sending people to heaven or hell based on their actions at all, since it inherently destroys the concept of freedom. Your Bible verses simply reinforce my contempt for Christianity.</p>
<p>I am reminded of the words of George Carlin: We need one additional commandment--KEEP THY RELIGION TO THYSELF!</p>