Questions About Genetics, Bio Major, Pre-Med, Schedule, etc.

Colleges and Universities A-Z Cornell University
1

<p>CAUTION - VERY LONG POST, COOKIES IF YOU READ :D</p>

<p>I'm a rising sophomore - been wavering between being premed and not premed the entire last semester (so far i've taken Chem 207/208, Bio 105, BioEE 278 - did extremely well in all of them). I was originally going to be a Neurobio and Behavior Concentrator - then started very strongly considering Biopsychology (within the Psych Major). Then considered doing Biopsych, but with a bio minor. Then considered doing a bio and psych double major. Now I'm starting to think about forgetting the biopsych and instead going with the original plan of doing Neurobio and Behavior, but with a concentration within the Cognitive Studies Program in Cognitive Neuroscience - and if you've guessed by the theme, that can easily change too. </p>

<p>I guess it might seem as if I don't really have any idea what I want to do in terms of majors, but basically my major theme with whatever I want to pursue is connecting the mind with the brain with the outside world (and within medicine too - thinking of neurology/psychiatry) - it's just a matter of figuring out how I want to get there in terms of majors and classes. Neurobio and Behavior within the Bio Major + Cognitive Neuroscience within the Cognitive Studies Concentration is the latest thing that intrigues me, and they seem to complement each other really well.</p>

<p>One of my reasons for thinking of psych was the prospect of clinical neuropsychology as a career rather than medicine - however, after researching stuff, I think that there are several similar routes within neurology and psychiatry, such as behavioral neurology. Clinical neuropsychology actually seems harder to get into than medicine in some ways, and it would kind of suck to do a Ph D in clinical psychology to get there, and specialize for a post-doc for a mere 1 or 2 years to finally do clinical neuropsychology. I would also have to take a decent amount of courses outside of the biological psychology aspect of things in order to qualify for clinical psych too, which is annoying.</p>

<p>After researching many med school sites, I have found that a great amount require biochem and a decent amount also require genetics. I think I am going to take biochem eventually, though I have more questions about genetics (to make it easier since i really would like answers to questions, i'll make it clear):</p>

<p>QUESTIONS: Concerning The Rigor of the Course in General: So I know it's probably the most rigorous bio course that everyone takes, and a lot of it is because of fruitfly lab or something. All I ever hear is that it's torture, so many hours, etc. - but what are the specifics? How many hours per day on average do you spend in the genetics lab? How many hours do you spend studying lecture stuff? Why is the lab so tedious and annoying - what are the specifics of this?</p>

<p>QUESTIONS: When is the most opportune time to take it? It seems like there's no way around taking it at a bad time. If I take it spring sophomore year, then it'll be with orgo, possibly orgo lab, and neurobio. I'm thinking that if I do that - then that will be my only course (plus research for credit, which i am starting next semester), so not counting research for credit, that will be 14 credits.</p>

<p>QUESTION: Fall junior year? If I take it fall junior year, then that may not be good since I really want to be a TA for a bio course that semester, and I can't wait to do it (I think I'd have a very good shot at getting the position since the professor said I would as long as long as I maintain my grades), and that could also take away from my sheer enjoyment of the upper level courses I will be able to take in neurobio and behavior, as well as others for fun.</p>

<p>QUESTION: Spring Junior Year: Spring junior year could be even worse, depending on when I take the MCAT's (I'm doing physics junior year - I know people recommend sophomore year for physics also so MCAT's reqs will be done, but I really want to either take a psych or cog sci course or psych stats course if i am concentrating in that too - I have to since that's what I wanna do and for my own intellectual enjoyment - I am thinking of doing it sophomore year and self studying the physics section since I've already had honors physics and AP physics in high school, done very well in both, and knowing myself i'd be able to handle it very well self-studying and with a proper MCAT prep course).</p>

<p>QUESTIONS: So that's a mouthful, but still more about genetics and pre-med courses in general. Several schools "highly recommend" courses such as genetics. Is that a de facto requirement then? The thing is that I'm a pennsylvania resident, so my chances of getting into Penn State and Drexel will be greater. However, they strongly encourage genetics, and if the other applicants have genetics, and i don't, that may be bad for my applications there, and since there's 5 allopathic med schools in PA, that's already 40 percent of the schools that I may lower my chances of getting into since I didn't take genetics. Is this an unecessary worry? I have heard many differing opinions on "highly recommended" courses (note that this is also slightly going off of the assumption of doing a psych major and bio minor - for the minor i would probably do biochem, evo, and upper level courses in nb, so no genetics)</p>

<p>QUESTIONS: This also brings me to another question on genetics - would it be fine to take it say, spring semester senior year - and tell med schools that I will eventually be taking it as a requirement for the bio major, or would that be the equivalent of not having the "highly recommended" course done and look bad anyway - and again, this is specifically for schools that request a course like genetics.</p>

<p>QUESTIONS: This is now specifically for anyone who knows about biopsych as a concentration. So I'm signed up for intro to biopsych, but now i'm thinking of switching into behavior (BioNB 221) - I know that courses outside of biopsych can be counted for the major - can 221 be counted of it too? Should I just stick to neurobio and behavior at this point, since most biopsych courses are cross-listed with nb anyway? I am still very interested in other psych courses such as adult psychopathology though - i'm so confused!!! I'm almost feeling compelled to do a bio major instead of biopsych, since if i do the later, then it'll essentially be a bio major without genetics and possibly behavior.</p>

<p>In terms of my schedule, here is my current one:</p>

<p>Intro to Biopsych
Hebrew 3
Orgo (pre-med)
Israeli-Palestinian Conflict
Psych Stats</p>

<p>Here is what I'm thinking of changing it too (unfortunately would have to drop israeli-palestinian conflict, which i really really want to take)</p>

<p>Intro to Behavior
Hebrew 3
Orgo (pre-med)
Orgo Lab (actually already signed up for it in case of a schedule changing situation, like i'm in now - good thing i did)
Cognitive Psychology OR Intro To Cognitive Science (depends on if i can get into cognitive psych)</p>

<p>QUESTIONS: Is the latter a managable schedule? I would do the 4 credit options for behavior and cognitive science (latter since i hear it's more fun and you don't do prelims and i like to write anyway). I'll also be doing research for credit too, but I really think I can handle it, especially since the past semester with chem 208, evolution, writing seminar, and hebrew - i was pretty much doing almost no work and was bored, and i feel like having evo will be a good advantage before behavior, i know i'll do well in hebrew 3, cognitive shouldn't be bad, so that leaves orgo as my really difficult course. It kinda sucks since i'll have to do add/drop now, but i think getting into behavior shouldn't be a problem, especially if it's probably my major, and similar with either cognitive class, even though psych is closed and the professor said it may be hard to get in when i e-mailed him. Anyone know specifics about how the cognitive classes i'm thinking of are, as well as behavior?</p>

<p>Sorry for the very long post - these are basically questions and concerns that have been building up for the past several months, so I figured I'd get them all out of the way now. To anyone who takes the time to answer - thank you!</p>

2

<p>First of all, I think you've set a record for the longest post...ever.</p>

<p>
[quote]
After researching many med school sites, I have found that a great amount require biochem and a decent amount also require genetics.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Really? I think around 10% of all med schools require biochem. I'll give you a cookie if you can name 3 med schools that require genetics. </p>

<p>
[quote]
QUESTIONS: Concerning The Rigor of the Course in General: So I know it's probably the most rigorous bio course that everyone takes, and a lot of it is because of fruitfly lab or something. All I ever hear is that it's torture, so many hours, etc. - but what are the specifics? How many hours per day on average do you spend in the genetics lab? How many hours do you spend studying lecture stuff? Why is the lab so tedious and annoying - what are the specifics of this?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The lab is only "scheduled" for 2 1/2 hours a week. But, as you know, you have to spend more than that amount of time. I'd guess that I (along w/ my lab partners) had to spend around 4-6 hours/week during the fruit fly portion of the lab. Sometimes we had to come into lab at odd hours, eg. to collect virgin females (females mate 5 hours after they hatch so you need to collect them within those 5 hours if you want virgin ones). Why is the fruit fly lab so tedious? Because you have to score them for various characteristics. The only characteristic you can really tell by naked eye is their eye color. The other characteristics (like the sex or whether the small bristles on their back are straight or gnarly) you need a microscope. It's pretty hard to get flies to stand still under a microscope, even after you knock them out with ether (they wake up approx. 3 minutes after being knocked out and you aren't allowed to knock them out twice because then they become sterile). In total, I think each person scored in the vinicity of 1000-2000 flies for around 4-5 characteristics per fly. In other words, you will stare into the microscope until you become blind. The average grade on the fruit fly lab report was "fair" (one step up from "poor").</p>

<p>The lecture portion is no cakewalk either. The mean on the second prelim for our class was a 51 with a high grade of 78. The rumor was that the professor (who had been teaching genetics for 30 years) took his own prelim (which he had written a few years before) and scored an 80. You are allowed to drop one prelim score. I didn't even study for the second prelim because I knew it'd be hard. I ended up studying really hard for the third one but everyone else must've too cuz I actually did worse in relation to the mean on the third prelim than the second one. So, I ended up having to keep my second prelim score haha</p>

3

<p>
[quote]
QUESTIONS: When is the most opportune time to take it? It seems like there's no way around taking it at a bad time. If I take it spring sophomore year, then it'll be with orgo, possibly orgo lab, and neurobio. I'm thinking that if I do that - then that will be my only course (plus research for credit, which i am starting next semester), so not counting research for credit, that will be 14 credits.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>The most opportune time to take it is senior year, after you've already applied to med school. I took it junior year cuz I was doing research in genetics and my PI wanted me to take it. But, I only took biochem and two other courses that semester so it was manageable. </p>

<p>
[quote]
QUESTIONS: So that's a mouthful, but still more about genetics and pre-med courses in general. Several schools "highly recommend" courses such as genetics. Is that a de facto requirement then? The thing is that I'm a pennsylvania resident, so my chances of getting into Penn State and Drexel will be greater. However, they strongly encourage genetics, and if the other applicants have genetics, and i don't, that may be bad for my applications there, and since there's 5 allopathic med schools in PA, that's already 40 percent of the schools that I may lower my chances of getting into since I didn't take genetics. Is this an unecessary worry? I have heard many differing opinions on "highly recommended" courses (note that this is also slightly going off of the assumption of doing a psych major and bio minor - for the minor i would probably do biochem, evo, and upper level courses in nb, so no genetics)

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Take it if you want. It's just a 5-credit course. Even if you get a B in it, it's not going to affect your overall GPA that much. I don't think most med school applicants have taken genetics though.</p>

<p>
[quote]
QUESTIONS: This also brings me to another question on genetics - would it be fine to take it say, spring semester senior year - and tell med schools that I will eventually be taking it as a requirement for the bio major, or would that be the equivalent of not having the "highly recommended" course done and look bad anyway - and again, this is specifically for schools that request a course like genetics.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Absolutely fine. The requirement is that you finish certain courses before matriculation, not application. You can even take orgo or physics senior year (I wouldn't advise it since you need them for the MCAT). On your AMCAS, you can list future courses that you plan to take.</p>

4

<p>Wow.......</p>

5

<p>Lol, I did a fruit fly lab for my high school lab. The process for this one looks about 10x worse X_X</p>

6

<p>I think you will like NB221. I was an ILR student, and I really enjoyed it. Sherman, Walcott, and Kern Reeve are awesome.</p>

7

<p>I know it's offtopic, but can someone list some courses that you recommand me to take and when to take them if i need to write MCAT and apply for med school</p>

8

<p>Intro bio (Bio 101-104 or 105-106)
Gen chem (Chem 215 or Chem 207-208)
Physics (Physics 101-102 or Physics 207-208)
Organic chem (Chem 357-358 or Chem 359-360)</p>

<p>That's all that's required to do well on the MCAT. If you want to take an additional course, you could take genetics, biochem, or physiology. I personally think all of those topics are covered in depth enough in intro bio for you to get a good score on the MCAT.</p>

9

<p>thx, so you think I can do my MCAT in second year and do well?</p>

10

<p>Well, you wouldn't have finished all those courses in 1 year so you won't be ready to take it in your second year. But, you can certainly complete those courses in your first two years and then take the MCAT in the summer after your second year. That's what I did. The last two years of Cornell was so stress-free for me because I was able to get the MCAT done so early.</p>