<p>I have already addressed the concern of self-selection. I do not believe it renders the data useless.</p>
<p>Silverturtle, I would love it if you could compile something like UPenn, NYU, Duke, Harvard – high up colleges… etc.</p>
<p>I’m working on Yale SCEA. I’ll post it tonight.</p>
<p>Alright here they are. This one took me awhile, but I think the information in here is important to those deciding whether to apply to Yale SCEA next year.</p>
<p>Analysis of Race, GPA, and SAT in Admissions </p>
<p>Yale SCEA
I have now taken stock of all the GPA’s and SAT scores of those who posted on the Yale SCEA Thread. I thought it might be interesting to future applicants to see the results. Below is some information about how I gathered the data.</p>
<ul>
<li>All GPA’s given are unweighted. </li>
<li>When GPA was not given, class rank was used.</li>
<li>SAT scores may be superscored.</li>
<li>ACT scores were converted using this chart: SAT-ACT Conversion chart.</li>
<li>I have decided to include the total of the three highest SAT Subject Tests scores for each applicant who posted them. A 1.5 multiplier was applied to those who only posted two subject test scores.
Overall Results</li>
</ul>
<p>Total Applicants: 148
Number Accepted (Percent): 41 (27.7%)
Number Deferred (Percent): 79 (56.0%)
Number Rejected (Percent): 28 (19.9%)</p>
<p>Contrast the above with the fact that Yale’s acceptance rate for all applicants was 13.4 percent. This indicates both the self-selecting nature of the posters and the difference in the quality of the average applicant who posts on College Confidential.</p>
<p>Asian Applicants</p>
<p>Applicants: 58
Number Accepted (Percent): 17 (29.3%)
Number Deferred (Percent): 5 (49.3%)
Number Rejected (Percent): 13 (22.4%)</p>
<p>Asian Applicants Sorted by SAT Scores in Descending Order</p>
<p>Accepted (Average SAT: 2347, Average GPA (When given): 3.98, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2356)
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2390 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2380 Subject Test Total
2380 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2310 Subject Test Total
2360 SAT, 3.96 GPA, 2340 Subject Test Total
2350 SAT, 3.96 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2350 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2280 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 3.91 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2330 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2310 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2310 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2310 SAT, 3.96 GPA, 2290 Subject Test Total
2280 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2350 Subject Test Total
2270 SAT, 3.92 GPA, 2230 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Deferred (Average SAT: 2309, Average GPA (When given): 3.96, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2288)
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2340 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 3.99 GPA, 2350 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 3.98 GPA, 2350 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 3.83 GPA, 2240 Subject Test Total
2390 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2260 Subject Test Total
2380 SAT, 3.97 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2380 SAT, 3.94 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2270 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 3.98 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2330 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2320 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total
2310 SAT, 3.92 GPA, 2280 Subject Test Total
2300 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2070 Subject Test Total
2270 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2280 Subject Test Total
2270 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2290 Subject Test Total
2260 SAT, 3.98 GPA, 2160 Subject Test Total
2240 SAT, 3.83 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total
2230 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2230 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2380 Subject Test Total
2230 SAT, 3.90 GPA, 2090 Subject Test Total
2220 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2210 Subject Test Total
2200 SAT, 3.82 GPA, 2310 Subject Test Total
2150 SAT, 3.97 GPA, 2250 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Rejected (Average SAT: 2240, Average GPA (When given): 3.88, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2275)
2400 SAT, 3.87 GPA, 2260 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 3.99 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 3.99 GPA, 2320 Subject Test Total
2320 SAT, 3.97 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2300 SAT, 3.91 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2260 SAT, 3.80 GPA, 2150 Subject Test Total
2250 SAT, 3.80 GPA, 2190 Subject Test Total
2240 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2210 SAT, 3.80 GPA, 2210 Subject Test Total
2200 SAT, 3.84 GPA, 2370 Subject Test Total
2090 SAT, 3.90 GPA, 2210 Subject Test Total
2030 SAT, 2250 Subject Test Total
2010 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2130 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>The data suggest that only applicants with extremely high scores are accepted during early admission. All but two of the seventeen that were accepted had SAT 1 scores above 2300. None of the Asian applicants who had a GPA of 3.90 or lower were accepted. Over half of those accepted had 4.00 GPAs. </p>
<p>The lowest GPA of any applicant not rejected was 3.82. Only one applicant with an SAT 1 score under 2200 was not rejected (2150). Two applicants were deferred with Subject Test totals below 2100 (2090 and 2070). </p>
<p>Ultra-high SAT 1 scores proved insufficient to gain an applicant admission, but they do appear to have helped in keeping applicants off the rejection list. Only one of the fifteen applicants with an SAT 1 score over 2370 was rejected. It is a similar story for perfect GPAs: only one of the 23 applicants with 4.0 GPAs was rejected.</p>
<p>White Applicants</p>
<p>Applicants: 52
Number Accepted (Percent): 16 (30.7%)
Number Deferred (Percent): 31 (59.6%)
Number Rejected (Percent): 8 (15.4%)</p>
<p>White Applicants Sorted by SAT Scores in Descending Order</p>
<p>Accepted (Average SAT: 2353, Average GPA (When given): 3.98, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2333)
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2390 SAT, 3.80 GPA, 2380 Subject Test Total
2390 SAT, 3.99 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2380 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2290 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 3.97 GPA, 2340 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2210 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2320 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2360 Subject Test Total
2320 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2360 Subject Test Total
2320 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2240 Subject Test Total
2310 SAT, 3.90 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2280 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2310 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Deferred (Average SAT: 2209, Average GPA (When given): 3.93, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2277)
2400 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2370 Subject Test Total
2390 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2350 Subject Test Total
2390 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 3.96 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total
2370 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2270 Subject Test Total
2350 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2340 Subject Test Total
2350 SAT, 3.65 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2350 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2370 Subject Test Total
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2340 Subject Test Total
2320 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total
2310 SAT, 3.80 GPA, 2390 Subject Test Total
2300 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2370 Subject Test Total
2300 SAT, 3.89 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total
2300 SAT, 3.90 GPA, 2350 Subject Test Total
2270 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2360 Subject Test Total
2280 SAT, 3.60 GPA, 2170 Subject Test Total
2260 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2260 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total
2260 SAT, 3.93 GPA, 2270 Subject Test Total
2250 SAT, 3.80 GPA
2250 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2300 Subject Test Total
2240 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2140 Subject Test Total
2230 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2350 Subject Test Total
2210 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2150 Subject Test Total
2190 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2220 Subject Test Total
2180 SAT, 3.99 GPA, 2320 Subject Test Total
2160 SAT, 3.94 GPA, 2030 Subject Test Total
2110 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2030 Subject Test Total
2090 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2160 Subject Test Total
1990 SAT, 2/120 Class Rank</p>
<p>Rejected (Average SAT: 2174, Average GPA (When given): 3.90, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2184)
2310 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2190 Subject Test Total
2260 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2040 Subject Test Total
2190 SAT, 3.94 GPA
2190 SAT, 3.98 GPA, 2250 Subject Test Total
2180 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total
2140 SAT, 3.98 GPA
2060 SAT, 3.69 GPA
2060 SAT, 3.94 GPA, 2240 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Three quarters of the white applicants who were accepted had 4.0 GPAs. Again, no un-hooked applicant with a GPA below 3.90 was accepted (the applicant with a 3.80 was a recruited athlete). All but one (2280) of those accepted had SAT scores over 2300, with the median accepted SAT score being 2360. No applicant was accepted with a Subject Test total of 2200 or below.</p>
<p>African American Applicants</p>
<p>Applicants: 8
Number Accepted (Percent): 4 (50.0%)
Number Deferred (Percent): 4 (50.0%)
Number Rejected (Percent): 0 (0.0%)</p>
<p>African American Applicants Sorted by SAT Scores in Descending Order</p>
<p>Accepted (Average SAT: 2083, Average GPA (When given): 3.76, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2185)
2230 SAT, 3.95 GPA, 2250 Subject Test Total
2170 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2250 Subject Test Total
1980 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2040 Subject Test Total
1950 SAT, 3.10 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Deferred (Average SAT: 2133, Average GPA (When given): 3.75, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2106)
2340 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2240 Subject Test Total
2070 SAT, 3.60 GPA, 1950 Subject Test Total
2070 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 1910 Subject Test Total
2050 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2320 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Given the similarity between those accepted and deferred, it is likely that subjective factors are making the difference here. Unlike in the case for Asians and whites, the scores do not differ greatly between those accepted and those deferred. </p>
<p>Hispanic Applicants</p>
<p>Applicants: 6
Number Accepted (Percent): 3 (50.0%)
Number Deferred (Percent): 1 (16.7%)
Number Rejected (Percent): 2 (33.3%)</p>
<p>Hispanic Applicants Sorted by SAT Scores in Descending Order</p>
<p>Accepted (Average SAT: 2243, Average GPA (When given): 4.00, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2287)
2360 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2250 Subject Test Total
2010 SAT, 12/473 Class Rank, 2220 Subject Test Total
2360 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2330 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Deferred (Average SAT: 2210, Average GPA (When given): 4.00, Average Subject Test Score Total: 1935)
2210 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 1935 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Rejected (Average SAT: 2280, Average GPA (When given): 3.85, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2340)
2340 SAT, 4.00 GPA, 2400 Subject Test Total (Had no community service on application)
2200 SAT, 3.70 GPA, 2280 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Native American Applicants</p>
<p>Applicants: 2
Number Accepted (Percent): 1 (50.0%)
Number Deferred (Percent): 1 (50.0%)
Number Rejected (Percent): 0 (0.0%)</p>
<p>Native American Applicants Sorted by SAT Scores in Descending Order</p>
<p>Accepted (Average SAT: 2220, Average GPA (When given): 4.00, Average Subject Test Score Total: No data)
2220 SAT, 4.00 GPA</p>
<p>Deferred (Average SAT: 2220, Average GPA (When given): 3.75, Average Subject Test Score Total: 2200)
2220 SAT, 3.75 GPA, 2200 Subject Test Total</p>
<p>Conclusions
If youre hookless and want to get accepted SCEA to Yale next year, you are going to need outstanding stats (as well as exceptional subjective elements, but thats not what this analysis is about). The data indicate that only three of the 32 unhooked applicants had SAT 1 scores below 2310. The lowest score of any white or Asian applicant who was accepted was 2270. Furthermore, none of the unhooked applicants were accepted without having at least a 3.90 unweighted GPA. The majority of those accepted early without a hook had a 4.0 GPA and an SAT 1 score of at least 2350. </p>
<p>If you arent hooked and dont have at least a 2200 on the Subject Tests, a 2250+ on the SAT 1, and a 3.90+ GPA, your early admission application might be better spent on schools that are not as competitive. </p>
<p>Interpret these data as you want. I hope everyone finds this useful and/or interesting!</p>
<p>Thanks for running down the numbers and the analysis. I definitely find it interesting.</p>
<p>Thanks again silverturtle! :)</p>
<p>What is a “hook” though?</p>
<p>A hook is something (usually inherent) that gives an applicant a significant advantage. Generally, hooks are being an under-represented minority (African American, Hispanic, or Native American), being the first in your family to attend college, having a legacy who attended the college, or being a recruited athlete.</p>
<p>Thanks for compiling these numbers. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Above are the numbers recentered around the Whites average. The ratios are roughly in line with the regressions in the Princeton study (Espenshade & Chung) that quantified admissions preferences in SAT points on a 1600 scale. Asian was about -50 with Hispanic and Black effects about 3-4 times higher in the positive direction. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>The sample is small but this is, qualitatively, exactly what one would expect. The colleges are trying to simultaneously satisfy a lot of constraints, but (except for Harvard) their RD yields are too low to have control over who enrolls. Those that have ED will therefore be under pressure to lock in as many multiple-constraint and specialized hooks as possible (a black woman recruited for girls’ basketball and majoring in engineering) in the first round, because it frees up the selection in the regular round. In the waitlist, they have the least control over enrollment, and the hooks are mostly allocated already and the optimization problem hard to solve. Therefore, in the waitlist they need people who are reliable bets academically, so it stands to reason that the WL should be a high testing, high GPA, score-driven pool compared to ED/RD where hooks are influential.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>What’s not valid is to claim that a mistake exists without disclosing what (you claim) the error is. What, exactly, is the problem you say exists? It’s not enough to just mention statistics buzzwords at the high school AP level, such as “sample size” or “self-selection”. As silverturtle mentioned, such concerns do not render the data meaningless, and one would have to make a more specific argument against what was posted — invalid <em>for what purpose</em>, and why?</p>
<p>Oh boy, it will be community college for him/her.</p>
<p>There’s only like 200 or so perfect scorers, even less with a 4.0, and even less URMs. Test scores aren’t everything though - you need the other parts of your app too.</p>
<p><a href=“http://professionals.collegeboard.com/profdownload/sat_percentile_ranks_2008_composite_cr_m_w.pdf[/url]”>Higher Education Professionals | College Board;
<p>Interesting, that with many more women taking the test than men, it is only at the 91 percentile that more women score higher on the SAT then men.</p>
<p>An URM with a 2400 on the SAT and a 4.0 is certainly very rare. In fact, it’s very rare for any applicant to have such scores. </p>
<p>If the URM applicant’s application is weak in most other areas, however, the scores won’t compensate sufficiently.</p>
<p>There was an URM applicant last admissions season (he was included in the analysis) who had an excellent SAT 1 score (2340), a 4.0 unweighted GPA, and 800’s on all his subject tests. He also had several leadership positions.</p>
<p>However, what would otherwise have been an outstanding application was fatally marred by the lack of community service. The applicant was rejected during Yale SCEA.</p>
<p>re: #706,</p>
<p>The gender pattern seen in IQ tests is also present in SAT. Women outscore men on verbal measures and men outscore women on spatial/mathematical reasoning throughout most of the range, but at the highest percentiles, men predominate on both measures. The usual description of this in terms of the score distributions is that it’s a result of a lower mean and higher variance in the male distribution of verbal scores, and both a higher mean and a higher variance on the spatial scores.</p>
<p>
Was this that guy that was worried about being Jewish and Hispanic?</p>